To be annoyed after visiting the Feminism section?

[Laquitar]

Sorry, i know its Christmas but i got annoyed.

Will read the article and comment later - but just to remind you that International Woman's Day gets pretty roundly mocked too..........

As a man (and a socialist) I would have said some men (a very small number) have the power in this world. Most men don't have any power at all.

I have children of both sexes and I think white, working class boys seem to be given a pretty hard time at the moment.

Just to say that being told how I should feel about men being on a maternity ward, by a man is pretty insulting. Women on that thread told you how they felt. The fact that you think your feelings should override theirs (when let's face it they are the ones who have been through the major upheaval of childbirth) is unbelievably disrespectful. And the mention that you don't want women to have that space to themselves speaks volumes about you Niceysigh.

tl;dr

"too long; didn't read."

1. The inability to accept, understand or pay attention to information when not separated by a header.
2. The ability to arbitrarily read 400 small posts but not a long one.
3. A sign of ADD or lack of reading capability.
4. A very cheap response and an indication of lack of wit.
5. 90% of the time: A lie.
6. A desperate attempt at a comeback used by people who just can't think of one.
7. Usually used by people who've been torn apart verbally but want one last attempt at looking witty.
8. A sign that, not only is someone too lazy and stupid to read but, clearly, too lazy and stupid to even type out four words indicating such.
9. Collect every "tl,dr" post online, and you'll have a good estimate of the number of lazy idiots on Earth, who currently have Internet access.

10. Accurate

thanks a lot mscellophane, now i feel bullied

if you were nicer, maybe i could listen to what you say. you do your points a real disservice by being so mean

Interesting problem seems to be arising in the states due to black men being disadvantaged in education.

Black women are more likely to be unmarried (and particularly unmarried mothers) than any other racial group. They are also twice as likely to be college educated as black man. Black men are more likely to be jailed than any other group. Women are less likely to 'marry down' - they want a mate who is in their own education group, and whilst interracial marriage isn't as frowned on as it was there is still an issue as a lot of black women would simply prefer to have a black partner. The feeling is that the gap in education is contributing to single black mothers who choose not to stay with partners after falling pregnant. Thus contributing to a vicious circle of poverty even if the mothers happen to be well educated.

The problem with a gap in education affecting rates of marriage isn't confined to the US. Its happening in parts of Asia too - though they are far less likely to become single mothers - they just don't marry.

More women are going to university than men in the Uk now as well...

My point is that everything goes hand in hand and has consequences. We ignore issues at our own peril.

"Just to say that being told how I should feel about men being on a maternity ward, by a man is pretty insulting. Women on that thread told you how they felt."

So the MIDWIVES recommending are all male. Hmm. Yes. As were women in the trial. Whatever.

I agree with thunder BTW. Not that interested in a man pontificating about how we should be doing feminism.

the implication that women are becoming to successful/smart for their own good is v hurtful

please, nicey could you stop being so mean?

The women on the thread told you how they felt. Respect that.

People failed to respect my feelings and over peoples over mental health. Respect cuts both ways. It was a professional recommendation that people on the thread saw fit to ignore and instead just came out with brilliantly classic line that women were going to get raped on maternity wards.

Just to add, mental health is a health issue, where as your opinion was about your feelings not a medical problem.

is it no longer possible to disagree with professional recommendations? from whence did this edict come?

'ways. It was a professional recommendation that people on the thread saw fit to ignore and instead just came out with brilliantly classic line that women were going to get raped on maternity wards'

link. please?

anyway, tell us some other ways men are marginalised in our society?

So women are going to be raped on maternity wards is a good reason to challenge these recommendations then? Come on. It was a hysterical thread littered with absurd and kneejerk reactions and people who didn't bother to actually read who was making and why the recommendation was being made. Its like the comment about tl;dr. No people had already made up their mind and couldn't be bothered to look at what was actually being said, so came out with the stupidest reasons to defend their argument. Even the comment here about "being told how I should feel about men being on a maternity ward, by a man is pretty insulting" shows the blind ignorance when it was being made by MEN AND WOMEN.

This is exactly why I say, I think its pointless to argue on MN about feminism though. Cos of the huge chips on the shoulder and the Ali G style attitude of "is it cos i iz black?"

Feminism needs to go hand in hand with making sure that there isn't huge inequalities and problems being created with advances in the position of women. It also needs the concerns of men and equality for men to come with it. There is a very strong case for an enormous overall of maternity in the UK, to make it become a FAMILY service. Using the opposition that the NHS can't afford it or hasn't got the facilities, just holds it back and I find that reprehensible. It needs to be part of a long term strategy to accomodate partners when building new maternity units as much as anything. Choices over whether each individual wants to kick out their partner or not, should come after that prevent the choice in the first place.

Paternity leave?

Difficulty in getting flexible/part-time work?

"anyway, tell us some other ways men are marginalised in our society?"

Seeker I give up. Its not about men being marginalised. Its about the fact that women's right don't exist in isolation. But you know what... why bother trying to explain that concept. Cos all its about is women don't have it as good as men. Obviously.

Pointless pointless pointless.

Yet again you are dismissing women's feelings as unimportant and that your feelings matter more. In the case of.what happens on a maternity ward your feelings are secondary to the women's and child's needs.

No idea what you are talking about with regards to mental health.

I think you'll find most feminists agree with you on that score Youllbewaiting.

Sorry- it was redwinegum who talked about the marginalization of men and boys, not you. My mistake.

But I agree that women's rights don't exist in isolation. Men actually need to let go of a bit their power and control for things to be more equal. And many of them struggle with this, both practically and psychologically.

"Hysterical" ...now where have I heard that before? Oh yeah...from the menz.

I find the term "menz" highly offensive.

In that it stiffles debate and generally shows that use it are not open others opinions.