Are you scared of Social Workers?

[JugsyMalone]

I watched something on TV last night about social workers. I thought they were perfectly reasonable people trying to do a hard job. However, there was this nagging voice in my head saying "if they saw the house right now...." Laundry overflowing (far too much school uniform, a one use towel habit in the house and the dog's muddy paws in winter), mucky carpet (dog/winter/hoover needs replaced), we are all messy people and the toilet seat is broken, again. I desperately need to redecorate.

We sometimes have takeaways or good M&S ready meals and I smoke fags now and then in the garden. Sometimes I get pissed on a Friday with my mates. Sometimes their kids and mine are upstairs playing on xbox and eating chocolate and pizza whilst we get pissed and do kaeroke (sp?) dowstairs. I also hate getting up early on the weekend and let the kids watch (slightly) over age films, with me.

I have had 2 contacts with SWs ever, one to get DS2 into a special nursery (years ago). They were really kind and nice. Another (even more years ago) to get help with points to get a council house due to poor living conditions in a horrible flat, again really helpful.

But an unscheduled visit? OMG - have done laundry and kitchen and hoovering after watching TV.

I know IABU but wondered if anyone else felt this way?

My friend is recently coming out of an abusive relationship her and her kids had been sick and she was too tired to keep getting up in the night every 5 mins to see to kids or to put them back in their beds. Her husband came home and raped her. According to ss she is a bad mother, and failed in her duty to protect her children and keep them away from harm, and her children aren't safe. Sw was aggressive towards her.

I am happy to announce that the consultant paediatrician who sexually assaulted me is actually dead He died at the age of 63 after having taken early retirement. Perhaps there is a God.

(I have just done a yahoo search on his name)

Yeah that's what I thought headinhands, didn't happen though, because they lied.

Yes CAFCASS represent the children. Some are so so, some do a magnificent job. Last week one stood up to a LA and convinced judge to order further assessments of parents who had been found to have fractured their baby's skull. Now if that baby goes on to die at her parents hands, that Guardian will be attacked for her incompetence. But she thought the
Parents deserved a chance. She may be wrong. That's the problem. None of us are omniscient.

I hesitate before appearing critical of someone who is obviously very hurt and bitter, but hiddenhome surely you cannot really believe that every single social worker and guardian is malicious and incompetent? Does your judgment extend to me and my colleagues who represent parents in court? Are we also all corrupt?

Personally find their power quite terrifying. Our (then 10 month old) son suffered a fractured skull in what was eventually proved to be an accident at the childminder's. Because we dutifully took him to hospital when the swelling appeared, with no explanation of how it had happened we had the full force of police and SWs there within hours. It became a nightmare that we couldn't wake up from, because how do you prove a negative? We had our son removed from our care (thank God for 'only' a couple of weeks) As the SWs pointed out to us, they don't have to prove anything beyond reasonable doubt, as the police do, they only have to go with the 'balance of probabilities' which, as we were his parents and he was with us more than anyone else, pointed to us. They did their damndest to make us turn on each other. Bastards.

The gov has forced out independent guardians by driving down pay scales. Most guardians are now appointed from CAFCASS. But that does not mean they are in the pay of a LA.

Not scared, more wary after our experience of them with DSD1. She wanted to live with DH as her mum was hitting her. DH has difficulty articulating himself when he gets emotional and they refused his request to have me there (to keep him calm). That meeting ended with the immortal phrase "DH is unable to articulate clearly what he feels the issue is and in my(SW) opinion is jealous of DSD1's relationship with her mum" yeah, real jealous of a relationship where the child is scared to go home.

DSD1 had confided in her school teacher who reported to SS. Lovely loooong court battle later DH ended up with joint residency of DSD1&2 (DSD2 was considered too young for her wishes to count) but no way of enforcing it as each time XW breached the court order and DH pulled her up about it DSD1 would either be smacked or allowed to do whatever she wanted depending on how XW percieved the situation. DSD1 was/is on first name terms with the local community police officer as a result of drinking and running away from her mums (usually landed at ours drunk at 13). She got pregnant at 16, and as a result had SW input herself.

Her experiences with authority figures has made her very wary of anybody wanting to talk to her about her DS. She had to have a court appointed SW due to contact issues with her DS's dad and was so upset that she asked for one of the community workers from the local Surestart to accompany her. The SW insisted on talking to her DS by himself (he's 2) which was vetoed b y the community worker who told her that she would be staying. Both DSD1 and the community worker told DH that they felt that the agenda for the visit was not what they thought it would be as some of the questions were "odd". The community worker was so concerned at the types of questions that were being asked of a 2 year old that she filed a complaint (with DSD1's consent). DSD1 has all the reports from the involvement that SS had with her when she was younger, and suffice to say she is shocked that despite the abuse, both emotional and physical, she was basically forced to stay with her mum.

DSD1 now has her own place and DSD2 has permanently moved out of her mums due to emotional abuse and now lives with MIL. She (DSD2) left when she was 11 . She told DH (who was begging her to come and live with us . We are only across the road from MIL) that MIL's was a safe place where her mum couldn't use her against DH When she left her mums the only way it was going to be allowed to happen was if DH didn't take XW to court for full residency. Sometimes I wonder what would have happened if he had, but after everything DSD1 had been through I guess I understand why he didn't.I feel sorry for XW because she doesn't seem to realise that she has ruined her relationship with DSD1&2. Suppose it's easier to blame PIL's, DH, me, DSD 1&2......

oops turned into a rant essay

Did you see the programme last night Kew, where a lengthy low-level CP case was massively ramped-up when the mother was about to deliver her baby?

The newborn was absolutely beautiful and the woman, newly single due to DV had never been without a man. Confused and depressed as her son had gone into foster care and crucially post-partum when she made the life-changing decision to leave both the DC in care together. How is that allowed to happen? There are laws which state that women should not be making those types of decisions at that stage.

The DC were split up anyway and some tick-boxing white m/c couple's dream came true.

I don't believe in adoption targets but there is an agenda. I was adopted in the seventies. Adoption in this country isn't the cure-all that people think it is.

Kewcumber, DD was appointed a guardian ad litem too. She spoke to me for two minutes, once, to get my contact details. She has seen DD a total of 0 times since she was appointed in mid Novemeber.

GoingForGoalWeight it would indeed come under the umbrella of neglect, or at least my case did. They (SS) did say though that it was me and my house that was neglected, not my children.

I think if you invite SS into your home to help with an SN kid and have time to hoover, blah, blah that is different.

When I was fighting to get DS2 a statement Part G (or something) of the statement said. "This family is known to social services but there are no current concerns".

We were known because DS2 had needed to go to a special nursery several years prior to that.

I just felt that "this family is known to social services......." was very embarrassing.

My kids are well cared for, emotionally. No polished shoes, can't guarantee the state of the mattresses, but loved to bits and I have "engaged" the LEA at every stage to get the best schooling etc for my SEN kid. And won.

Spero where did I say that all SW and Guardians are incompetent and malicious? I did say that perhaps some of them are doing good jobs, but I find it's best to be suspicious and not trust them because they are in a perfect position to misrepresent people who are unable to defend themselves. I find it's best not to expect too much from people then you're not disappointed.

"s the SWs pointed out to us, they don't have to prove anything beyond reasonable doubt, as the police do, they only have to go with the 'balance of probabilities'"

This is what really disturbed me. Our SW acted as though we were guilty from the outset, and when the allegations were proven false, she went through the house from top to bottom trying to find something else.
Imagine your neighbour reported you to the police saying you were growing cannabis in your front room. The police would come around, chat to you, see there were no drugs, then go away again. They wouldn't be searching all through the house looking for evidence of unrelated crimes.

I can see that they want to make sure a child is safe, but when they are clearly healthy and happy (and this is confirmed by other agencies) it becomes a waste of time. There are ways of approaching this which are sympathetic, and I hope that most SWs take that approach.

Bsmirched, it must be a nightmare to be accused of something you didn't do.

But sadly there are parents and carers out there who murder their children. What else can a hospital do if a child is brought in with a fractured skull? It has t be investigated or the child could be sent home to be killed. Yes, some SW and doctors can be arrogant and heavy handed. But they do a shitty stressful job and face all kinds of hostility and often physical attacks from parents.

I would only be a social worker if you paid me £100k a year with three months paid holiday.

Oh, and Cafcass are a universal joke amongst the internet circles that I have frequented

I would echo everything spero has said. I've spent this evening in Court representing social workers to remove a baby only a few months old, tonnes if bruises, fractured ankles and more broken ribs I can count on two hands. Was that to boost figures, hell no, it was to safeguard a poor little baby and stop him being hurt anymore.

Not all social workers are amazing, but I'm yet to come across one who wants to remove a child and goes out of their way to achieve this, sadly usually quite the opposite.

Government figures on adoption! Never has happened never will! Believe me, when children go home or the parents turn it around it makes my day!

Hiddenhome you actually went further than that in your first post and accused 'anyone' in authority of deliberately lying.

I visit some Internet sites which make my eyes bleed. Doesn't prove much about anything, apart from fact humans love conspiracy theories. Do you frequent the sites of Ian Joseph and his colourful fonts? I am guessing yes.

mists - no I didn't see it but presumably it would have ramped up because if one child is deemed to be in a failing situation, it isn't likely to improve by adding a newborn to the mix. In cases I have known it often isn't the mother who was the primary abuser but her partner, but in her inability to live separately from her partner the children have ended up in care.

But I don;t know the case so can;t comment, am also surprised that they would have shared the detials of a CP case on the TV

It isn;t legal for a mother to consent to a baby being placed for adoption within the first 6 weeks of birth (from memory).

Anyhow I'm not really arguing the merits or otherwise of individual cases or the sanctity of social workers. I am pointing out that only 60 babies a year are adopted in this country and adoption rates are dropping while looked after children numbers are increasing. Whatever the problems with our system (and there are many) it isn't that social workers are taking children in order to reach adoption targets. The numbers just don't back that claim up.

Or if it is then they are doing it extremely badly and taking predominantly the unadoptable older children.

here

Yes, anyone can lie. It is best, when encountering such people, that you watch your words and actions and be suspicious.

I have never heard of Ian Joseph and I'm not into conspiracy theories. Please don't patronise me, I'm no fool.

Spero - I know what you are saying.

Every child has the right to go to school not smelling of rubbish/piss.

However, is it social engineering to say that children of SN people - women with temporary PND or depression with probably work with a clean up team?

However, could a child be safe but grubby and pissy and that is OK?

OK-ish.

Is it worth breaking the family bond over?

I'm not scared of social workers - I come into contact with them in my job every day. I get frustrated and angry with them regularly, and will badger them until they DO WHAT THEY SAID THEY WERE GOING TO on a regular basis so if anything I think social workers might be scared of me :o

here

Oh - and I also know some cracking' SWs - not knocking them per se.

I also work with social workers on occasions.

I'm slightly confused hidden as particularly that second link shows that social workers are accountable for their actions, that social worker was sacked and the police returned the child