Basically kicked out of an NCT lunch as my baby was crying

[ozpom73]

In my NCT group there are 8 couples, each of us having had our babies a few months ago. One couple offered to host lunch at their place just over a week ago. My husband was working, so I went alone.

My 20 week old DS had a mini meltdown - he was tired and didn't want a nap and was possibly over-stimulated. Everyone hadn't arrived yet, so it was still at the drinks/nibbles part. The hostess suggested I take DS for a walk. I explained I didn't have my buggy. Before I understood what the hell had happened, her husband had brought out her buggy chassis and attached my DS's carseat to it. I was promptly ushered out of the front door. I stood there, rather dumstruck by what had occurred - was I really just kicked out because DS was crying?

Please bear in mind that it was an NCT lunch - every adult there was a parent. My DS is the oldest at 20 weeks and was certainly NOT the only baby who had a meltdown before/during/after that.

I don't know why, but I did return and did go back inside and stay for lunch - perhaps I was hungry? Perhaps I had over-reacted?

What is interesting is that every other friend who is also a parent that I've told that story to since has been horrified and said that my NCT 'friend' was really rude.....I now have no interest in maintaining a friendship with this group as a whole. There are one or two women who I like, but one friend nailed it today when she asked me: 'If you didn't all have children, would you be friends with them - are they your sort of people?' - to which I've concluded, not really, no.

So, was I being unreasonable that I felt upset?

as can ANY GROUP. honestly, the nct-bashing on here is cringeworthy. you could experience exactly the same stuff at a pottery evening class, especially if you are the type of person who compares your every social interaction to school.

It's nothing to do with the NCT. The NCT groups that people talk about are just groups of people who happened to attend the same antenatal class and, in south-west London at any rate, it seems to be pretty much accepted that people do it to meet a group of other parents to hang out with for the first few months. I don't actually know anyone who said "oh you must do NCT - you will get such a great insight into childbirth and parenting" - it was all "oh you will meet people".

A friend of mine still sees all her NCT group 3 years on. I see none of mine because I had nothing in common with them beyond the month in which I pushed a baby out of my vagina.

The NCT as an organisation does not, to the best of my knowledge, monitor or regulate the social interactions of grown adults. In terms of the NCT itself, I have had nothing but positive experiences. The classes were great, the post-natal meet-up was helpful, the group run by a local NCT teacher was pleasant and supportive. We moved to a new area fairly recently and I don't know many people yet so I am doing a short NCT refresher class to meet some other mums. It might be like last time and I have nothing in common with them, or they might be great. I don't know, but it won't be the NCT's fault if it doesn't work out.

I would think it very odd indeed to suggest that a guest at a lunch leave that lunch and go wandering around by herself outside.

There were a million other things they could have offered which would have been more helpful and not involved you leaving. And TBH at these post-natal things where everyone has fairly new babies and are in the grips of severe sleep deprivation, learning how to be a parent, and possibly worse, it's normal for everyone to sit around with crying babies looking a stressed and not a little foxed. That was what happened at our post-natal meet ups when the babies were small. They were for people to sit around with screaming babies - as part of an understanding group of people in the same boat.

So on that grounds YANBU to think them very rude and not a little odd.

Oh I think you should ditch them BTW.

Looking at the last sentence of your post, it seems you've reached a conclusion anyway.

There's lots of ways that the hosts actions can be interpreted, only you were there and only you can decide whether you felt hurt.

See if there's a couple of mums you want to stay in touch with, and maybe organise a get together near Christmas. Meanwhile check out some of the mother and toddler groups in your area and see if there's some potential friends there.

Blimey, people are very defensive about the NCT! I don't think anyone is saying that they are a dreadful organisation at all.

I think the thing about the NCT is that the only thing that unites its members is that they are having a baby at more or less the same time. Most groups of friends are united by more than that, and if it's a group that's united by something else (like a hobby), then the focus of meetings tends to be on the hobby, rather than sitting around chatting. There is also the issue that people parent very differently and new parents can be quite defensive (and vocal) about their chosen way of doing things which can cause scisms.

Again, I'm not having a go at the NCT who I think do a lot of really useful work, just pointing out that the dynamics in individual groups are fairly unusual.

she wasn't sitting round with the baby, though. she was away and waggling a car seat. it is upsetting for a lot of people (me inc.) to see a child scream and not be lifted by a parent or carer.

So the response is to eject her from the lunch?

If I see someone with a baby and they aren't dealing with it how I would deal with it, I assume that they either know what they are doing or are feeling very stressed. And either way a level of interference that these people came up with is not appropriate. A gentle offer of something would be much more tactful.

i disagree. they suggested that she might want to take the baby out (as do many people when their babies are over-stimulated in a particular environment) and she said that she didn't have the buggy. the DH then went into problem-solving mode, as many men do in tense circumstances, such as when his wife is hosting a meal and someone's baby is yelling its head off and the mum isn't picking it up to comfort it.

Some babies sleep well is car seats. I don't see that parents should be forced to care for their children in ways that they know aren't appropriate for their baby, in order to stop "upsetting" other people

For example my babies slept in their own beds, and only in their own beds. Not in car seats, pushchairs, my arms, anyone elses arms. They wanted their cots. If I had someone with a tired crying baby in my house I would not sit there thinking "Oh my god I'm so upset they need to put them in a cot" as it is their baby and they should be left to get on with it as they see fit.

Anyone who thinks it is appropriate to single out one crying baby from a group at a post-natal lunch and basically tell them to go out and wander around by themselves is a little odd IMO. I think these people were odd. This is a bit of en eye opener at how much some people feel they actually have the right to tell other people what to do with their babies.

At our post-natal group with the health visitors when the babies cried they never suggested that people leave. As that would have been just out of order and horrible.

you are deliberately missing the point. she wasn't picking up the baby, she was shoogling it in a car seat. what better way to shoogle a baby that you have no intention of picking up than to transfer the baby and seat to a buggy and push it around?

I too think he was trying to help. Motion is well known to calm babies, so they suggested a walk. You say you have no buggy (I wouldn't interpret that as saying you didn't want to)so they lend you theirs. Helpful I'd have thought. You could have said no. But to be honest, I thibk most people would remove an over stimulated and unhappy baby from a busy place for a cuddle and a calm down.

You are missing the point. She was at a post-natal met-up for lunch with a whole load of babies and parents. These meetings are usually for tired parents to compare notes and support each other. Shoogling (rocking?) a baby in a car seat allows the parent to do what they are there for ie talk to the other parents about how things are going and commiserate as necessary. Going outside on your own in November to wander around by yourself when you are feeling sleep deprived etc and wanted to have a nice chat with your post natal people - well that's pretty sad.

Sorry but OP, you said you didn't have your buggy with you. You did not decline their offer of going for a walk, you just hoped they would take the hint.

Well they ain't mind readers. They suggested a walk as perhaps you looked flustered and tbh if a baby was bawling its eyes out, I'd be a little concerned too and would offer to help the mother. Saying you don't have a buggy is not the same as politely saying "No it's ok, the baby has reflux so we'll just sit here quietly".

The hosts obviously didn't take your oh-so-subtle hint and thought you did want to take the baby out for a walk but couldn't because you hadn't brought the buggy so they lent you theirs. They were being super-helpful. Perhaps a little too helpful but they were probably nervous about hosting such a thing and eager to get it right.

You are over-reacting. Perhaps next time you need to explain to people why the baby is crying and what your plan of action is, because to new mums, a baby crying is disturbing and our instinct is to comfort it. If that had been me I would have been desperate some for help from someone or advice on what I could do to comfort my baby.

And FWIW I am normally the last person you would find anywhere near an NCT group as I bloody HATE other people's kids. But as an extremely anxious new mum who was on the brink of tears every day I found their groups invaluable. In fact when I was pg with my second they gave me the confidence to have a home birth (and yes someone in that group was adamant that she was having an epidural and no-one tried to argue her out of it. In the end, because of everything we had been taught about pain relief she managed without one) and the information I needed that gave me back some control over my pregnancy and the birth. I made a couple of very good friends and will always look to the NCT with fondness. They also took my ante-natal depression seriously and encouraged me to write about it for one of their newsletters with a promotion for the website I had going at the time.

It may not be everyone's cup of tea, but new mums need all the support they can get (this one did at least!)

They could have offered her to go and sit in another room for a bit, or offered her the use of a cot, or loads of things which didn't involve them shoving her out the door by herself.

Some really peculiar ideas about what constitutes good hosting around here.

But the car seat thing wasnt working. The baby was distressed and a dad thought e was helping by providing te equipment for a possible solution.

OP - they're nt your kind of friends. Move on.

But what about the screaming baby? I couldn't have enjoyed myself and had a nice chat if my 20 wk old baby was screaming and unhappy. I'm sure everyone would dislike it too!

hat would have been kinder imo is what someone did for my friend and her screaming baby at my DDS 6th party....they offered to take the baby out for her!

My mate was so tired of trying to calm her month old son down that she readily agreed and my Aunt went away down the road with the baby for a buncy walk up and down.

Erm when I had my post natal group with the health visitors, when the babies cried they never suggested that they leave. As that would be horrible.

I am surprised that so many people think this is an appropriate approach to take with new parents.

People who attend NCT classes are a mixture. In that mixture there will be people who, postnatally, have different ideas on parenting, different ideas about what constitutes appropriate social behaviour at a lunch, and different ideas on how to offer support to a mother with a crying baby.

Believe it or not, NCT does not have a policy on whether it is ok to attach someone else's carseat to their own buggy . People who meet their former class colleagues for lunch are free agents and can behave as awkwardly or helpfully as they want :)

I fail to see what NCT has got to do with this at all!

Am I the only person who had a post natal group where there were often loads of babies crying and everyone would look sympathetic and be gentle with the parent?

They thought they were helping! That is how I would have interpreted it had I been the OP.

most people weren't there yet, sardine, if you read the OP. so presumably they thought she could nip out for five mins and get the baby off to sleep and be back and chatting when the rest got there.

me and my NCT pals used to go to a particular restaurant to meet up because along the road there was a bump in the tarmac that you could push a pram back and over and it would calm the kids down beautifully. at any one time there was always one of us out there... grizzling babies are fine at social events, but ones that are yelling their heads off need the singular attention of their parents ime.

Just to go back to the NCT thing for a minute, I think part of the problem is that the ethos of the ante-natal groups is that these people WILL become your friends. In fact, I remember the tutor in mine telling us that we would all go on to be friends for years and years and go on holiday together.

Actually, of course, we didn't. I was simply excluded from the group of people who remained friends. That was probably my fault as much as theirs. I had a terrible time with my first baby, and I was so envious of people who managed to bf and do it all the 'best' way. They probably found my pain and anger difficult to cope with.

But partly I do blame the way the whole having and caring for a baby thing was set up by the NCT tutor. I think, in retrospect, if I'd gone to an NHS ante-natal class with no expectation that I'd ever see these people again the whole thing would have been less painful.

And that's the problem with the NCT, the way it comes socially loaded. Unless you are lucky, the first few months with a new baby are really difficult ones for you as an adult, because everything seems so high stakes, and you are so raw emotionally. What might be something that you barely notice as a normally functioning adult can feel so huge and painful when you have that extra layer of skin missing in the first few months after a baby.

So I think the OP was NBU, in the sense that her experience in that place and time was one of hurt and rejection, even if in other circumstances (and for other people) it might have been water off a duck's back.