Football culture is far more harmful to women's rights and wellbeing than porn culture.

[solidgoldbrass]

For a start, football culture gives a far more pervasive, wide-ranging and monolithic message: men are gods and women are either decorative accessories or foodstuff. It's misogyny and toxic masculinity encapsulated. Never mind the fact that the England women's football team have apparently won the world cup more often than the England men's team: there's the whole WAG thing, where being someone's appendage is a prize girls are told to covet, yet if they actually try to seek this prize they are demonized as sluts and gold-diggers, there's the way in which rape is seen as far more forgivable than being gay... and hard evidence that violence against women has a big upsurge every time there's a major football match on.

I think it was intended to be thought-provoking, which it is.

I believe that porn, the macho side of football, and materialistic, entitled celebrity culture form an unholy trinity which does real damage in our culture. I am very glad that despite the attempts of the knuckleheads, most ordinary football supporters actually didn't embrace the opportunity to applaud Ched Evans.

I would say boxing and the ever growing popularity of cage fighting are far more linked with porn than football.

Really? I've heard of far more professional footballers involved in the spit-roasting type shit in the tabloids than any other sport. Which is not to say it doesn't happen, but...

Fair point about boxing, Squeaky: remember Mike Tyson? Again, he was convicted of rape but his victim was vilified.

"... the OP started this thread to light touchpaper and start an argument between the feminists and anyone who dares to disagree with them.."

My God, squeakytoy, are you reading a parallel bizarro version of Mumsnet, or something?!

There are way, WAY more anti-/non-feminist, handmaiden types on this site than feminists.

'Anyone who dares to disagree with them...' - listen to yourself...!! This thread is full of people 'daring' to disagree.

I understand exactly the point you're trying to make.

i think that both porn and footie are equally bad for the lad's culture promoted by them and lad's mags such as nuts. in a recent scientific survey men couldn't tell convicted rapists' derogatory comments about women from lad's mag comments. they thought either to be OK but preffered the rapists comments until told the truth.

a good thread to start. have you seen the facebook thread - I believe her about believing rapists?

No, SGB is a long term poster. She has strong opinions that others might not always agree with. She is not a stirrer though.

I disagree

She's made no attempt whatsoever to take part in the thread (save for the boxing post after stirring was mentioned)

The only difference between this thread and many others of its ilk is that the OP didn't bother to NC before lighting the touchpaper and sitting back.

I agree with the OP as it is.

I agree that football "culture" is harmful to women's rights.

But far more harmful than porn is?

No way!

But then op likes a bit of porn, don't you? or am I confusing you with someone else SGB?

WAGS choose to be WAGS, they don't get trafficed or forced into it by poverty or drug habits. Not saying for a moment that means they shouldn't be entitled to the same rights and protections as anyone else but it's porn and the mindset that women are there for men's entertainment that feeds into all this " roasting " stupidity ...

Lots of perfectly sound and decent blokes play football, my DP, DS and brother among them. Personally I think it's pants, though.

So yeah, you are BU.

Is the OP pro porn then? Because that kind of puts a different slant on the question. If we are starting from both are bad but which is worse, that is a different question to porn is fine and this is bad for women.

Agree WorraLiberty.

I suspect the OP would have been more engaged in the debate if she had remembered to namechange first.

You were right the first time MNHQ. This thread should be in feminism.