In thinking that if you won't go out alone at night because you've got a vagina, you are actually a bit pathetic?

[solidgoldbrass]

Because, statistically, if you have a vagina, you are far more at risk of being murdered if you stay at home If your home has a man in it. Yet time and time again there's this 'Waa, waa, I need an armed escort or a male owner to protect me if I'm ever going to set a foot out of doors after dark. It's so unreasonable to expect me to use public transport or walk anywhere...'

Where have I ever called SGB a friend? We occassionally post in the same section. Occassionally agree, often disagree.

Just because I didn't jump on the "Oh my god, you're vile OP" bandwagon, doesn't mean that I agree with how she worded things.

And seriously... I'm the only one you chose to pick out for discussing another element to the thread. That sounds like an axe to grind to me...

Amen to that, Chibi.

FWIW, I'm perfectly comfortable walking home alone, after dark. Hell, I used to have to leave my house at 6:30 in the morning to get to uni, in the dark. But at the same time, none of my female relatives would do the same. I'm not going to chastise them for it. It's their choice.

Well it would seem we all essentially agree.

Do something about the menz

Respect all women's choices, based on their experiences and/or fears/ and/or neighbourhoods.

*Yawn

hear hear Artex.

Or is it here here

I'm never sure

It's "Here hare here"

Why do posters keep calling men, 'Menzs'?

As far as I am concerned it started with an odd male poster called James. He became Jamez (can't remember how) and men became menz etc.

So what should we do?

Do what makes you comfortable, Yank. But don't expect that to be the same for every woman.

chibi I honestly believed that 5pm in the dark was no more dangerous than 5pm in the daylight.Until a man jumped out of bushes at me at 5 pm in the dark,that is.Dark=shadows=concealment.He was able to see me,park up,and find somewhere to wait in the shadows.For that point alone,I think it is inherently more dangerous.I don't want women to feel scared.I am so fucking cross I feel scared.

Each to their own. I am quite happy walking in a busy well lit area e.g central London on my own at night but I get majorly creeped in isolated places. I live in a network of quiet suburban streets and do not walk on my own in my area dark. I just don't feel safe.

I am a big believer in using your own common sense AND 'spidery sense'... If it doesn't feel safe, don't do it. I don't think that makes me pathetic.

Sorry should say 'after dark' and 'spidey'

Cheerful, we had some good ideas way back in the thread. I do think it's somehting we should address collectively, it is, after all, all violence against women, or VAW as I shall now call it!

If there was a curfew on men going out at night, but most attacks happen in the home. Wouldn't it mean more dangerous men are in the home?

We'll kill those ones.

SGM - I remember a poster I think you posted on a thread a while back about rape and it was said then how great it would be to put it on th back of every male toilet door in pubs/clubs and just generally get it all more "out there." About why rape is always the rapist's fault. It was very good.

again, i don't blame anyone for how they feel, or the things they need to do to feel safe

however people's perceptions do not necessarily reflect reality

and it is wrong to take our own experience and then say that they form the basis of some kind of general rule

i got off a bus at night, maybe 30 yards from my house, in a well lit neighbourhood, where i could reasonably expect people to be awake etc etc and i was attacked anyway

and none of it means anything in general about buses, night, well lit neighbourhoods or anything really beyond the fact that we live in a culture that normalises violence against eomen, minimises its frequency and reinforces any and all behaviour along a big continuum that serves to maintain this state if violence

no woman should look at what happened to me and draw any other conclusions. the woman who doesn't get the night bus may still be attacked by her helpful colleague. the woman who makes sure to get a taxi may still be attacked by the taxi driver. the woman who doesn't go out may still be attacked by her partner.

do what you need to do to make yourself feel safe, and whatever you need to do to stay sane, but me, i don't think any of us are safe.