to ask if you smack your children?

[toofattorun]

I am not talking beating! Just a smack on the hand or bum when they are being very rude or naughty.

People who don't and can't imagine doing it: do you ever want to? I am quite terrified by some of the stuff that goes through my mind when ds (3.5) is really winding me up, which is about 20 times a day just now. I have smacked, wish I didn't. It doesn't work, apart from anything.

people who don't, and can't imagine ever doing so. what methods of discipline do you employ?

I've never seen how the naughty step is supposed to work unless the child knows that ultimately they will get a smack if they don't stay put.

Constantly taking them back is just a game. DD2s original "crime" was usually wanting to be the centre of attention at an impossible moment. So clearly bouncing on and off the naughty step isn't the answer.

The look of on DFs face when DD went to her room for being a pain with out argument said it all. By that age (4ish) DD2 didn't need the threat of a slap or anything else to know she needed to go and calm down.

DF might have not slapped her DD2, but she let her wrap her round her little finger. Which made neither of them happier.

Honestly plumtuckered, there were times where the only thing stopping me was the thought that once I crossed that line I'd bloody kill her.

Time out is not sadistic when used properly - my 2yr old uses it to calm down when he needs to be removed from a situation, we've tried a lot of things and that works perfectly for him.

I don't agree with the naughty step but I've never been in a supernanny type situation where I felt the need to use it.

I take issue with smacking a child then giving it a cuddle - mixed messages and very bad childhood memories for me.

people who don't, and can't imagine ever doing so. what methods of discipline do you employ?

Timeout. For me. I'd go to my room and lock the door.

ooo TheUnMember I like that one. But I live in an open plan house, my room is up 2 flights of stairs and I can't leave my 15month old on his own with his big brothers!

Oh yes, Minou, the thousand yard stare, I have it perfected. I couldn't view the link though.

I like the natural consequence approach but I'm not sure if this is what Cailin meant. My daughter had a habit of lashing out at her big brother who was getting frustrated not being able to lash back so one day, after she had been slapping him, I took her hand, smacked it and she burst into tears. I asked her if it would be ok for him to do to her what she does to him or for me to do this to her every time I was miffed ie should we behave the way she was. She was shocked by what I had done and immediately agreed it was not acceptable and I guess she could see that the natural consequence of hitting someone is potentially being hit back. She has been sooooo much better since then, if she does lapse, I just remind her of what it's like to be smacked. Not by doing it, just reminding her of how it feels.

Excluding her didn't make any difference. This is the only thing that resonated with her. I don't use smacking or condone it but it had desired effect when I used it as an example of why it was wrong.

I think it is entirely up to parental choice. There are bad parents who smack and excellent parents who do, just as there are excellent parents who advocate unconditional parenting and very poor ones too. The zealous anti smacking brigade are always so patronising and smug on the issue that they end up undermining their own arguments.

I also disagree with those who say they never want their children to feel fear. I think children (both at home and at school) should fear the consequences of their actions if they have done something deliberately mean or disobedient. This is not the same as actually fearing your parents though.

The argument that it is unacceptable because you would not smack an adult is frankly laughable. You also wouldn't ground another adult, remove an item belonging to them or send them to a naughty step but it doesn't mean they are not valid punishments.

As the tone of my post suggests I would smack as a last resort but I think it is the sort of punishment that should be reserved for shocking behaviour and hopefully never used at all.

hehehe. very sensible re locking self in room.

what's so mixed about the message, naturalbaby? seriously? 'i've warned you, you've kept doing the thing, you've taken it to the point where the warnings are going to pay off with a... smack... Right, now, are we done? can we continue with our lives, please? let's have a hug and be better from now on... and onwards'. i was never in the slightest bit confused by that as a child, not at all. but then nor was i ever hurt by a smack. stung, maybe, but never hurt. are we talking about different things, perhaps?

agree v much with dominodonkey's post. i've seen bad, helicoptering 'attachment' parenting and imo nice, relaxed, happy parenting where i'm sure the parents would smack the kids if they're being ghastly. it does depend on the parent and the child. i'd warrant that there are people who've posted on this thread that they'd never hit their kids are merrily fucking them up in a zillion other ways.

A total lack of fear of the consequences at school is a real problem.

There are a significant number of DCs at DD1s school who fail to learn much themselves and prevent others learning because they don't care how many detentions they get.

Sadly many of these are middle ability DCs who could pass exams if they stopped discussing East Enders/ football, boys/girls and Xfactor and vaguely listened.

Indeed Aitch. There's one thing that I cannot abide and that's lying. It sends me into a rage of cataclysmic proportions. Dread to think what effect that has. Thankfully it's a very rare occurance.

well, hopefully the effect it has it to realise that lying is some serious shit and they shouldn't do it...

Here's my daily struggle:

3yo DD (nearly 4) cocks around every morning, without fail, at getting-dressed time. It should take 2 minutes, she makes it take 30 minutes. Left to her own devices she would not get dressed at all.

She has to be at Pre-school by a certain time (and starts school this September). The traffic is appalling. And I am trying to get her baby brother ready too.

Oh, and by this point we have been up for 2 hours at least. She takes an hour to eat breakfast. Yes, really. Several drawings will have had to be done. A lot of talking. Very little action. It's like she lives in a dreamworld! One thing is for sure, she definitely isn't a morning person!

Do I?

A) put her into the car in her pyjamas/half-naked/part-dressed and take her to Pre-school, sort it out at the other end (but be late)? Force needed to do this. She screams the whole way there. DS also very upset.
B) let her faff about and be very late, disrupting the class and DS's nap.
C) employ bribery (doesn't work)
D) star chart reward (doesn't work, she doesn't care)
E) withdraw privileges and toys (doesn't work, she doesn't take them with her to pre-school anyway and doesn't have a favourite)
F) dress her forcibly and risk hurting her? See also A.
G) warn her that if her bottom stays naked she will get a small smack on it. Carry through the threat if needed (seldom but occasionally needed). After which she gets dressed in no time at all. I feel like crap for the rest of the week.
H) Pray for a miracle and hope she gets dressed quickly.

Or I) any of the above depending on what I think best on a given day. Including G).

Any other ideas/approaches appreciated, but don't want to hijack! But yes, on occasion, under extreme provocation, I do!

PoppyWearer - drawing doesn't have to be done. No drawing until you're dressed.

I did, not often and it was always on the bottom or leg and was a single smack.
My children are all older now and say they don't even remember it and have not grown up violent in any way so I'm not about to feel guilty about it.

On the other hand, I don't remember being smacked as a child although I was, but I do remember being sent to my room once and still remember the utterley crushing feeling of humiliation and to me, the withdrawal of my parents love. Note, it wasn't, I know my parents adored me but it felt like it to me at the time, I sobbed my heart out.

Yes... but so rarely and so long ago that he doesn't remember it.

Nope, isn't part of my culture, hasn't been done in my family for generations. None of us have gone off the rails/got into trouble at school/failed to develop respect for other people. Recently attended large family gathering and was struck once again by the pleasant attitude of nephews and nieces (now ranging in age from junior school age to mid-20s).

Looking round my present neighbourhood I can't see any correlation between being smacked and behaving well: the children who seem to behave worst are the ones whose parents are forever smacking and shouting but not modelling very good behaviour themselves. The best behaved children are usually the ones with calm authoritative parents- whether they smack or not seems pretty irrelevant.

Poppy, in your scenario, I used to find it possible to do either A or F without hurting the child as long as you don't let yourself get flustered.

It's a mixed message bacause when you smack a child they cry because you hurt them, they're confused because you tell them not to smack/hit, they're upset! Then you hug them to make them feel better, what are they supposed to think then? You may warn them they will get a smack if they carry on but there are plenty of other options.
I have to get 3 DC's fed & dressed & in the car in 60mins every morning and I don't have to smack them to make them understand we all need to get a move on and get ready.

No, never.

Poppy I would take her to pre-school half dressed. Yes it'll be horrible but you need to get across that she can't faff around, that time will run out and that you will have to get out the door whether she's dressed or not. That's a fact of life. Chances are you'll only ever have to do it once. But also you need to create a routine and enforce it quite rigidly. So when she's sitting down eating, no drawing or getting up is allowed, she can draw as soon as she's finished. Chatting is fine but you can intersperse the chatting with reminders to eat and warnings about having no time to draw. Children don't really understand urgency and timekeeping so she needs you to police it quite strictly until she's able to understand it for herself.

I've looked after, taught, and tutored plenty of children and I've never had to smack them. I just couldn't imagine smacking them, and some of them were really difficult. I've been bitten, scratched, kicked, the whole lot. But I was the adult in those situations and it wasn't appropriate for me to give as good as I got so to speak. I as the adult role model was responsible for showing that in violent, angry situations there are better ways of dealing with things than hitting. So I didn't hit. And I never wanted to either. I just don't want to hit a child. By saying that I'm not lying or pretending I don't hit children, I just don't hit them.

My DH was beaten (and I do mean beaten, with a belt) as a child.

It didn't turn him into a violent, aggressive man,however it is something he remembers vividly and always will do.

I have smacked my eldest daughter on the hand twice when she was 3, and ds1 on the backside once when he was 2.5.
I haven't had the need to do it again, and I don't think they remember it.

I don't know whether a smack is the right thing or not, I just haven't really had to do it.
Mine are teenagers now so obviously I wouldnt smack them now but maybe in the past when they were younger I may have done it again in a dangerous situation.

My DH is not totally anti smacking but he has never smacked them.

I think youcan cause a lot more damage with wordsthan a smack with your hand on the bottom.In fact through clothing I can't see how it could really hurt at all, but it's just a bit of a shock thatmakes them stop