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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

...to be considering withdrawing my child from collective worship next year

257 replies

Hopstheduck · 07/12/2011 12:07

First time posting in aibu, please be gentle! Grin

Starting thinking about this because the dts have a church service next week and we dont want them to attend. We are more than happy for them to learn about other religions, visit churches, etc. but feel uncomfortable with the idea of them actively participating.

Next sept they will be starting at a C of E junior school and I am wondering about whether to approach the school regarding religion in the assemblies. I know that on occasion the vicar leads these, and I dont want the dts becoming confused, or being expected to participate in christian acts of worship.

It seems to be uncommon these days to withdraw a child. I'd love to know if anyone else has approached it and how it worked out.

OP posts:
ChippingInNeedsSleep · 07/12/2011 12:50

Hops - I would just tell them that some people (like DS1) believe in God and the people that run their school do, but you & their Dad believe (detail Hindu beliefs) and that they are being brought up Hindu. Then I would say it's up to each of them individually if they want to attend assemblies (other religious bit) or not. That if they just want to go along with it, with their friends, then that's OK - after all it's what 90% of the kids are doing anyway!

State schools should be faithless, but until that happens we are stuck with CofE schools (in the main).

Worra - Christmas was a Pagan festival before it was hijacked by Christians to get a bigger following for their beliefs.

DeliaSucksStollen · 07/12/2011 12:51

You can't have your cake and eat it. Either send them to a different school with added inconveniences or go down the C of E route and participate. My husband went to a church school and it put him off that particular religion for life, children aren't stupid and will ultimately make up their own minds. They will not be indoctrinated if you go down the C of E route.

FWIW I don't think there should be ANY state funded faith schools in this day and age. In America if you want a faith school you go the private route. It's high time we did the same here. It would solve a lot of problems.

insertcleverusernamehere · 07/12/2011 12:52

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

GnomeDePlume · 07/12/2011 12:52

I'm not entirely certain if CoE is in fact the main religion if you go on the 'bums on seats' measure rather than the 'oh well if I have to be something then I will put myself down as CofE' measure. CofE is for the vast majority I suspect a passive rather than active choice.

worzelswife · 07/12/2011 12:52

"Morals and social conscience come from religion. If civilisation didn't have religion, at least to start off with, then it would be every man for himself today"

Complete and utter bunkum. Rubbish. Codswallop.

Read here for example.

OP I don't think you should withdraw your children from collective worship. It's interesting to see other's traditions, it can be fun singing hymns and carols, it's good to read the Bible because so much of our art, writing, and culture is bound up in it (at least historically) and because it's nice to feel part of the community, i.e be a cultural Christian on some level, even if they are Hindu. But I have to say it makes me cross that there are religious schools. All schools should be secular.

mrsravelstein · 07/12/2011 12:53

i understand how you feel, as i worried about ds1 when he was 5 going to a school that had a fairly strong christian focus, especially in assemblies, purely because the head happened to be a bit evangelical. he went through a very brief phase of 'getting religion', for a few weeks, but i just ignored it (even though it made me cringe) and sure enough, he very quickly abandoned it, and became extremely dismissive of the whole idea of god.

as to the 'why don't you just withdraw them from school' point, ds1 and ds2 are both now at a CofE school, because we moved house and that's the only one within a 5 mile radius that had spaces. so it's not quite as simple as that. i would much prefer them to be at a non church school, but have to just put up with that aspect of the school.

OldGreyWassailTest · 07/12/2011 12:53

Exquisite - I expect they do celebrate Christmas and Easter............they get presents and Eggs and that is what it is all about dontcha know!

Original poster
Hopstheduck · 07/12/2011 12:54

also loving Omrian's comment!

no, not different meals, they have packed lunches. Occasional limit on stuff at school.

just looked through our nearest schools, 6 are religion based, 4 are integrated primary and junior and just two are separate intake for year 3 - which I'd be unlikely to get two places at when I am nearly 4 miles from. There isn't exactly a lot of choice over the school! I can't do a half hour school run when ds1 is supposed to at our local one at the same time. So another school is very unlikely to be an option.

dc celebrate xmas by presents, not the birth of Jesus, like most of the general population! And no, dont really do easter, maybe one egg but we usually are away.

OP posts:
NinkyNonker · 07/12/2011 12:55

I went to a religious private school at both primary and secondary, we had Chapel instead of assembly. You can't 'catch' religion if you don't want to, what are you afraid of?

cantspel · 07/12/2011 12:57

Hindus belief that the ways to God are many so why should going to a c of e school be an issue?

Original poster
Hopstheduck · 07/12/2011 12:58

Why don't they go to a Hindu school? or do you not feel strongly enough about their religion for that?

there is only one state hindu school in the country and it is in Leicester - 2 hours from us!

Though personally I believe state schools should be secular in any case.

OP posts:
hackmum · 07/12/2011 12:59

NinkyNonker: "I went to a religious private school at both primary and secondary, we had Chapel instead of assembly. You can't 'catch' religion if you don't want to, what are you afraid of?"

Lots of people made this point, but it seems bizarre to me. What is the point of religious schools if not to indoctrinate young children into religious belief? Young children are very susceptible to believing what authority figures tell them - that is precisely why religious organisations try to catch them young.

insertcleverusername "Why don't they go to a Hindu school? or do you not feel strongly enough about their religion for that?" Do you want me to explain it to you, or do you want to try googling "Hindu schools UK" and working it out for yourself?

hackmum · 07/12/2011 13:00

Sorry, Hopstheduck got there before me on the Hindu schools...

WorraLiberty · 07/12/2011 13:00

Well I feel sorry for your kids to be honest.

They have a Christian sibling who is happy to be so, they're having the Hindu religion forced upon them to please their Dad, they're going to attend a C of E school to please their parents and so they can be with their friends...yet they won't be allowed to do as their friends do and attend school assembly.

Who said childhood was less complicated?

Optimism · 07/12/2011 13:01

Does that mean you won't want them to take part in Christmas activities either which is a church school may well have a nativity theme? One of my saddest memories in15 years' teaching is of a little boy while I was on teaching practice. He sat at the back of the hall with a reading book in his hands and a wistful look on his face while all his friends were having great fun rehearsing for the Christmas play. I imagine what confused him the most was why he wasn't allowed to join in the fun with everyone else.

Sirzy · 07/12/2011 13:02

Only coming late but the latest comments confuse me. Why would a hindu family give presents at christmas when that isn't a hindu celebration? Odd!!

But anyway, if (for whatever reason) you send your child to a C of E school surely it makes sense to accept that C of E will be a pretty big part of what is done. Use it as a chance to make your children see that people believe different things rather than a chance to segregate them from their peers.

GypsyMoth · 07/12/2011 13:02

So your poor dc will watch their elder siblings enjoy Christmas.... Participate, open presents etc..... But be unable to join in as they are Hindu?

And also op,don't YOU have much say in their upbringing? It's all ' my DH this, DH that'..

RockingBEYONDtheXmasTree · 07/12/2011 13:03

I went to a CofW primary and was raised Christian (church every Sunday too).

I decided for myself aged about 8-9 that I didnt believe any of it, it took a few months to then persuade my mum that I didnt want to go to church anymore.

There were a few Hindus in my school, they didnt suddenly become Christians through a few prayers, anymore than I stayed a Christian. Its just a "normal" school and some stories. I dont think you are giving your DCs enough credit for having their own minds...

Why does DH object to them praying? As far as I'm aware, Hindus still pray...? Xmas Confused

GypsyMoth · 07/12/2011 13:03

Sounds a bad situation for children to be caught up in

QuintessentiallyFestive · 07/12/2011 13:05

Sorry, but you seem perfectly able to incorporate both Christmas gifts and Easter eggs into your family, so find your stance entirely hypocritical. Well done. I dont often say that!

RockingBEYONDtheXmasTree · 07/12/2011 13:06

AFAIK, most British Hindus celebrate Christmas AND Divali. Surely you dont do one for two of your children, and the other for the other two?!
My sister (Atheist) and her DF (he is Hindu) celebrate both, and his family have done long before he met her. Same as they are having two weddings!

RockingBEYONDtheXmasTree · 07/12/2011 13:08

Sorry, misinterpreted, thought you had said they didnt have presents OP :)

exexpat · 07/12/2011 13:09

Christmas in my (atheist) house involves decorating/lighting up the house, eating nice food and exchanging presents, which are pretty common themes in mid-winter celebrations all over the world, most of which aren't Christian. And most of the 'Christmas' traditions pre-date Christianity in this country. The only Christian thing about our Christmas is the name, and that's just because it is part of the culture of this country.

We also do Easter, in the form of an Easter-egg hunt, and again eggs are a non-Christian symbol of fertility, spring etc. Or am I missing something, and the bible mentions chocolate eggs scattered around the cross?

Original poster
Hopstheduck · 07/12/2011 13:10

cantspel, that is something I have thought a lot about.

I had a friend who was very strongly evangelist and she told me how she found our Mandir at home blasphemous, she couldn't understand how we could have such a thing, multiple deities, offering to them, etc. She was polite about it, but it this sort of thing that makes the two religions totally incompatible. Hindus might believe in all paths to God, but Christians don't and will tell others that their beliefs are wrong.

OP posts:
Takver · 07/12/2011 13:10

""No, actually Takver - I live in the middle of nowhere in deep in darkest Devon! When will people realise that CofE if this country's main religion, and if you are of another faith then either accommodate your children's learning to that or Home Educate. You can't have it both ways no matter how hard you try."

So why do only 6.4% of UK residents attend a Christian service regularly?

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