To call immigration about my visitors?

[Migsy1]

I feel terrible about this and I don't know if I am being harsh or whether I should follow my instincts and get away from this situation.

I was involved in a school exchange in Spain a couple of years ago. I decided to go back there at the beginning of this month for a holiday with my 3 children. The holiday was arranged by me and a couple of days before I went I contacted a family that I had been paired with on my original visit to say that we were coming over and it might be nice to meet up sometime if they were going to be available.

The woman in the family, who is originally from South America, invited us over for lots of meals which I felt very uncomfortable about as I really wanted some space with my kids. It felt overbearing but I did not wish to offend and I realise that the Spanish culture if different to mine. I visited their home for dinner more than I wanted to to initially but at first I thought the woman was being altruistic and kind.
I told her that her son was welcome to visit us for a week in the summer to improve his English.

As the week progressed I found out that the family was having difficulty finding work and want to emigrate to the UK. The woman asked could she and her son could come over for a week at the end of this month to stay with me to see what the UK is like. I reluctantly agreed and she booked the flights before I could email her to put her off. She is due to arrive next week and has made it clear that she is bringing her CV and wants me to help her find work and possibly accommodation. She also wants to use my address to demonstrate to border control that she is only coming here to visit friends.

She has no entitlement to live or work in the UK. I feel that her hospitality in Spain was used to take advantage of me so that I could be a portal for her to enter the UK illegally. I am worried that she might try to stay longer in my home than the agreed week, especially if she cannot find accommodation. Her non-English speaking husband and his South American friend actually suggested that they live in my house and refurbish it in return whilst they look for building work in the UK!

Am I right to be freaked out by this? Do you think I should just call immigration and tell them of her true intentions so that they are not let into the country? I am worried that I am being dragged into something complicated, that as a single mum with 3 kids, I can well do without. I am seriously stressed by this!

Complete hysteria. Carrying a CV is not an offense. She doesn't have interviews lined up. She is visting a new country and sussing out job opportunities. So if she spends time reading the Guardian section of vacancies instead of standing outside Buckingham Palace, she is somehow breaking the law?

You have to be a loony to think that there is something wrong with that.

Flatbread - its not xenophobic hysteria to advise the OP to wary about allowing a potential overstayer / illegal worker to use her details.

I sponsor some of my DH's relatives to visit and I am wary about sponsoring anyone whose actions I can't control because if they don't comply with their visa then I might not be able to sponsor any more of DH's family when they want to come.

Additionally, unless she has a specialist skill set how likely is it that anyone will sponsor her to work. I thought the criteria for getting visas for non-EU workers were incredibly strict now.

If you feel so guilty, just invite her around for a few meals like she did with you. Then you are even. But you have no obligation to let her stay in your house.

Chaz, , OP invited the woman over. Now she is being selfish and doesn't want to make the effort to return the hospitality which she took, when she visited. So suddenly it becomes an immigration issue?

This thread shows some of the nasty xenophobic nonsense attitude that some of us have. No one knows if a guest will overstay or be a pain in the butt. They don't have to be suspicious furriners for that.

I have had loads of people from abroad stay with us, some pen pals who we were meeting for the first time. Would never strike me to think that they were criminals till proven innocent, just because they were foreign

Flatbread - she didn't invite the woman over. She invited her son over then the woman said she wanted to come too and she wanted the OP to help her find work.

Given that the woman has no entitlement to work in the UK I think it is a reasonable assumption that she won't be playing by the rules.

Flatbread - "Now she is being selfish and doesn't want to make the effort to return the hospitality which she took, when she visited. So suddenly it becomes an immigration issue?"

The only hospitality she took was going around the the woman's house for a few meals. She wasn't staying in the woman's house. Yes, OP was silly to suggest she could stay with her whilst visiting London but she doesn't owe her anything except possibly a few invites for dinner a few times during the week (and since when did someone offering another person hospitality mean the other person has to reciprocate)?

Flatbread You call me a "selfish git" for accepting a few meals and not wanting to return the favour. I don't think a few meals is the equivalent of a week's free board and lodgings and transfers from the airport in order to facilitate her finding work in the UK. If she was coming to visit me as a TRUE friend I would consider it to be a wholly different matter. She is completely using me.

Chez Exactly - No-one will sponsor her to work here. She does not fit the criteria.

Orphelia I don't know, but I do not think they can afford a hotel. I think it would be all or nothing. But under normal circumstances, that would be an excellent idea. I know that I cannot negotiate with her about what she can/can't have. She doesn't listen. I do feel guilty and I think the best thing would be to send her some money.

Hey, I agree it's loony to care about whether someone looks for a job while visiting. As an immigrant myself I'm very pro-immigration. But UKBA are loons. It's hard to believe how unreasonable they are unless you have firsthand experience of it.

If a non-EU national arrives and says she's visiting a friend, but they search her stuff and find CVs, they are not going to let her in. The technical reason won't be 'looking for work' it will be 'deception'. Basically if you are not upfront about the reason for your visit, it gives them grounds to doubt you will follow the rules and they will not let you in.

I'm not basing this on hysteria, these things actually happen when you're non-EU. I'm not making this up.

Don't send her any money!

This is ridiculous. The hysteria over her intentions, the fear she will move in/not leave/leave her son behind, and so on. None of this is likely.

It is not surprising she is talking about possibly moving to the UK, her country is shot to pieces with mass unemployment, my husband comes from a poor EU country and I don't take offense if people talk about moving to the UK or getting jobs, and we would offer to put them up for a short while IF WE WERE FRIENDS. This is not 'using' someone, it's offering a hand of friendship.

However, here it is clear you are NOT FRIENDS and you feel she has been emotionally manipulative of you, so simply don't have her in your house for that reason and that reason alone. There's no obligation to have people come and stay with you if you don't really like them that much and feel they are slighly using you. So, I would send the email.

But don't send her money, or this will continue. You don't pay people off, you just say 'sorry, you can't stay here, emergency arisen, a cheap B and B is here, we'd love to see you for dinner'.

Petty, selfish people have a wonderful way of turning everything they grab from others as doing someone else a favour. Oh, he/she forced me to accept meals, money, accomodation or whatever else they have taken. And then when it comes to giving back, there is always an excuse not to do it... He/she is pushy, I don't have time, I can't trust them etc.

This is basically the situation here. The immigration stuff is laughable and a red herring. The woman might want to look for a job in UK and is coming to get a feel of the country and the labour market. Nought wrong with that except for hysterical zenophobes.

and since when did someone offering another person hospitality mean the other person has to reciprocate?
Err, since we started to live in societies and behave in a civilised way. Decency and reciprocity are pretty standard norms in all cultures, you know.

I agree that OP didn't need to invite to woman to stay. Having her over for meals would have been fine. But to turn this into an immigration issue? Words fail me at some people's sense of self righteousness and idiocy...

"It is very difficult to say "no" when you are sitting at someone's table eating a lovely meal that has been cooked for you. I planned to email her on my return to make an excuse"

Nice.

OP - you clearly don't want this family staying - it's your home, & you feel uncomfortable about the idea now.
They sound as if they are taking advantage of you for their own motives - whatever those motives may be.

DON'T call immigration - no need to. Plus immigration have a bad reputation for a reason.

Phone the family from Spain TODAY & say that they cannot stay with you.
Give no reason - you hardly know them, so you owe them no explaination. Be very firm. Do not apologise (even if they cry / seem distressed).
Do not get drawn into conversation - tell them they cannot stay then end the call.
(DON'T feel guilty - they can cancel their flights / book B&B or even a hostel - if they can afford flights then they can afford cheap rooms for a few nights).
Do not arrange to meet them when they are here - say you will be busy (do not explain why).

If you meet them during their stay then they could successfully take advantage again. You don't need those sort of friends.

When you make the phonecall: Make sure you have a very assertive person stood next to you to help if you have trouble ending the call or find yourself backing down.
This could be a relative, friend, neighbour, even ask one of your childrens' friends' parents. Must be someone who is USED to being assertive - in their job, for example.

Phone this assertive acquaintance; explain the situation. They could even make the call for you.

Learn to be less trusting, more assertive, & less vulnerable in future. It's not easy but you can do it.

PS. do not send them money under any circumstances - really a bad idea!

Latara et al, our advice is falling on deaf ears. I cannot believe this is still being debated. OP for her own reasons doesn't want these people staying, but is refusing to stop dithering, bite the bullet and contact them to say 'NO'. It's pathetic. I'm not a confrontational type, but just how hard is it to email NOW and say its just not convenient anymore?? It's not, but yet OP would rather wax lyrical on here, wringing her hands, umming and ahhing about it.

As for thinking about sending money, what's that saying? 'A fool and her money are soon parted'.....

Just plain bonkers.

dreamingbohemian - exactly

My DH is North African and I know the grief he and his friends have had from the UKBA even though they were legitimately in the country.

And don't get me started on the circle of hell that is Lunar House...

Or maybe I am a hysterical xenophobe ... packs DH's bags because he's forrin!

OP it looks like this woman is very scheming and has taken you for a fool. Don't send her money, she's not your problem. Tell her that you've been called out of town and can no longer see her and have her stay, that way she can't turn up on your doorstep despite you cancelling her.

Of course every border agency has to be vigilant. Certainly I was given a hard time when I visited Venezuela and when DH was travelling to the US just after 911.

But how any of this translates into us, ordinary people being suspicious of guests is beyond me. I don't need to adopt an immigration agency mindset every time I have an international visitor. Their job is to check the paperwork and mine is to provide a bed and entertainment and meals to my guests.

I have to say this is one of the most bizarre threads I have read on MN. Basically, OP is asking - I am too embarrassed to say no to visitors, can I tell UKBA to detain them so I don't have to have them over

Well, OK, I can imagine getting myself into a situation like this. And feeling guilty about saying "no, actually you can't come". It would be great to have a third party do that for you, but calling immigration seems way too extreme in these circumstances.

If you can just say no, so much the better. I admire all those who have no problem in doing that. But I know that I have difficulty in doing this, so if I was you, I would probably invent a reason why they can't come and stay, i.e. family who need to stay at your house in the same week for some important reason, or a stressful but temporary medical condition or whatever. Explain this in an email, and attach details of cheap accommodation in the area like hostels or whatever (you can generally get cheap family rooms in hostels). And then just don't enter into any more discussion about it.

On the other hand...if this really is a family in need, who are in financial difficulties, were nice to you by inviting you to their home, have already spent precious money on air tickets, and trying to find a way out of what is a godawful economic situation (in Spain)...then maybe you should consider trying to find a way to help them. It's hard to say from your posts whether they could be nice and just desperately in need, or are rather just manipulative and have been trying to use you all along. And if you think that maybe they are basically nice people who have been reduced to this state of affairs by the terrible economy in Spain and that they deserve a good turn...maybe they deserve some form of help. It doesn't have to be staying in your house, but maybe you could help her with her CV via email, send her some links to job sites, send her some links to cheap accommodation or house exchange companies etc.

I can't beieve that this is still going on.

Someone way up the thread asked if I would be happy to be in the op's situation? Well no of course not, but then I would never, ever have got myself into such a stupid situation and if for some reason I had I would just ring up and cancel it all. Full stop, end of problem.

The op agreed to something whilst on holiday with the intention of backing out once at home so she basically told a great big lie, the other lady took her on her word and booked the flights probably as quickly as she could so that she could get the best deal.

I don't care what has followed the problem was the op lied and promised something she had no intention of following through on. If she hadn't done that then none of this ridiculous hysteria would be happening.

And now the op is considering sending the woman some money and allow her to stay in her house even though she doesn't want her there and when she is due to be away at an interview. Oh and lets not forget the woman is a mentally unstable member of a cult!!!!

Bloody hell I think Eastenders would even reject this drama!

Member of a cult? I must have missed that post :::goes back to check:::

flatbread you are very naive.

really, several pages back I suggested a white lie that you're mum is staying and so you can't have her to stay - throw in that your mum is ill and that's why she's staying. That explains the short notice, you aren't being a cow and she can still do tourist things if she wants, and it can be nice and open ended 'caring' role for you so can't have her just say she's moved her flights by a fortnight (which if you say you're going away for a week she might do and then you still have the same problem).

The longer you leave it, the harder it will be for her to make alternative plans, do it today.

I've gone through the immigration mill (in Canada, not the UK) and it is bloody awful. Even though I did everything right and am white and English is my first language so I don't even have to deal with the racism and xenophobia other people do I was still made to feel like a liar and slightly dirty. Syphilis test anyone? Call my partner a fake?

Anyone that could consider calling immigration on someone instead of just growing a backbone and saying no, is not a nice person in my book.