to really not identify with the feminist boards on here, when i always thought I was a feminist

[DinahMoHum]

seems so joyless and anti sex.

I feel very conflicted now. I always thought feminism was about equality for women, which I dont believe we have, but it seems to re\lly be focusing on the wrong issues for me, and getting too much into dynamics of personal relationships, and peoples sexual preferences

im probably being unreasonable

countess - sorry if i misinterpreted you

Garlic I am gobsmacked you have had pms attacking your opinions. I hope you posted them on the relevent board. That's a bit pathetic really.

countessbabycham I agree that the language used sometimes in feminist analysis can be tricky.

Most posters are quite happy to explain things in terms that are more common or to explain what they mean by a word or a concept.

We used to have a brilliant regular on FWR who said herself that she had limited literacy skills - her posts were always very thought provoking and she was a really valued and respected contributor.

Garlicbutter I hope you reported the hate mail you received to MNHQ.

They frown very seriously on that kind of behaviour and I believe it is a banning offence.

I know, she has not been the only person hounded off MN for her feminism .

Its OK Beachcomber

But I don't think I will .Thanks anyway.

I miss her too, she was amazing. Hope she is doing ok.

garlicbutter I agree that's appalling. Did you report the posts?

Beachcomber I remember her. I know she's not the only poster it's happened to either.

'I agree with KatieMiddleton, I think one of the reasons people absolutely loathe the MN feminists, is because we go on relationships boards and call sexist behaviour and abusive behaviour for what it is. And tragically, many women are in long term relationships with really horrible abusive men. But they have children with htem, mortgages with them, are trapped with them so they don't have the option to leave, at least not atm. The way to defend yourself against the knowledge that your DH is vile and that your relationship is pitiable, is to be in utter denial about it. When women post about circumstances which are similar to your's and other women tell them that this is abuse and unacceptable and that they deserve better, that is fucking heart-rending for you - of course you're going to feel defensive, of course you're going to resent the women pointing out that this is not normal, what you can expect from a relationship, but really, seriously shit - of course you're going to go into a cataclysmic tantrum and go mad with posts desperately telling the OP that her relationship is normal and everyone telling her it's abusive or sad or painful, are a bunch of lunatics. How else would you be able to face your life? If you have a vested interest in trying to pretend your relationship is not that bad, then you have to try and persuade other abused women, that their relationships are OK too. If you are tying yourself into intellectual knots to try and match up your aspirations with your reality, you just can't afford for that gap to be pointed out and you will feel very angry and attacked by anyone who points it out. I am very sorry for anyone who is in that position. And I guess I've got to a stage where I accept that they're just going to attack feminist sprites on the interweb regularly, as a self-defence mechanism. I wish women didn't have to set up other women as scapegoats for the shortcomings of the men in their lives, but hey ho.'

Sorry, but I really have to respond to this. Is this really how you justify women not being feminists, by saying that they MUST be in abusive, pitiable relationships, but are so much in denial of this fact that that they feel they have to shout down feminists who are speaking 'the truth'? I mean seriously? Is this how you try to rationalise people on MN being anti-feminist in your mind?

Hate PMs are wrong.

Making up shit about what posters believe is too.

Perception/reality.

No DM that isn't how I rationalise people being feminists.

I said in my post, I think that's why some people have a disproportionately passionate antipathy to us.

Hence the whingeing about us going on to relationships threads. Why can't we just stay in our feminist ghetto, chuntering to each other? Why do we have to go outside and upset people with our feminist analysis of relationships?

There are other reasons why some women are not feminists too of course. It is not very accurate for you to imply that I think that horrible relationships is the only reason.

Round the relationships boards, I suspect it's one of the major reasons for antipathy to us though. That doesn't mean antipathy to feminism per se, it means antipathy to regular posters on the FWR board who dare to step outside and post elsewhere.

I haven't lurked enough on the fwr board to judge the feel, but I lurk and post on AIBU enough to tell you there's some man-hating on here.

I refer, of course, to the posts that claim men are incapable of operating washing machines.* I don't think this rubbish is posted by the fwr board regulars.

*What did you think I meant?

No worries countessbabycham.

I have always identified myself as a feminist, but TBH, don't often post in this section. Someone who posted here a lot and is revered by many of the other feminists here, attacked me as a non-feminist because I couldn't stomach Sarah Palin in the last election and I just couldn't forget that. Also, I stated once that my DH is also a feminist, and I stand by that, only to be attacked that men cannot be feminists. So, I gave up.

some people have a disproportionately passionate antipathy to [feminism]

I don't think I've ever met a wholly anti-feminist woman. Some men show disproportionate antipathy, yes, presumably because they fear losing advantage.

I agree that Relationships threads sometimes feature inappropriate replies from (purportedly) women defending a man's bad behaviour and/or his entitlements. Their reason may be that the OP reflects their own relationship, or it may not. Whatever the reason, it must be more helpful for the OP and for lurking readers to address the issue in hand rather than start a political derailment.

Which is what happens here, 99% of the time :)

Then you haven't been on the recent F4J threads and facebook kerfuffle GN.

Too right I haven't!

Totally agree BigJessie.

Poster1 :"FGS you know what men are like, they just don't see dirt"

Poster2: "I know, my DH doesn't even know how to switch the hoover on lol"

Poster3: "He's a grown adult, not a child of course he can switch the hoover on. And of course men can see dirt, if he doesn't he's lying. I wouldn't put up with it if my DH behaved like that, we share the chores"

Posters 1 & 2: "OMG Poster3 you must be some sort of ballbreaking man hater, your poor DH"

The political derailments are usually started by someone taking offence at the post of a known feminist and telling them that their view is not valid because it's coming from a feminist perspective and as anyfuleknow, feminists should stick to the FWR boards and not come out into the relationships board.

I think we may be allowed into the doghouse though.

Basil