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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Family member trying to 'get off' drink driving charge.

305 replies

jeezlouize · 09/09/2012 12:03

Namechanged.

My BIL was arrested and charged with drink driving last week. He was 3 times over the limit. There has been much whispering amongst the family since, hearing dribs and drabs about what happened etc but last night everyone got together for a meal at PIL's house. The atmosphere was tense to say the least.
Halfway through the night my FIL (BIL's dad) brought up the subject of the drink driving charge and said he'd like to speak to us all about it as he had something to ask us all.
It turns out BIL has been seeing a lawyer who claims he can 'get him off' with the charge. FIL was asking if we could all chip in financially to pay for this lawyer. It would be about £500 per couple (there are 5 couples in the family).
The reason being, BIL will automatically lose his job if he loses his license. My SIL doesn't work and they have 4dc.
I am very, very angry with BIL, and frankly disgusted at this suggestion about this lawyer. It has caused some tension between me and DH (BIL's brother). This is not about the money, it's about the principle. AIBU in thinking BIL should be punished for what he's done? I'm really agonising over this as I don't want SIL and dcs to suffer.

OP posts:
ShellyBoobs · 09/09/2012 13:26

CailinDana - I'm not defending him!

If he's guilty I would like to see him imprisoned; family or no family. I don't think that driving bans and fines are punishment enough for such a serious and potentially devasting offence.

I just don't like to see people found summarily guilty, as is the case in this thread.

Original poster
jeezlouize · 09/09/2012 13:27

No soozle, we are lucky enough to be in a position to hand over £500 and the extended family knows this.

OP posts:
Cheddars · 09/09/2012 13:27

We all agree that the BIL is in the wrong.

The question is whether the OP should take a moral stand against her husband and her husband's family and refuse to lend the money.

I would express my disapproval but still lend the money. I feel as strongly as the next person about DD but this is about the OP, not the BIL's guilt or lack thereof.

hungoverandembarrassed · 09/09/2012 13:27

Why does the lawyer think he can get him off? If a technicality can genuinely be proven, surely any old legal aid lawyer could get him off? And then his family won't have to be out of pocket for his stupidity.

Numberlock · 09/09/2012 13:28

Gnome Au contraire, the lawyer knows there's reasonable chance it will work. (Perhaps he has had some access to documentation before agreeing to represent?) The high fee is because he knows people will pay a premium for the service. To a footballer, celebrity etc this is nothing in financial terms and these will be the kind of high profile clients he also represents.

noblegiraffe · 09/09/2012 13:28

shelly you said that people shouldn't call BIL despicable as he has yet to be found guilty in court. Which is ridiculous seeing as he's a self-admitted drink driver.

Some drink drivers never even get caught. They are still despicable.

Original poster
jeezlouize · 09/09/2012 13:29

This man is apparently a professional drink driving lawyer (I didn't know such a thing exited tbh). He has managed to get a friend of FIL's exonerated in the past. Allegedly.

OP posts:
maddening · 09/09/2012 13:30

Yanbu I would not pay up either - fil can go and get it out on credit and charge bil the interest.

I would be v disappointed with dh for his attitude too.

GnomeDePlume · 09/09/2012 13:31

I really think that £500 will only be the start of it. That will get the lawyer to look at the case then there will be more money for X and on it will go.

The family pressure will build to keep putting your hand in your pocket.

hungoverandembarrassed · 09/09/2012 13:31

Sounds like a lovely chap. Wonder how he sleeps at night.

noblegiraffe · 09/09/2012 13:32

Would you pay up if he had hit somebody? If not, why would this be any different?

EdMcDunnough · 09/09/2012 13:33

shelly if he isn't then it's a whole different ball game. What we're dealing with is a question that rests entirely on what this family is considering in order to get him off on the premise that he is guilty.

That needs to be discussed - and if it's not the case, or if we can't discuss it as though it is potentially the case, then there is no thread and no help for the OP.

EdMcDunnough · 09/09/2012 13:35

What I mean is, if he's not guilty, the OP doesn't need our help, and if he is, she does.

So what's the point of it, if we can't discuss it on the basis that he is?

GnomeDePlume · 09/09/2012 13:36

OP, I think your 'allegedly' is key here. It is very easy to claim that some scumbag hot shot lawyer got some random off.

bisjaralympics · 09/09/2012 13:37

Solicitor sounds pretty normal to me. He is paid to do a job and that job is to get your BIL off a charge. Morals won't enter into the equation. The amount of money also sounds pretty normal if the solicitor is going to instruct counsel to attend the hearing. He will have to pay a brief fee to counsel and if counsel is senior this will be a hefty amount.

On a personal level I wouldn't contribute. There is no guarantee this was a one off. It is far more likely that this is the first time he got caught. Three times over the limit isn't just misjudging an odd beer it is a significant amount of drinking. If he gets off he will continue his behaviour as before and the consequences next time could be fatal.

Northernlurkerisbackatwork · 09/09/2012 13:39

No way would I pay a penny. Helping his wife and children out is a different issue though. If you have the money spare and she needs it I would give it to her.

He could have killed somebody - with a wife and 4 kids. He should go to prison.

HoratiaWinwood · 09/09/2012 13:40

if you have £500 it would better to give it SIL to help her and the children out later, if they need it

This seems very much more sensible.

I cannot imagine being put in this position. I know some people think it reasonable to ask other people to take their points, for example, but I absolutely do not. I'm not sure I'd even have been able to sit round a table with someone who was trying to get off a drink driving charge when he had, erm, driven very drunk.

The inlaws aren't the problem. Your husband is the problem.

Cheddars · 09/09/2012 13:43

So what is the likely fall out for the OP if she refuses to pay?

Will it cause massive problems with your DH Jeezlouize

Laquitar · 09/09/2012 13:43

You said that you don't want his wife to suffer. Personally, i would suffer more if he got away because i would be scared that he will do it again and kill himself and others. I would worry every single day.

I suspect that his wife is fed up with it but she doesn't have a say (maybe she is told to behave herself too Hmm). So, i don't really think you are helping his wife if you give the money.

He didn't even asked for the money himself! His dad does! Your fil should step back and let his sons grow up imo. And its very unfair to put the rest of you in this situation, i bet the other couples had an argument too.

ReindeersGoldenBollocks · 09/09/2012 13:43

It's not that Nick something or other (the lawyer I mean).

A good Legal Aid lawyer would find any technicality or mitigate for your brother. However for offences of drink driving it is normal to receive a mandatory ban, unless in exceptional circumstances (which it doesn't sound like your BIL has).

A technicality would be the only possibility of getting the case dropped completely and that is relying on the police not to have followed PACE to the letter, which is uncommon for police to do.

There are no guarantees that this lawyer will get your BIL off which means that he would lose his job, having paid out that money, then with no form of income to pay you back. I'd want a hell of a lot more security than just his word tbh.

Borntobeamum · 09/09/2012 13:44

In my opinion, if you hand over the cash you're condoning what he's done. He should accept what he did was very wrong, and be embarrassed and apologetic.

Original poster
jeezlouize · 09/09/2012 13:46

It's already causing problems. We went to bed in disagreement last night and haven't spoken this morning. You could cut the atmosphere with a knife. I suspect that DH will want to hand over the money, he has alluded to this and to be frank, there's not much I can do to stop him. I'm dreadfully upset that the man I love, the father of my kids is not singing from the same hymn sheet as me on this. He is in agreement that what he did was wrong, but he says the bottom line is if he can help his brother in any way, he will.

OP posts:
maytheoddsbeeverinyourfavour · 09/09/2012 13:46

Well taking the whole drink driving aspect away for a minute, I would still say no because money/family/lending just don't mix

If it doesn't work and he is found guilty and loses his job then how is he going to pay you back?

And as he seems to be above rules anyway even if he gets off he might refuse to pay you back

The whole thing is a sordid nasty mess and the best thing you can possibly do is stay as far away from it all as possible

FeersumEndjinn · 09/09/2012 13:47

I'm with Northernlurker and Horatia - BIL should face the music and if he's guilty and his job is such that he would lose it then it's best he doesn't have that job if he is irresponsible in combining drinking and driving. Be more than willing to contribute £500 towards him retraining for a new career once this has been resolved, but don't contribute towards him escaping justice if he did it.

EdMcDunnough · 09/09/2012 13:49

I think your DH has got some distorted ideas of helping...it's not helping, it's enabling.

It's just the same as buying an alcoholic a drink. Or scoring drugs for an addict, just because they are related to you.

It doesn't help anyone.

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