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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to get the woman to remove her shoes or is she BU by being rude?

503 replies

teddiegoestopeckham · 29/11/2011 20:35

my BIL came over today with his new partner to meet me and DH (his brother). They came over for a few hours for a late lunch/tea.

Anyway i open the door for them (BIL already holding his coat :) ). anyway all the hellos, hugs, come in etc.
BIL automatically takes his shoes off and puts some of the slippers we have out for guests.
She looks very shocked by this and doesn't make a move to either take off her shoes or even ask if i would like her to take her shoes off (i am barefoot)

Anyway when I realise that she isn't taking her shoes off and asks her nicely and politely if she would mind taking her shoes off and if she would like we have slippers for guests (we have a pile like the ones BIL put on and they are very obvious)

BIL looks a bit awkward at his point and then she says' 'no, thank you' and walks though.

I was just stunned and so was BIL obviously.

But it would have been rude to say anything so i just let her carry on. And told DH when he came in about 15mins later not to say anything.

I'm japanese - and to me leaving your shoes on when entering someones house is a no no. I have managed over the years to be okay if someone just walks in to pick something up or drop something off. but if someone is coming in properly. They take their shoes off.

Even forgetting the culture I and this comes from - sure it is rude to reply like that when you are a guest into someones home?

or AIBU in asking people to remove their shoes upon entering??
I'm doubting both now...

OP posts:
LondonMumsie · 30/11/2011 19:33

I would guess that they would probably do it but be a bit surprised. I can't imagine it though, it is such an ingrained and prevalent tradition that it just feels like the right / normal thing very quickly. And anyway why would you bother?

MabelLucyAttwell · 30/11/2011 19:35

My husband and I wear slippers indoors just for comfort but, when we have visitors - a particular family, they always insist on taking off their shoes when they come in. In my opinion, the shoes just get in the way and make our hallway look untidy. It's easy to trip over them when going to another room from the hall where there is not much light so they are hard to see. I wish they would keep them on their feet but we never say anything to them.

flatbread · 30/11/2011 19:36

Teddy, did BIL explain/make excuses for why rude partner did not take her shoes off?

StopRainingPlease · 30/11/2011 19:36

News, I can't imagine such a thing. I lived in Japan for 2 years and everyone I knew, foreigners included, took their shoes off in their own house and other people's.

Even at work you might take them off - I worked in a school, everyone, pupils included, took outdoor shoes off and changed into slippers or indoor shoes within the school. There were extra slippers for visitors. Office workers seem to keep their shoes on though.

I even read of a burglar who was caught when he left his shoes at the window where he got in, so the householder realised he was still in the house!

PreviouslyonLost · 30/11/2011 19:39

I visit people and abide by their 'house rules', however incomprehensible they may appear to me...If I visited the OP I would certainly remove my shoes on request, no matter the state of my tights, socks, smelly feet. It's common courtesy if that's what they prefer, never mind for a perfectly acceptable cultural reason.

Where's the Great in Britain if bloody narrow mindedness refusal to accept personal/cultural preferences like this exists?

PoppadumPreach · 30/11/2011 19:40

Newclippings "Humans are not designed to live in a sterile bubble."

if you saw my house you'd realise i certainly do not live in a sterile bubble! i'm all for my kids getting exposed to mud and dirt but like to keep most of it outside.

but seriously - of course it is disgusting wearing shoes inside - they are full of germs from outside and more to the point - there is no need! why why why must you keep outdoor shoes on inside???

and just to address your point on a sterile bubble - of course we are not supposed to sanitize everything however would it be impertinent of me to point out that the Japanese have a significantly higher life expectancy???

discrete · 30/11/2011 19:42

News - yes.

If you went to someone's house and they asked you to crap on the sofa 'because it is their culture' could you do it? No? Well that is how japanese people would feel about being asked to keep their shoes on inside the house.

JamieComeHome · 30/11/2011 19:46

She was rude not to comply

longjane · 30/11/2011 19:54

hopefully teddie your BIL has learn that he has to be warn any person he brings to your house.
I hope you don't hold against her for the rest of her life.

dlady · 30/11/2011 20:05

Before we had our new carpet, I wasn't too bothered about people removing shoes, as long as they weren't caked in mud. Our old carpet was regularly cleaned but having 2 children grow up on it, there were stains. BUT I would always remove shoes in other peoples houses without them having to ask. Number 1 rule in our house now is that everyone has to remove shoes. The OP is not being unreasonable, IMO especially as it is to do with respecting her custom. I wouldn't want to wear other peoples slippers though.

RedHotPokers · 30/11/2011 20:14

I always take my shoes off in other people's houses. I would HATE to walk any kind of dirt onto someone's carpet!
I am still Angry about a friend of a friend who trashed my brand new wooden living room floor with her stilletos. You can literally trace her steps by the huge indents left in the wood. Angry Angry

iloveberries · 30/11/2011 20:21

poor you pokers that sort of thing would really pi** me off.

strictlovingmum · 30/11/2011 20:51

Shoes in the house, not on, she was being very disrespectful and ignorant.
Since we had children, no one passes the front door in shoes, no thanks, children spend their early years firmly on the floor playing, shoes are filthy and should be taken off. YANBUWink

iwastooearlytobeayummymummy · 30/11/2011 20:58

You sound as though YABU and not a very thoughtful host either as you admitted yourself you remained distant towards her,after she declined your command/request. This probably made her feel very uncomfortable and probably embarrassed your BIL too.
You should have made more effort to explain why this custom is important to you, and then just carried on and been welcoming not distant.

flatbread · 30/11/2011 21:10

So all the onus is on the host to be welcoming, but no responsibility on the guest to be respectful?

I probably would have been very distant too Grin

I think in today's multicultural environment, someone very ignorant or self-absorbed would not know that many Asian cultures require people to take off their shoes.

And if she is that ignorant, she should have asked her partner before hand if there were any major cultural dos and don't at his SIL place.

exoticfruits · 30/11/2011 21:12

I wish it worked the other way-there are people who insist on walking around in bare feet (who is to say what foot problems they have?)-even when I say -'please keep them on'.

iggi999 · 30/11/2011 21:26

How do we even know that the girlfriend knew she was going to visit someone Japanese? BIL doesn't sound like he prepared her very well!

Original poster
teddiegoestopeckham · 30/11/2011 21:29

flat no - he just was generally very sympathetic (we did just bump into each other on the march today very briefly - marching at different ends and all) But knowing him when we talk properly next he will deffinatly want to talk about it and make sure i'm alright and try to make it all okay.

iwas I didn't say anything because I was so shocked and stunned - I know that may be a difficult concept for people to understand - but it is a big insult and something has never happened to me before - I was completely in shock. Which i why I was distant and also because I was insulted. I wasn't 'rude' - just distant. (which i also apologised to BIL for)

OP posts:
LemonDifficult · 30/11/2011 21:33

OP, regardless of the shoes on/shoes off issue MN conundrum, I'd let this go. BiL obviously blames himself (not his new gf) and you should take that at face value.

NewsClippings · 30/11/2011 21:41

why must you keep outdoor shoes on inside???

Well firstly I'd disagree that they are "outdoor shoes", they are just shoes Wink

Keep feet warmer than just socks, so good for environment as you use less heat
More supportive to feet
Protect feet from cooking spills/stubbed toes/stepping on toys etc.
Good for doing housework/climbing steps to clean windows (slippers fall off)
Can pop outside without any need to change shoes (that's what doormats are for)
More hygienic - mopping or cleaning the loo with slippers on and getting splashes on your slippers instead of easily-cleaned shoes? No thanks

etc.

PoppadumPreach · 30/11/2011 21:41

iwas did you see the Borat film? Not talking off your shoes to a Japanese is akin to the behaviour of Borat when he went to the "dinner party". If someone brought a bag with a newly laid turd inside it would you have just smiled sweetly and carried on making him/her feel welcome?

And I know this didn't happen in Japan, but anyone with just a little bit of social intelligence would have respected a host's wishes.

PoppadumPreach · 30/11/2011 21:44

newsclippings with the greatest respect, I'm not surprised it took you soooooo long to come up with these "reasons"

Seriously, do you really go round to a stranger's house and clean their toilets??

But let's not fight Wink

NewsClippings · 30/11/2011 21:44

Fine if it works both ways. But it's very one-sided that - according to some on this thread - any Japanese person supposedly wouldn't conform to a shoes-on custom in return.

NewsClippings · 30/11/2011 21:48

Funnily enough Poppadum I don't sit at the computer all day, I've only just come back to the computer after having dinner and came up with the reasons really quickly Wink

I was talking about my own housework, obviously - can't imagine why anyone wouldn't wear shoes to do those tasks Confused

NewsClippings · 30/11/2011 21:50

What's wrong with "germs from outside"? Do you people never venture outdoors - or doesn't it count if you meet these germs outside your own home? :o