AIBU to stop buyng The Independant because of this ad?

[NowThenWreck]

The one from Fathers4Justice, where they accuse MN of:

"carrying abusive and distressing anti-male content which promotes gender hatred against men and boys"
and, apparently, labels "men and boys as rapist, peados and wife beaters."

The ad has a lovely picture of a sad little boy with words like "rioter" and "homeless" and "sperm bank" written on his skin.

I am confused, as I have never come across a thread on here where people routinely call men paedophiles and rapists. In fact, usually, if someone implies that a man being left alone with a child is dodgy, posters will pile in and say "God, don't you know not all men are paedos.?"

As I understand it, this is a forum for discussion, not a political movement with a manifesto. There are many and varied opinions on MN, and the minute one opinion is aired, another will be along to refute it.

Or should I just laugh at F4J? The ad is quite gruesomely funny.

They aren't though.

Hardly any fathers are prevented from seeing their children by the courts. There were some stats on the other thread.

There are also a lot of organisations and individuals who are unhappy with various aspects of the family courts and I asked on the other thread whether F4J were working with any of them, but they didn't respond.

Clearly there are individual stories which are very sad and some fathers have a genuine complaint. But when you have the man who started it all up saying that the state he was in he didn't blame his ex from stopping contact, but at the same time he should have had contact.... And that as soon as he sorted himself out she gave him plenty of access again... And look at the current organisers asking their supporters to jam up the lines of support organisations and accuse them of supporting child abuse.... You have to ask yourself whether this is an organisation you want to align yourself with.

SigmundFraude, F4J are trying to make out that masses and masses of women routinely use and abuse the justice system to make false allegations of abuse for the purposes of denying their exes contact. Due to the lack of transparency in the family courts, we don't have the information that would tell us in how many cases DV is featured.

OTOH we do know exactly how many non-resident parents, most of whom are fathers, are denied access in a given year. It's around 300. Given that 1 in 4 women will suffer dv, and a similar number will experience rape and sexual assault, it is not unreasonable to assume that a good percentage of cases in courts do feature allegations of abuse, yet very very few cases result in a complete denial of contact. That strongly suggests that dv is not usually considered a sufficient reason to deny a father access, therefore it doesn't make sense that F4J are pushing this line of lying women making up false claims and judges believing them and denying fathers even minimal supervised contact. It really doesn't make sense at all.

erk

gingerbread ad

BALD I am not surprised you are "erk"ing.

Apologies if this has already been discussed, I've not read the entire thread, but I have read on this website that "Fathers for Justice recently called police after defamatory comments about fathers were not taken down from the mums advice service." (referring to Mumsnet).

Does anyone know if this is true, and what comments they were referring to?

We have no idea if they called the police. If they did then it would have been to liitle effect since the things they think they should report - liable or slander or whatever - are civil rather than criminal offences.

They called to report MN for 'gender hatred'

I am confused, as I have never come across a thread on here where people routinely call men paedophiles and rapists.

Stick around.....

I don't know if they called the police.

It was because someone said they knew a man who was a member and he, erm, wasn't very nice.

men and boys don't forget

I'm not sure any of this is real. I think I may be having an acid flashback.
It's all too bizarre.

" I am confused, as I have never come across a thread on here where people routinely call men paedophiles and rapists.

Stick around....."

How long do I need to stick around for? I've not seen any either.

'I am confused, as I have never come across a thread on here where people routinely call men paedophiles and rapists.

Stick around.....'

Whatmeworry - are you planning on starting one?

To be honest, being poor mouthed by F4J is about the best endorsement I can think of

I agree, this may be one of those "careful what you wish for" things.

F4J make me want to bang my head against a brick wall repeatedly

I am a MN poster, I would class myself as a liberal feminist, I love my husband and I love my son to his very bones, to suggest I think either of them as feckless/rapists/peadophiles etc is offensive and quite frankly puerile.

They would be better off campaigning for equal rights with regards to paternity leave and a shared split of childcare once the child is here. Move away from the mentality of women=caregiver, man=breadwinner and women won't automatically get full custody?

In answer to your question OP YANBU

'it doesn't make sense that F4J are pushing this line of lying women making up false claims and judges believing them and denying fathers even minimal supervised contact. It really doesn't make sense at all.'

But if women ARE doing this, then why on earth wouldn't you follow that line? I don't agree with the course F4J are taking now btw...I think it detracts somewhat from their reasonable complaint. Attacking MN isn't the way to go.

Whatmeworry - are you planning on starting one?

Good lord no. Besides, I don't need to, one will be along shortly I am sure

(Actually, thinking about it, that front has got a lot quieter compared to when I joined middle of last year)

As has been oft stated on FWR threads, the answer to the alleged problems f4j complain of is actually more feminism, because if family friendly policies were adopted by employers, the courts etc more men would be able to spend more time with their children.

What an irony, eh?

Thing is when something like that is said, it is poo-pood pretty quickly. Just like the thread I just posted on

That was to whatmeworry

The ad is utterly bonkers but no more so than some of the stuff I have read in the Feminism section.

Thing is when something like that is said, it is poo-pood pretty quickly. Just like the thread I just posted on

Au contraire, my observatuion is that a bunch of frothers come on and say the most extraordinary things, spew MRA accusations at anyone who disagrees, and everyone else pretty much exits.

It's just a case of a small pressure group setting itself up in opposition to a big brand, thus aligning itself as just as powerful.

All the MRA/feminism stuff bores the pants off me. It's just a few people on t'internet having a barney while the world gets on with life.

I do not believe that anyone on mn has ever posted that all men are rapists or paedophiles. I'd love someone to link to such a post, if one exists.