AIBU to stop buyng The Independant because of this ad?

[NowThenWreck]

The one from Fathers4Justice, where they accuse MN of:

"carrying abusive and distressing anti-male content which promotes gender hatred against men and boys"
and, apparently, labels "men and boys as rapist, peados and wife beaters."

The ad has a lovely picture of a sad little boy with words like "rioter" and "homeless" and "sperm bank" written on his skin.

I am confused, as I have never come across a thread on here where people routinely call men paedophiles and rapists. In fact, usually, if someone implies that a man being left alone with a child is dodgy, posters will pile in and say "God, don't you know not all men are paedos.?"

As I understand it, this is a forum for discussion, not a political movement with a manifesto. There are many and varied opinions on MN, and the minute one opinion is aired, another will be along to refute it.

Or should I just laugh at F4J? The ad is quite gruesomely funny.

'all boys were disruptive and should be made to sit down and shut the fuck up'
anyone who posted that in education would be absolutely flamed. There are some posters with such views but they are fuckwits few and are always outnumbered.

Aside from the ridiculous claims they're making...

It's a very poor ad.

Trying to stir up a bit of PR by making a controversial ad is the oldest trick in the book, and I can't see many people falling for it.

As if M&S give a shit about what F4J say.

Corn she was flamed-thoroughly.

good

There is the often used and rather horrible expression "cocklodger" that is often used on MN threads and I have noticed that when a husband is accused of infidelity there are generally some suggestions to change the locks and throw him and his stuff out ( totally illegal) when the illegality is pointed out there will generally be a few come backs that the h. will never take the matter to court anyway.

I also find it rather sexist that where there is a husband doing a demanding job to generate the funding to keep the family any need of his to wind down after work ( and lets face it in these times, male or female, by the time you have travelled to work, worked all day and got home again you are going to feel a bit knackered) is seen as not pulling his weight. And if anyone was ever brave enough to even suggest one of the benefits of bottle feeding is that the father can get more involved they would be in for a right flaming.

Haven't read whole thread.

Is their complaint about forums or about the mumsnet website - they can't really complain about open forums, anyway if someone started seriously policing them for only pro men comments no one would post.

Men are going to get criticised on women's forums because they are who the majority of women live with and anyone you live with can be irritating. A teenage website will complain about parents and siblings (and friends, same as here).

Men don't write about their feelings much (correct me if I am wrong - any male whinge websites out there?) so it will seem one sided.

If they are complaining about the website content then maybe mumsnet needs to act.

I find the use of the word cunt on here as anti women tbh. Most posters do not seem to agree. We all have different views about certain swearingw ords.

higgle - The other examples you give are tbh I think a matter of opinion, not inherently sexist. Should a working parent have time to unwind when they come home - some will say yes, some no. But I honestly don't see saying no as sexist.

Anyway there is nothing stopping them from posting here if they want to have their say.

Have to say I agree with Higgle on that one,I think I know one of the threads she is thinking of. The op was very rude,patronising and belittling in her references to her dh.If it had been the other way round....

Anegleena - MN specifically. They're calling for M&S and others to stop advertising on here until Justine (who is named) adopts a "zero tolerance approach to gender hatred"

You can (sort of) see the ad here

If it wasn't going to feed the troll, I think MNHQ should be getting a legal opinion.

Got to say F4J are completely off my radar but I do think there's something in what they say.

I think just as most men are pretty oblivious to the everyday casual sexism that goes on, it's kind of the oppersite on MN. And likewise as a man one does tend to notice the sexism that pops up on MN, often unchallenged.

I wouldn't say it's endemic but it's certainly there.

One thread that was quite an eye opener was posted by a woman who said she was abusing her husband and couldn't stop. She wasn't beating him up every night but it was abuse.

She recieved sympathy and advice of how to deal with her problems. As she should have done. It was quite a contrast to the almost default reaction when ever someone posts about simillar levels of abuse from a man. I suspect a lot of posters steared clear of that thread.

But yep I've seen men as a gender described as sperm donors, bastards, mysoginists and all the rest. Usually it goes unchallenged.

If anything I'd say there is an anti man element on here, I wouldn't say it was a deeply sexist website though.

One thing that needs to be acknowledged I think, is that there is a squewed view of men on some boards for obvious reasons. If aliens landed in MN 'relationships' I think they'd conclude most all men are complete bastards.

MNHQ can we hear your opinions on this?

I spend a ridiculous amount of time on here and I don't think I gave seen more than a handful of ALL men are xyz type posts. And the ones I have seen get jumped on from a great height.

Wonder if this is at all connected to the guy who made the youtube videos?

Grag - I have just reported your post. I think it si wrong to criticise someone on a thread by name, when they are not on this thread to defend themselve.

But maybe M&S is anti MN, given the bi-annual Per Una pisstake, so they're kind of shooting themselves in the foot? (joke)

I think mumsnet should ignore the advert:

A. Nobody reads or pays much attention to the Independent

B. As if M&S are going to listen to the dumbasses at F4J. It would be like taking advice from Roy Chubby Brown.

C. F4j are a very small organisation and are trying to create hype by starting a fight with mumsnet and garner cheap publicity.

However, I will think twice before buying the independent again.

Aha I see that people are going to turn out to have a pop at feminism.

Note that F4J are taking issue with the whole website, saying that MN

"carrying abusive and distressing anti-male content which promotes gender hatred against men and boys"
and, apparently, labels "men and boys as rapist, peados and wife beaters."

Which is clearly preposterous.

Also that last week they launched an initiative on their site to clag up the Gingerbread helpline so that single parents in need of help could not get through.

They claim that gingerbread supports child abuse (I can't remember the exact wording and I'm not going looking for it).

Could people who think they may have a point (boggling but some do) think about who you are aligning yourselves with?

I am confused. I thought this was an internet forum? I didn't know there was a party line or that Justine had to approve what I thought.

There is a bit of "men bashing" on this thread, but its not the majority.

I think people on benefits, SAHM, WOHMS, breast feeders, formula feeders and people who park in P&C spaces would have more reason to take out an advert.

Your average Indie reader is going to look at that advert and say WTF are they on about? And turn the page. It is a completely incoherent ad, given what I thought were the aims of F4J ie for men to see their kids after splits. This ad seems concerned about ... Erm... People on a specific website that many people have never heard of but which has ads from a pants manufacturer calling boys rioters and looters for no apparent reason so don't buy more pants.
That's it right? It advances their cause how exactly?

catgirl - I agree that there are other groups of people who really are bashed on here! People who park in P and C spaces would be valid in complaining about MN being very anti them.

thread? I meant website.

I don't really understand their choice of newspaper TBH.