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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

to think it is unacceptable to leave a 12 year old and 9 year old home alone with a 12 month old baby

298 replies

PinkElephant73 · 15/02/2012 11:47

It is half term this week and someone I know went out during the day, leaving their 2 older children age 9 and 12 alone with their 12 month old baby sibling who was asleep having a nap while the parent was out. The parent was out on 2 separate occasions for a period of about 30 minutes, but says they were no more than 10 minutes from home either time and the older children could have contacted them on their mobile phone if there was a problem. They do not seem to think there is anything to worry about with the above scenario.

Is it just me or is this totally irresponsible? what would you do if this was your friend?

OP posts:
seeker · 16/02/2012 23:27

Not saying a 12 year old could single hqndedly compose q shopping list. But yes, with help writing the list in advance, my dd, at 12, could do a weekly shop. Why is that so amazing?

And OTT, what happened to you was awful, and completely unacceptable.nobody would deny that for a single, solitary second. But we aren't talking about such qn extreme case here. We're talking qbout q 12 year old looking after her baby sibling for 30 minutes. And no, I don't think the child should be asked, unless they don't feel up to it. I don't ask my children whether they feel like washing up, or taking the bins out or popping to the shop. They contribute to the community in which we live. As I do and th father does. And if that contribution on a particular day is the oldr one watching the younger for a while, then so be it.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:30

But Seeker, OTTs mum was NEXT DOOR.

How many people on here would say that the mum nipping next door for an hour leaving the kids at home was a problem? None probably, but OTT and her sister are living proof of what can happen and the long term effects of that.

Heswall · 16/02/2012 23:31

What happened to families helping each other out ? I can drive so I use that skill to take my children to school in comfort each morning, they play chase around the house better than I do so use their skill set to entertain the baby whilst I relax in the bath, win win.
I will not be paying my eldest to babysit but neither will I charge rent as some parents do to live in their own home. They are not staff or lodgers, it's done out of love and in the interests of a harmonious house.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:32

As for the shopping, well I have a v large family and a vv complicated shopping system which even my OH doesnt completely understand. I suppose a small list for a family of 4 would be doable. But I still have my doubts tbph.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:34

it's done out of love

How on earth can it be done out of love if it is demanded? Only actions that a person chooses to do can be done out of love, if choice is removed then so is the love.

LilyBolero · 16/02/2012 23:34

Risk is an interesting thing - the baby in the OP would probably have been at greater risk of harm if Dad had not gone for a run, but had put all 3 in the car and taken them to a soft play centre. Because driving is one of the biggest risks we take.

People talking about 'leaving kids overnight with 11 year old siblings' - that's so not what's being discussed - it's a 12 yo and a 9yo with a SLEEPING BABY - in a cot. Dad is 10 minutes away. He could be 10 mins on the loo ffs....and actually, the baby's not going to come to harm even if it has to cry for 10 mins while dad arrives.

My kids absolutely love it when I get them to look after the baby - I haven't yet asked them to if I'm out of the house, as they are a bit younger than the OP, but I wouldn't be worried about them with him. Especially if he was asleep.

Heswall · 16/02/2012 23:35

I drive them to school out of love, believe me it's demanded though Grin

LilyBolero · 16/02/2012 23:37

Bogeyface - you know what, acccidents can happen EVEN IF THE PARENT IS THERE. I always quote this, but a 3yo child who used to play with ds1 at toddler group was at home with his dad. A man from the nearby bail hostel broke in, and murdered his dad. The child was at home alone with his body for 3 days. It was so sad, and a horrendous tragedy (his mum had died when he was a baby).

The point is, a parent being there does not prevent bad things happening. And what's more, a parent there may well not have prevented the accident in OTT's story, or the subsequent guilt she felt.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:37

I get that, I am the same! But as a parent I chose to have my children and took on the tasks that that entailed, school run included. But they didnt get a choice in me having them or their siblings so they do have a choice in whether they want to help take care of them.

Assuming that your child would and should take care of their siblings is wrong. They would not be doing out of love but because you told them to.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:40

acccidents can happen EVEN IF THE PARENT IS THERE

No really? I am so glad you are here to tell me these things Hmm

My point is that yes, tragedies happen whoever is around, but as a parent I do not want my children holding themselves responsible for something that really wasnt their fault. It wasnt OTTs fault that her sister was so horribly injured. She didnt know what to do and did the best she could, it was her mothers fault for abdicating responsibility in the first place. I want to avoid that, is that so wrong?

seeker · 16/02/2012 23:41

"How on earth can it be done out of love if it is demanded? Only actions that a person chooses to do can be done out of love, if choice is removed then so is the love."

It's not demanded- it's expected. Don't you expect your children to pitch in?

Oh, and I'll gt dd to come on here tomorro to chonform her abilities qs th "incredible Shopping 12 year old" if you like! What a very strange thing to question- shopping's not difficult!

LilyBolero · 16/02/2012 23:41

point is though, mum could have been there, and OTT still feel she was responsible, if she was the one in the kitchen.

Heswall · 16/02/2012 23:43

Too many "children" ie teens have no life skills these days, no sense of responsibility and no grip on bloody reality. I have come accross 25 year olds that you wouldn't leave a baby with because they have no idea how to deal with an emergency or cope, this is the parents fault for asking too little of the individual IMO.
They will never learn unless they are given the opportunity, what I was doing at 9 I might ask my 11 year old to do because I know it would be frowned upon these days, not sure that helps my child to progress though.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:45

I do expect my children to pitch in yes, in things that affect us all. They clear their plates from the table, clean their rooms, sort their laundry etc But i dont expect them to take care of siblings that it wasnt their choice to have! That was my choice ergo my job.

LilyBolero · 16/02/2012 23:47

I agree about life skills, when I was 11 I had to get a train 200 miles across the country, get a taxi at the other end, do a music festival, taxi back to station, get on right train and get myself home again. Wasn't a problem, I had my Sony Walkman (my PRIZED posession at the time!), I had a great day. Didn't lose my tickets, didn't lose my money, didn't get stuck anywhere, if I had I'd have sorted myself out. Other parents at school are quite Hmm that I let dh walk home on his own, at age 10 - it's 2/3 mile....

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:48

Heswall, just because mine dont doesnt mean they cant. My 21 year old didnt turn into a responsible adult overnight, I taught him. He can cook, shop, clean, use the washing machine (despite claiming he cant, you cant blame him for trying, I would if I thought some other silly bugger would do the washing!) and has a job. He is also disabled and less physically able than most.

But I do not take him or his siblings for granted as unpaid labour when it suits me.

Bogeyface · 16/02/2012 23:49

Lily, my main problem is that you married your DH when he was only 10....

:o:o

LilyBolero · 16/02/2012 23:53

pmsl, yes, that would be bad!!!!

ds1.....not dh......when he was 10 I was -4.....

Heswall · 16/02/2012 23:56

How do they/you know they can if they don't ?

TheParan0idAndr0id · 17/02/2012 00:19

FFS, some of you are incapable of trying to see a perspective other than your own.
Better head off now, early start to get those toddlers up chimneys.....

seeker · 17/02/2012 06:28

"But I do not take him or his siblings for granted as unpaid labour when it suits me."

So what's unpaid lqbour and what's contributing to the family? My two do a lot- they have always been expected to do jobs- including the older one watching her brother for short periods of time when I popped out or had work to do. I don't think it's good for anyone to live in a community and not contribute to it to the level of therir ability.

cory · 17/02/2012 07:57

Bogeyface Thu 16-Feb-12 14:50:07

"The point that I and others are trying to make is that accidents happen and it is in the best interests of everyone concerned to have an adult who is able to cope in an emergency present. A 12 year old would most probably panic in the even of say, a fire, and while yes there is also the chance that an adult would panic too, they are more likely to be able to think clearly about what they need to do to get everyone to safety."

I am not convinced that a level-headed 12yo who is used to dealing with problems without an adult would be more likely to panic than an adult.

When our train caught fire in Greece, my younger brothers (13 and 11) stayed calm and followed instructions, though there was at least one hysterical adult on the train.

I think by the time you get to 12 it is a question of personality and training (except for that brief period when hormones take over for some teens).

When emergencies happened at our home, I dealt with them calmly and sensibly, in fact far more calmly than my 4 years older brother did. My parents knew this and felt far safer if I was in charge.

My little brother did have an accident: I dealt with it. He did fall ill: I dealt with it (and rang his school and did all the other things required).

I would feel far more confident that my children would deal well with an emergency than some adults I know. I base this, as my parents did, on how they have dealt with minor emergencies.

When ds cut his hand open playing in a field outside our holiday cottage, dd (who was then 10) did not panic though there was a fair bit of blood; she calmed him down and got him to a place where he could get help. In fact, she did exactly the same- no more, no less than I was able to do for her when she fell and injured her head a few years previously. And he was reassured by the presence of his sister.

Yes, you would feel dreadful if the baby had an accident when you were in charge as a 12yo. But trust me, you will feel equally dreadful at any age. Personally, I know the reason I have coped so well with some pretty grim parts of my own motherhood is because this was not my first taste of being in charge of another human being. It didn't feel like something totally new and scary, but like a development of something I had already started training for.

cory · 17/02/2012 08:08

Bogeyface Thu 16-Feb-12 23:23:13
"I have 6 kids, if we didnt all help out then it would be chaos. But at no point do I expect my children to take on responsibilities that are mine. My eldest babysits sometimes and he gets paid for it, but to expect him (or my second dc) to do it just because I tell them to? No way! They are my children not my unpaid staff ffs!"

Tbh I don't see why it is so much better to treat them like paid staff. Round here we help out because we are part of a family and pull together. That means I can ask a favour of dd or ds, just as I can of dh. Outsiders get paid, but my dcs are not outsiders.

I would have felt horribly hurt if my mother had said she didn't expect me to do things for my little brother because I hadn't chosen to have him. He was my brother, one of the most important people in my life! Of course I didn't look after him in the same sense that my parents did, but those short moments of caring have led to shared memories that still make us very close.

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