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Original poster

To insist on abstinence until DH has a vasectomy?

473 replies

Peachesinthesummertime · 26/08/2012 18:57

We have 3 DCs, youngest is 2 months old, so frankly abstinence is quite easy to insist on at the moment but I assume that will change at some point in the future.

In the past I've used the pill for contraception but no longer want to because of increased breast cancer risk and my family history. I've also used condoms a lot in the past but no longer want to rely on this as the sole method of contraception. I've experienced several incidents in the past of condoms splitting and I really, really don't want any more kids / to take any risks. (DC3 was unplanned...)

DH insists (and has always insisted) that he will not have a vasectomy under any circumstances. He won't really discuss this at all so he hasn't given any reasons for this, just a total flat refusal.

I feel really hacked off about this. I've been through the mill physically and emotionally with 3 pregnancies in 5 years. I don't want my body to be the one that has to suffer for contraception. I don't want to have implants or chemicals or the coil (I heard it can cause heavier periods). I'm fed up with my body being the one to suffer all the time. Why can DH not make the sacrifice for once? I know a vasectomy is not fun but surely it's a walk in the park compared to the discomfort and pain of pregnancy, childbirth and breastfeeding?

So we're at a standstill. He won't change his mind. Neither will I. Any suggestions on how to resolve?

OP posts:
Zhx3 · 26/08/2012 22:09

Realise that is not hoop title reads, but this is how I interpret it as we've moved through the thread.

procrastinor · 26/08/2012 22:09

If the dh is shit scared I think the least he could do is explain that. I think sterilisation is a very final choice for a family and I would understand if my dh was just plain ol scared. But I think the crux of the problem is his lack of desire to explain to his wife why he doesn't want a vasectomy.

If the OP had come on and said that her dh was scared of hospitals/medical procedures or didn't want it to be so final, I'd have said that she'd just have to suck it up and carry on with the contraceptive choices left to them. But it's his seeming lack of any idea of this being a shared responsibility and hence something to be discussed that rankles me.

NovackNGood · 26/08/2012 22:10

In which case neither should he.

WorraLiberty · 26/08/2012 22:10

Perhaps the OP was shit scared of all the medical procedures associated with pregnancy too? Didn't get the choice to avoid them though when an unwanted pregnancy occurred

Again it's not a competition.

And I wouldn't have thought anyone who was that shit scared would have given birth 3 times.

Honestly, there's far more sympathy on this board for posters who are scared of spiders than there are for men who are scared of invasive surgery at times.

BoneyBackJefferson · 26/08/2012 22:10

Inertia
"TBH, I'm stunned at the attitude that the woman has to either take full responsibility for contraception or get sterilised, because her husband has sexual rights over her body that she cannot take away from him."

Nobody has said that "her husband has sexual rights over her body" infact quite the opposite.

Inertia · 26/08/2012 22:11

On a more helpful note Peaches- could you try charting temperatures/CF to pinpoint your least fertile times, and consider sex / PIV sex with a condom as back-up in those least fertile times? It's pretty straightforward to record on an online phone app these days.

Obviously this applies only if you actually want to continue to have sex with your husband.

BalloonSlayer · 26/08/2012 22:12

Sorry Hmm had too much wine to get what you've said.

Kayano's post said that a man who threatened to withhold sex from his wife until she got herself sterilised would be called emotionally abusive.

I said, essentially, that a man who threatened to withhold sex from his wife until she got herself sterilised cannot be compared with a woman who threatened to withhold sex from her husband until he got himself sterilised for the simple reason that the WOMAN is protecting herself something that happens to her and her body, whereas the MAN is protecting himself from, well from what? Something that happens to someone else's body, basically. I can't see how anyone could see the two scenarios as the same. Of course they are similar, but not the same.

If a couple got married, and he said "I really really want to have 4 children," and she said "OK darling" then after two she said, "I'm knackered, I don't want any more," and he said "Well I still want 4, I've always been open about that, I will do my bit looking after them" and she said "No I don't want any more, will you have the snip?" and he said "No I don't want to do that" then I would be a bit more sympathetic to him. But not very much.

pumpkinsweetie · 26/08/2012 22:12

A vascetomy is much more straightforward than a female sterilisation and if op & her dh have jointly agreed to wanting no more babies one of them needs to decide on a permanent contraception method so as not to risk any further pregnancies.
Instead of refraining from sex you need to discuss your options further, maybe he needs some time to decide. In the time being he must put something on the end of itGrin

BoneyBackJefferson · 26/08/2012 22:13

24Hours
"Boney back - process f elimination, rose are the options left. Fair doesn't come into it.
Female sterilization. A big procedure( disregarding previous pgs )
Male sterilization - much more straightforward.
Abstinence - unpleasant for both, but effective."

Or the marriage breaksdown and they go there separate way, equally effective.

NovackNGood · 26/08/2012 22:13

Would the OP want more children with another man if she left her husband. Probably not.

Would the husband perhaps have more children if he started a new family with a new partner. Possibly yes.

Do 50 % of marriages end in divorce...yes.

So logic says he would not go through with sterilization if he was being sensible let alone being manipulated into it.

Original poster
Peachesinthesummertime · 26/08/2012 22:14

Wow. I am quite shocked by some of the responses. Certainly given me food for thought.

I am really pretty sure that DH wouldn't leave me just because of no shags. He loves me, I love him, we both love our kids. Our relationship is about MUCH more than just penetrative sex.

I am genuinely grateful for some of the more constructive suggestions on here (ie go to family planning clinic together) and am hopeful we can find a mutually acceptable solution once we've properly discussed things. Taking on board some of your advice, I will approach DH more sympathetically and less aggressively.

But I am not prepared to take any risks of getting pregnant.

OP posts:
Kayano · 26/08/2012 22:15

Worra agreed.

I haven't hung clothes outside since spidergate 2007 Grin

OneMoreChap · 26/08/2012 22:15

pumpkinsweetie Sun 26-Aug-12 22:12:52
In the time being he must put something on the end of it

OP declines that.

MrMiyagi · 26/08/2012 22:18

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by Mumsnet for breaking our Talk Guidelines. Replies may also be deleted.

MrMiyagi · 26/08/2012 22:18

Husband

OneMoreChap · 26/08/2012 22:19

Peachesinthesummertime

Good luck!

I think some of the Hmm was about the tone, and the Abstinence title.
Personally, you refusing PIV seems completely - well fairly - reasonable. The alternatives did get drip-fed in later.

From what you say about your libido, the matter will be in his own hands for a while, anyway.

Inertia · 26/08/2012 22:19

It has been suggested that it would be emotionally abusive of OP to withhold sex, and that forcing abstinence on her husband is controlling and abusive. Both those comments suggest to me that the poster believes that the man has right to expect sex, and that the woman would be in the wrong to deny it.

LindyHemming · 26/08/2012 22:22

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Zhx3 · 26/08/2012 22:22

I hope it works out well for you OP :).

Great to hear your dh loves you and the dcs and wouldn't leave due to no shags. Hope the joint family planning goes well.

Mabelface · 26/08/2012 22:22

Would the mirena be an option? I don't have periods on it and it is supposedly as effective as sterilisation. Works for this uber fertile woman, anyway!

Inertia · 26/08/2012 22:24

I have every sympathy for men who are scared of invasive surgery, and I agree that the OP cannot insist on her DH having surgery. What I don't have sympathy for is the notion that a man gets to avoid taking control of his own fertility, and gets to dictate what contraception is acceptable for his partner to use , and has the right to expect either PIV sex on demand or to shag about elsewhere. That's not what marriage is meant to be about.

OneMoreChap · 26/08/2012 22:24

Inertia Sun 26-Aug-12 22:19:25
It has been suggested that it would be emotionally abusive of OP to withhold sex, and that forcing abstinence on her husband is controlling and abusive. Both those comments suggest to me that the poster believes that the man has right to expect sex, and that the woman would be in the wrong to deny it.

I think you are fighting a battle that isn't there, but I'm game.

If a husband withheld sex, could that be emotionally abusive?
If a husband forced abstinence on his wife could that be controlling or abusive?

Does a woman in a marriage have a right to expect sex?

If yes, OP could be either of those things.
Withholding sex might well be controlling or abusive.

It now transpires that wasn't what OP was talking about - she was talking about one sort of sexual activity, which is why I think you battle a chimera.

Inertia · 26/08/2012 22:24

Sorry, lots of cross-posts.

CouthyMow · 26/08/2012 22:26

Novack - is it still 'forcing abstinence' if you are not turned on enough to have sex with someone when you are scared of an unwanted pregnancy? I don't see refusing sex when not turned on as an ultimatum. I see not having sex when I am not turned on as my right. If my partner expected to 'use' my body for penetrative sex when I wasn't turned on, I would class that as rape.

And while I am scared of unwanted pregnancy, I am unable to get turned on. Simple as.

If my partner then went elsewhere for sex whilst still in a relationship with me, due to me not having sex with him, that would be CHEATING.

If he wants to go elsewhere for sex, I would expect him to end our relationship first.

I would be prepared to go to counselling with my partner if they were unhappy with me abstaining, to explain to them that to me, having sex when I am not turned on is NOT something I would ever consent to, and I would see it as rape. I cannot be turned on whilst fearing pregnancy, therefore his expectation of sex would mean, to me, that he was willing to cheat on me to get that sex (not acceptable behaviour to me), or to have sex with me when I do not consent (rape, to me).

WorraLiberty · 26/08/2012 22:27

I am really pretty sure that DH wouldn't leave me just because of no shags. He loves me, I love him, we both love our kids. Our relationship is about MUCH more than just penetrative sex

How old are you both?

It's one thing being pretty sure now, but if you're thinking of forcing your DH into celibacy forever unless he agrees to invasive surgery...then he just might re-evaluate things.

One possible outcome is that he agrees to your demand

Another possible outcome is that he sees you as EA and manipulative and decides to leave.

Not 'just because of no shags'