To think that the West is seriously fucked up on the bosom front?

[Hullygully]

Bags of poison sewn into our infant feeding parts.

How fucked up is that?

queenifallbiscuitsandmuffins what an odd thing to write, even when I'm looking ahead of me, I can still my chest & tummy (which doesn't stick out).

Great post looksgoodingravy. glad to hear your positive experience. DH loves mine too & they also move.

"queenifallbiscuitsandmuffins what an odd thing to write, even when I'm looking ahead of me, I can still my chest & tummy (which doesn't stick out)."

How?? I've even just tried this and looking ahead I can't see either my tummy or my breasts. It does however remind me I need to get my fringe cut so I can see.

queenofallbiscuits I'm fascinated by your reflectionless existence. Do you not even allow yourself a cursory glance in a hand mirror to check your teeth for stray basil after an Italian meal? Even in a restaurant?

Well, your ability to shrug off vanity entirely is admirable, I give you that. I don't know though, I kind of like looking nice. It's not the most noble occupation ever, but I don't want to give it up.

Actually I probably look at myself 4-5 times a day in the mirror, make-up, doing teeth, checking my skirt is not tucked

I find the rise in vaginoplasty more disturbing, breast implants don't bother me so much as i am sure a lot of women just want to be in proportion so that clothes fit better and yes it's vain, but I can understand it. I was flatter chested prior to children and I did feel very self conscious about it. But I also agree that it's a shame that society projects these feelings of inadequacy onto women too for what is essentially a gland that was designed to feed infants with. I suppose I am fence sitting

Actually I probably look at myself 4-5 times a day in the mirror, make-up, doing teeth, checking my skirt is not tucked into my knickers but I don't look at myself nearly as much as husband and friends have to look at me.

Claiming its for you rather than other people just seems silly, don't you ever question why you don't think you look nice without the primping and preening. Why does something like looking a certain culturally dictated way give you confidence?

I'm glad to hear that queenof. The logistics of a life without mirrors was quite mind blowing!

To answer your question, I do my make up for other people to look at. I also do it for myself, though. I like picking out the colours, experimenting with things. I like putting make up on other people too, which serves my face no purpose at all. So the line is blurred between vanity and aesthetics.

As for my chest, no one sees how it really looks but me and my husband. It looks alright in a wonderbra. My husband isn't bothered either way. Having an uplift would benefit me only. I still quite fancy it, though.

I don't think my body shape fits any "culturally dictated" way - that's the whole point of good surgery - it improves what you've got. I'm never going to be an elle macpherson, or a Kylie or Jordan. I can't think there is anyone in the media that I look like. I just look like me, with boobs rather than without boobs.

I am now sitting down typing, I can see my arms from the shoulders down to hands & my chest down to my knees. I think I look in the mirror maybe twice a day (depending whether I have my contacts in). Despite my having committed the cardinal sin of having breast implants for myself, I'm clearly massively less vain than you . oh yes, I am make up free too...!

i could understand a very flat chested women going for surgery.But not some one who allready has reasonable sized breasts.

It's not about being vain or not vain, it's about claiming that the boob job was for you. Why would you want a boob job, why would you care what your boobs like, why would you think your concave breasts weren't beautiful?

So all the women that have had BA for vanity reasons, would you encourage your daughters to do the same?

I'm interested to know if people are happier after having implants. Not judging, just curious.

I just wonder because I used to be an awful one for thinking that if I finally got my clothes sorted or my hair or my make-up, I'd feel happy. Of course, I'd feel happy the first time I wore the trousers or the shirt or the new lipstick and then the sheen wore off. Is it the same re surgery?

Would I care what my boobs look like? Why would I care what anything looks like? I personally think small or even flat boobs are very sweet and dainty but I also understand the wish to have very full, plump boobs. It would be easier to be happier with what we've got but it doesn't always work out like that. Why not change it? Why not change your hair and your make up? Sure, you might stab yourself in the eye with your mascara but life is full of danger. That's what makes it so exciting.

Reminds me of a line in a film, "Why are fireworks good? Might as well ask, why is a rainbow good? Why is a sunset good? Why are boobs good? They just are!"

"Sure, you might stab yourself in the eye with your mascara but life is full of danger. That's what makes it so exciting."

I guess my definition of 'exciting' is different from yours. Possession of "very full, plump boobs" was never on the list. Having an happy healthy and fulfilled life (that also involved "dangerous" stuff like extreme skiing, scuba diving and travelling off the beaten track), interesting and rewarding career, loving family and supporting friends was.

"don't you ever question why you don't think you look nice without the primping and preening"

I find this amusing coming from someone who appears to need to look in the mirror daily to put make up on. I am unlikely to look in the mirror even once a day, I can brush my hair (thats if I bother!) clean my teeth etc without having to look in the mirror and I haven't the time or inclination to wear make up except on very rare occasions. I look just fine without without any 'primping and preening' too. I don't deny a bit of makeup and nice hairdo don't improve how I look, but it doesn't change who I am. However, whether I look in the mirror or not, I know my breasts are there. Nothing wrong with them before, nothing wrong with them now, I prefer them how they are now though. I could happily live with them as they were before, or if (as I may do) I have my implants out and don't have any more put in. Currently though, th ebest thing about my breasts is the way my baby cuddles into them after a feed, all snuggled in and asleep and I can't see that that would be the same if they weren't so big and 'pillowy'.

bemybebe, obviously I only gamble with my mascara wand when I'm not scuba diving!

I am very interested in hearing about this extreme skiing. What does that involve?

"So all the women that have had BA for vanity reasons, would you encourage your daughters to do the same?"

What a strange thing to ask! Why would I encourage something my daughter may or may not want?

"I'm interested to know if people are happier after having implants. Not judging, just curious"

No, I am not happier and I didn't expect to be. I was perfectly happy before and am just as happy now. I wasn't unhappy becaus eof how my breasts looked, I just felt I'd prefer something different and I do.

Ok, rephrased: what would your reaction be?

well I'm more concerned with smoking, tattoos (apologies to any fans out there) binge drinking & them having sex with (imho) revolting boys.

If they are completely flat chested & that's what they want, well, I'll cross that bridge. Hoping they are, dare I say it, luckier in the breast dept than me.

Completely with midori1999 on how it feels just to have boobs, they are comforting for me.

Hullygully if you thinking having boobs is so unimportant, why don't you have yours removed ? Live life in my shoes for 28 years & then report back.

And that goes to everyone else who wants to find fault with the concept of having to accept being titless.

I honestly don't know, but I think my reaction would depend on her motives for wanting the surgery.

I'd like to think, that I will bring my children up to be confident, independent etc and like with anything else, I'd like to think that I'd respect their choices as an adult and support them in whatever they want to do. I would want to make sure she had really thought about the implications and had looked into it properly. I don't think that's very different to how I'd react if my grown up children wanted to do anything though.

Florie, this is fascinating because I genuinely do not check my teeth for stray spinach etc.

I am quite reasonable looking and can dress smartly but I do not seem to have so many women's obssession with appearance. It seems to have led me to geater peraonal happiness and career success not to have it and I would likem ore women to feel like I do and not fuss and waste so much time over how they look which is a morally bad way to be. I want girsl to be thinking about their sporting hobbies, history studies, careers and not fussing over how big their chest or bottom is. I want them if they ahve spare time to help the sick not flaunt their chest. I don't want them to feel they have to cut their chests open as so very very very man of them have done when they would be better off getting therapy.

Out of interest, willow, why do tattoos bother you more than breast implants?

"I find this amusing coming from someone who appears to need to look in the mirror daily to put make up on"

Why? I admit that the reason I do it isn't for myself but to look good for other people and that it's because of being bombarded with daily images of women airbrushed or made up to an inch of their life that I think for some reason I look better with make-up.
It's the people who claim that they do the surgery for themselves rather than because they have been effectively brainwashed that there boobs aren't perfectly lovely I don't understand.