To be annoyed after visiting the Feminism section?

[Laquitar]

Sorry, i know its Christmas but i got annoyed.

AF, yes, i have read a bit of a thread last night (in Chat i think) that made me almost cry. But in bad relationships this happens all year - not only on xmas. Actually the men i know want to cook the turkey. But i don't see them as feminists because of this. I think it is like the anual bbq. Personally i'm not interesting in who does the turkey or the bbq but who cooks all year, after work, when dcs are tired. A pasta on those days is imo more important than the big turkey on one day.
If people had a sexist set up yesterday i imagine they have that every day, i don't see how it has to do with xmas.

What do you mean by 'set up'? I can assure you that i started the thread totally on spare moment, not hidden agenda if thats what you mean, honestly not.

The words themselves were OK-it was the way they were said and the context. They would be like the bullies at school, all wide eyed and innocent, and telling me that I just 'took it the wrong way'. I at least have the option of leaving-which I should exercise now and just go.

I disagree with that, feminism in the 70s was a sliding scale with extremists at both ends, there were a lot of radical ideas and some daft ones mixed in with the sensible ones.
The only differences I see are with the complexities of feminists who embrace porn and pole dancing and other areas that as a 70s feminist I find hard to see as empowering or pro-female rights.

I agree NICE.

If you would like an "Equalitist" section then just email MNHQ and ask for one. I like the feminist section as it is, thanks.

laq...you are conflating several of my posts

my referring to "set up" was in response to nicey , since I addressed him directly in my post

so, I shall borrow a phrase from you and say "don't put words in my mouth"

I agree with you that these issues are important all year round

but what exactly is wrong with someone using the arrival of christmas to draw attention to it...it is traditionally a time of year where peopledo re evaluate their lives

ever wondered why there is a massive rise in divorce petitions in January ?

I don't know why people don't start at home with the people they know. There was another thread, that I sensibly ignored, about gender segregation at Christmas. Apparently in the poster's house (and she assumes it is normal) the women do the work and the men relax, and then the women usher the men out and watch Downton Abbey. In my house DH and both did the work-DSs did a lot and they wouldn't let me wash up. DH and I watched Downton Abbey, DSs didn't (not their thing) but one of their girlfriend's texted me about it, we both love it. When I was growing up we didn't have this gender segregation either-my brothers did the same amount as me-anything else was unacceptable.

EF, have you ever really wondered why people don't have fair and equal domestic set ups ?

Feminism is about exploring" why that might be, and not^ blindly accepting that everyone has the background and opportunities to have that, too

It's another example of individulaistic "I'm all right jack" without acknowledging a wider social spectrum

it's a very narrow viewpoint you are displaying there

oops messed up the italics, but you get the drift

If you live with them I can't see why you can't sort it out-what stops you? I have DH, brothers, DSs, nephews. I don't have any DDs, nieces or sisters. I don't go in for stereotyping.

Ah ok i missunderstood then.

It was my brother that I spent time discussing Downton Abbey with this morning.

Oh deary me

some people just don't want to see it

if it's not happening to them, it's not happening

I think even the most anti of Fem-bashers would agree with me here....denial runs very deep

Laquitar I find it's like all most boards on MN. There's good stuff and then there's the odd thread that makes you go "WTF??!". You just hide/ignore those threads/posters who make you feel like that and enjoy the ones that don't.

Personally I love the feminist board and most of the folks who post there. I find a few folks have funny ideas and there is one poster who I feel talks utter shite about men and lumps them together in the same way some people do women or feminists and I hate it - but she has as much right to post as I do to call her on her bollocks.

I also refuse to accept that any one person represents the whole of feminism in the same way no one woman represents all women or one politician represents or politicians or one bishop represents all bishops etc etc.

The whole point of feminism is that we are individuals and deserve to be treated based on our words and actions, not our sex and for this reason no one should write-off the feminist board. Not least because then it does allow extremism to dominate.

Of course it happens but why let it? Tell the men they have a choice-they cook or they wash up and leave them to it. There must have been a first moment with a man when you assumed responsibility for these things-why?

EF, I hae an extremely misogynistic, racist and homophobic family. I'e tried challenging them. Not everyone wants to be changed. Not everyone has the capacity to be changed.

EF, I don't have time nor energy on Boxing Day to educate you about all the reasons why women may find themselves in unhealthy relationships

I think that I would just avoid spending time with them. DH was a choice-I wouldn't have married him if he hadn't been up for cooking, cleaning, ironing, changing nappies etc.

"Why let it?"

Great question. I'm a feminist and yet I have been discriminated against when I had a baby. It's one thing to challenge policy and introduce laws but enforcing them is very difficult and stressful especially when much sexism is so insidious.

There are only so many battles we can fight as individuals.

If they are in unhealthy relationships they need to change or get out. Life is not a rehearsal, you only get one go.

I agree ef, I'm a great believer in try before you buy.
Which again, when I was a teenager was disapproved of by many, and babies out of wedlock were a thing to be ashamed of, and entirely the woman's fault.

EF, I can see now why you find Feminism so challenging

I can change my behaviour but changing the attitudes of others, especially when they are subconscious, is really, really difficult. But not impossible.

Firstly, you can't change an abusive partner, if that's what you mean by an "unhealthy" relationship.

Secondly, it's not always so easy to leae an unhealthy relationship. Why assume it is?

'EF, I hae an extremely misogynistic, racist and homophobic family. I'e tried challenging them. Not everyone wants to be changed. Not everyone has the capacity to be changed.'

You challenge them by living on your own terms, by refusing to compromise or back down to be nice. Just by not falling in with the family views is a challenge to their mindsets.