"There's nothing to eat in this house!" - DS17 complains

[flow4]

Apparently there is "nothing to eat" and I am "vindicktive" because I won't give DS(17) money for a kebab and I'm "leaving him with no T and in a foul mood". (The swearing and nasty verbal abuse he's given me are evidence of that ).

We have in our cupboards/freezer, right now: pasta (spaghetti, fusilli and macaroni), rice, bread, flour, cereal (tho no milk cos he drank it all), pizza bases, eggs, cheese, tins of beans and tomatoes, veg sausages, veg burgers, onions, courgettes, mushrooms, toms, apples, pears, tinned tuna and sardines... Not to mention the nuts, lentils, chickpeas, etc... And more...

Oh, and I did make tea - a veg/tofu stir-fry with rice - and saved him some although he wasn't home, which he has now eaten...

But he "wants to eat something that doesn't look like it comes out of a rabbit's arse" (i.e. veggie food=rabbit droppings)

He wanted a kebab, bacon, crisps, biscuits, a ready meal... Something junky, basically.

I didn't want to buy him a kebab partly because we have plenty of food in, partly because I think junk food is a waste of money, but largely because he was being rude.

I think he's being unreasonable, probably because he's hungry... But am I also BU not to buy him a kebab? And more generally, AIBU -

• to expect him to make himself something out of what we have in the cupboards?
• not to keep a constant supply of snacks/junk food in the house?
• to expect him to be polite when he asks me for money, even if he's hungry?

If you want to eat tofu every single day then that is all well and good but a lot of people get bored eating the same thing every day even if it's prepared in different ways. And again, tofu, while providing all 9 amino acids, has non-heme iron. The iron in tofu can be absorbed well if combined with Vit C but how practical a prospect is this to a hungry teen who could easily get his or her iron and protein from lean meat?

Well, I'm not a vegetarian.

I used to be and managed just fine without for many years. I just don't understand the assertion that men "need" to eat meat.

Anyway I agree that men need meat (they don't, nobody does - it's a preference) is a red herring.

The issue is the awful behaviour of the teenage son, which has been discussed.

However talking down to the OP, lecturing her on nutrition and suggesting she doesn't parent properly when she explicitly stated she wasn't asking for advice isn't very nice, is it?

It does Iceberg, and quinoa contains all the amino acids too.
Iron absorption is helped by combining it with vit C. Pumpkin seeds have loads of iron. Many other seeds and nuts are also good sources of iron.
Most expert nutritionists eat meat, but only a little and very little red meat as they consider the nutritional disadvantages outwigh the benefits.
"laying down muscle" doesn't require MUCH extra protein - nobody increases their muscle mass by a nutritionally significant amout. Even with hard training which would never be able to add more than 8lbs in year, of which only 22% is protein.
Developing brains require a lot of nutrients too.
"Why would someone suspect their DS would spend money on skunk if they didn't have form"?
Many possible reasons other than already being a habitual user already:
Has a penchant for unhealthy living anyway - alcohol and junk food.
Maybe he has friends who use it and he tends to go along with the crowd,
Maybe he likes to use alcohol as a way of rebelling and skunk would be more effective
The OP has made it very clear that this is not the issue.

Aaargh, I've done it again. I don't agree that men need meat!

(preview you dozy mare, preview).

I think your method, while obviously working great for you math, is not a option most people would choose. I certainly don't know a single person who does that.

My partner has three brothers, who can all eat for England. Should his parents have given them the majority of the food budget directly? Should the largest one get the most, or the skinny one who eats the most? It starts to get ridiculous. I'm glad your method works for you. I suspect it wouldn't for many.

I have a 17 year old (and a 14 year old) and we get through industrial quantities of food. I haven't read all this but based on your original post, YABU. If this page correctly notes that you are vegetarian though, I would let the lad have some budget for some meat or provide some for him if that is what he wants.

married the op does provide meat for him and has shown him how to make some meat dishes

I meant to say YANBU. My apologies. I have only read the first and last and if as moominsarescary points out you provide meat and he can cook it then double, double YANBU. He was rude and apart from that kebabs imo are the spawn of the devil and will neither do him good nutritionally or hygienically.

You have my complete support OP.

I don't know what you mean by 'my method'.
I cook a certain amount of food, aiming for a balance of carbs, protein, veggies. The 3 DDs and I eat and DS eats too (when living here and not away at university). When he goes back I see how much goes in the fridge uneaten and try to remember not to cook so much. When he comes home for the summer and Christmas I double the amount I cook.

What is wrong with cooking enough to feed the whole family? And cooking enough of what I know they will eat? And reducing the amount I cook when one person isn't around? I don't begrudge my children food. It is that last thing I would skimp on, and there have been times when I have had to skimp on plenty.

Chocoluvva, why mention skunk specifically if there has never been an issue with skunk? Why not mention something more generic like pot -- after all the OP used the generic term alcohol? The OP has made it clear that she is being very sensitive about her veggie choice and very defensive about her DS's alleged access to meat. She has also made it clear that she has her head in the sand about the DS's possible skunk problem (or possible emotional problems that might lead to the regular abusive outbursts) and is refusing to countenance any suggestion that this is not about her vegetarianism and a recalcitrant DS who refuses wholesome, nutritious food but about her DS either having something wrong with him due to the properties of skunk (or possibly alcohol) or an emotional problem.

If she didn't want advice related to alcohol or skunk then she probably shouldn't have mentioned it.

Math I think the OP has been very clear on the aim of her post. She was after a reality check as in 'Is this behaviour acceptable?'.
Which it obvioulsy isn't.

We have all agreed on that.

The reason for the angry outbursts are a different issue that the OP hasn't talked about and didn't want any help on. he clearly has some ideas on that, has sought some help and is working on it the best she can. Did she have to post the whole story, back stories etc... before asking 'is this behaviour acceptable?' forget that if we all had to do that we would never get any help at all as all first posts would be pages and pages long...
Sometimes you do forget what is acceptable or not, especially when there are some/other problems around and you a quick reality check. I think the aim has been reached don't you?

Math, I understand that you're really keen to explore my son's psychology and motives, and you're frustrated that I won't, but you are just going to have to live with that. You want to know, but that doesn't mean I have to tell you!

As I have said, I didn't post to ask people why they thought my son behaved the way he did... In fact, I wasn't posting about his behaviour and reactions, but mine! I asked for a quick reality-check: "This has happened, and I'm doing X, Y and Z... Does that sound reasonable?"

Everybody else except you has accepted that, but you are still here poking away demanding that I explain myself further.

Are you aware of how rude you have become? You seem to me to be projecting some of your own issues on to me. You have called me 'controlling' and 'defensive', but that's how you come across to me. Some of the things you say in your last post (telling me I have my 'head in the sand' because I'm 'refusing to countenance' your suggestions) are now not only patronising and wrong, but also insulting. So just stop, please.

math not all teenagers who experiment with weed end up with a habit.

Not all teenagers who kick off do so because they have an addiction or emotional problems.

YANBU in any way. Teenagers do eat a lot at that age and if he's hungry it's unreasonable (in all but the most exceptional budgetary situations) to not have some food in the house but you do so he can grow up and deal with it. It's not unreasonable to expect him to cook (someone said teenagers aren't chefs but he's 17 and boiling pasta isn't high end cuisine and he's 17 not a child) and it's unreasonable of him to expect there to always be meat in the house. Meat is a perfectly good protein, so is eggs, cheese, beans, veg sausages/burgers etc all of which you have. If he's that desperate for a specific type of food he can ask nicely when you do the weekly shop or can go and buy it himself. Sometimes there's something I really fancy, but because constantly popping out to the shop for whatever takes my fancy costs a fortune I do a weekly shop and then make do with what's in the house. I'm sure he can do the same without starving, popping out for the exact food you like is a luxury not a necessity.
On a serious note - give him the list in your second paragraph of foods you have and 2 or 3 easy meals he can make from it. Half the time it's just that they haven't looked properly or can cook but don't yet have the experience to look at a fridge and work out what meals can be made from it.

Dd always asks what's for pudding we always reply yoghurt fruit ice cream etc whatever is around she then scowls. Dh offered to wheel out the desert trolley yesterday

She isn't getting 'defensive' about her vegetarian choices - merely pointing out that the conclusion many people instantly jumped to was wrong. If her experience as a vegetarian is anything at all like mine she'll have had a lifetime of people jumping to conclusions - every ailment I've every had, be it period pain or concussion from an accident or the same cold everyone else in the office has, has been attributed to my diet by someone or other. People who didn't notice the absence of animal products in a food item until I started eating some have gone off that item quickly on realising. My housemate once threw away her toast and made some more because she realised I was using the same margarine as her - she wasn't even under any illusion it was butter, just marg with whey powder rather than without. It gets a bit wearing after a while. Oh, and I was about OP's son's age when dealing with the housemate in question. We lived in a college hostel where two meals a day were included in our fees. We ate what we were given, or took our own wallets down to the chippy to get something else. In vacations I moved back home, where the choices were eat what you're given or make your own (no takeaways in walking distance) - being able to make something was luxury by that point...

I said your method because it is a method. Just a different one to the way the OP approaches it.

OP, for the last time, YANBU! And I think people who have tried to delve into the dynamics of your family uninvited are frankly out of order.

She isn't getting 'defensive' about her vegetarian choices - merely pointing out that the conclusion many people instantly jumped to was wrong.

You mean when her DS said there wasn't anything to eat in the house? You are suggesting he couldn't possibly be tired of tofu based on your own experiences of everything from a winter cough to bad tv reception blamed on vegetarian food. But is it possible he wants a filling dinner that the de facto family cook makes for him, and tofu just isn't cutting it?

If the food isn't the problem Ariel, then could it possibly be the skunk? Because there are parents of teens here who have not experienced the level of vitriol, repeatedly, from their teens.

I said your method because it is a method. Just a different one to the way the OP approaches it.
If my 'method' involves cooking enough food that everyone enjoys then by your definition the OP is not cooking enough and not cooking food that everyone enjoys; inflicting insufficient meals and food people don't want just because you are the cook and you get to decide boils down to a control problem.

And again, if you don't want people's opinions about the cause and possible solution to a problem, don't post about it and mention (1) the sort of meal he didn't want to eat, and (2) skunk and alcohol and your certainty that this is where money would be spent if the DS had his hands on any.

Of course, if you want a bunch of people saying never mind what he has been smoking and never mind that he may feel hungry/have low blood sugar/low iron-anemia, you are clearly The Goodie and he is The Baddie, then only take on board what people are saying if they agree with you but why bother posting in the first place

FWIW, I think the way you reacted to being called a bitch is completely reasonable but thinking withholding lunch money the next day, and hoping it is all over once an apology has been expressed is not. As I posted before, there is clearly something wrong that needs addressing, at a time when everyone is calm and possibly with a third party as mediator.

Throw the kitchen sink at me while you're at it...

OP I haven't read your complete post however please do not call yourself vegetarian if you eat fish. It makes life for vegetarians quite difficult trying to explain that someone got the terminology wrong. You are not a vegetarian.