to not want DP's daughter to live with us while her mum moves abroad?

[feelinghorrid]

DP has a daughter from a previous relationship. She's a lovely girl. I don't know her that well (only moved in with DP a few months ago), but she's very sweet and there's no jealousy at all - she's 8. She stays with us every other weekend.

Her mum has since married and had a baby daughter who DP's daughter dotes on. I've only met her mum once and never met the stepdad or the new baby but I hear about them a lot.

Her stepdad works for a big company and a couple of months ago he was offered a job in the Dubai office. He and DP's daughter's mum want to take the job and live in Dubai with DP's daughter and their baby for three years.

DP is fighting this right now and he is hopeful he will be able to stop them relocating. He doesn't want to take the risk they don't return and isn't happy with his daughter being so far away. He also thinks the contact offered wouldn't be enough and lots of other reasons. It's a big fight. He's really stressed and angry about it.

He has told his daughter's mum that she should consider going and leaving his DD here with us. I am really unhappy about that! DP and I have only been together for 6 months and I am 25, I really like his daughter but having her here fulltime would mean I'd end up doing far far more parenting than I feel ready for. Also DP and I both work fulltime. We have activities most evening (we share an interest), and would need to either give them up or hire a babysitter - either way we'd need to be home earlier and it would basically be a massive limitation on our lives together.

I feel quite horrible for feeling this way and don't feel like I can tell DP as he would be horrified I'm not jumping at the chance to have his DD with us. But I think he is quite blinkered about it - we'd need to sort out schools and I think it would be traumatic for her to be seperated from her mum and stepdad and half-sister. But DP says she'd be far worse affected by being in Dubai for 3 years (plus he doesn't know for sure they will come back).

I don't know what to do - should I just support him in this even though I have my misgivings? Or I could tell him how I feel but I'm worried that would make him angry or depressed.

Thing is (and i don't blame you for not getting this - I didn't before having ds) is someone is a parent forever, and it's a constant thing.

Once you've got kids, that's it. They don't fit in with your plans - you have to fit your life around theirs!

I do understand that you're only 25, and only been with this guy 6 months, but that is very soon to be moving in together, regardless of any children involved. Maybe take a step back? You don't sound ready for this responsibility at all, maybe you need someone a bit more footloose and fancy free?

YANBU I wouldn't worry, he stands very little chance of getting a residence order. I think you are having a hard time on here because you are being seen as OW. Your partners child will remain with her mother if that is what she wants and hopefully some sensible arrangement about contact will be made.

higgle, OP is not getting a hard time, her dp is.... I think most have sympathy for OPs predicament. And no way is op seen as the OW (other woman). Her dp has never lived with his ex. The child is 8 years old, and their relationship is NEW. They have known eachother 18 months, lived with each other just a few.

OP, I'd be quite surprised if the court would give him a residence order based so substantially on you doing so much of the care, without hearing from you at all. If his solicitors are any good, they're likely to ask you to do a statement and/or be available to give evidence. So you'll need to think about whether you're willing to do that, and what you'd say. I would think any judge worth his or her salt would want confirmation that you're willing to undertake so much parenting.

Regarding UAE labour laws, they're certainly more toothless than a lot of non-EU countries (eg US, Australia, Canada). But even if every other non-EU country had identical laws, OP's partner would still be putting himself in a risky position by going. This is not to suggest that lots of expats don't have very positive experiences in Dubai- they do. The westerners anyway! It's just obviously something to think about.

If anything the mother will be prevented from taking the daughter & have to stay in UK?

Can that happen?

I assume that OPs partner has PR?

If not, could the mother take the daughter without his permission?

The mother isn't likely to be prevented from leaving the UK herself, but there can be an order that the child can't be removed. It's called a Prohibited Steps Order. OP says that's not what's been asked for here, but the court could still make one. I believe it's most commonly used in cases where there's a fear of one or both parents abducting the child. There's no legal reason why it couldn't be used when the parent also intends to bring the child back. I have no idea how common that is.

DSD's mum has evidently applied to the court to vary the residence order. prob because it says the contact should be fortnightly, and that wouldn't happen if they were in Dubai. OP's partner is objecting to this, and will be asking that the residence order be varied to allow her to live with him. I assume.

You're 25, and hooked up with some lying old geezer with a kid. Honestly, don't you think you think you could do better? I hope my daughters do when they're 25.

He has a biological daughter. That does not mean that he is automatically a concerned and loving parent. I should know as I am adopted. With parental rights come responsibilities. He has a responsibility to his child's happiness considering that he has never lived with his former family and that she has a stable one and a sibling she adores.

Not his happiness and not the OP's. The child. How he could imagine that the poor girl would be happy with what he is proposing I don't know and that's even IF he had asked / talked to the OP about the fact that he would be offloading it all.

Sorry if I got my facts wrong, but I really can't see any court taking residence rights away from the mother and giving them to the father in these circumstances. There would almost certainly be a welfare oficers report and I think they would be very wary of arrangements that included reliance on a 25 year old girlfriend.

Has no one else picked up on the fact that op's dp only asked her to move in AFTER all this kicked off !nd he wanted to 'use' her to get residence?

margerykemp, I believe I did (Thu 20-Oct-11 13:06:36) - "You "have only been with him for a few months" - and it was a few months ago that DD's stepdad was offered the Dubai job."

And others did too around that point in the thread. 'Tis shit for OP, no?

I haven't read all this thread, so missed the issues about this matter being settled in court. Have to disagree with you Flangerina on the PSO. Someone has to make application for a Prohibited Steps Order under the terms of S.8 of the Children Act 1989.

I am just sorry to hear that this matter is heading for the family courts. This will mean lengthy reports and possibly both parties being refused legal aid (though this will depend on their financial circumstances) but worst of all, the child in question will know that her parents are fighting for her and this can do untold damage. My guess would be that the child would prefer to stay with her mum, step dad and baby sister. That's an awful lot to lose, to stay with a dad and a young girl friend who she barely knows. If the parties are entitled to legal aid they will be encouraged (rather forcibly) to attend a mediation meeting, before the whole matter is dragged through the court, with one parent feeling they've lost, and one winning. A child's wishes and feelings would need to be taken into account. Again this is difficult for a child as young as 8, because of divided loyalties, and some parents are not above telling the child what they should say on the matter to the social worker.

I can see it is a very difficult situation and I think FWIW that the OP is getting a very hard time (she should have posted on step parents for a more sympathetic response) well she was on the first couple of pages I read. Why on earth would a 25 year old young woman want a child she barely knows living with her for 3 years. This wasn't part of the deal when she began to live with this bloke. I have seen something to the effect that the dad only asked his gf to move in to give him a better chance of getting the Residence Order varied to him. If that is the case, that is shocking.

OP I think you must tell your DP how you feel and if he doesn't like it, get the hell out of there. The last thing you should do is go along with some plan that you don't want to carry out (understandably) and should leave the parents of the child to fight it out together, then go live your life as a 25 year old.

"Why on earth would a 25 year old young woman want a child she barely knows living with her for 3 years. "

For the sake of the father.

The "problem" in this is that he has assumed an awful lot on behalf of the OP.

Right my 2 pence

Why would you move in with someone before meeting their family eg their children also you have to factor in when dating anyone with children that at some point in the future that the child may want or need to live with you

The mum may die
Fall I'll
The child my become unmanageable to the mum
Runaway
Need to stay with dad due to education

Their are untold eventualities that could happen its amazing these women don't think about that before they get it to the guys bed

I rather think the op thought she would be moving in with her silver fox and dd would be in a different country oh how the plans have come a copper better this comes up now then when she is 16

If your nit ready to be a step mum

DON'T GO OUT WITH MEN WITH CHILDREN

My god it very scary to think many children in the uk live with in step families were their just not wanted

I have been reluctant to post this, but feel it is unfair not to. Whatever the UK Family Courts decide, the mother will have to get a Letter of No Objection from the father for the child to be given a Residence Visa for the UAE.

There is no way the child could live here without the father's permission. There have been cases where single mothers have not been able to track down the biological fathers of their children and so have been refused Residence.

... that said, I feel that the father should give his permission for the child to move to Dubai. It would be a wonderful adventure for her. The schools are excellent and she would mix with children from all over the world. I am not sure who old she has to be to fly as an unaccompanied minor, but that would be worth looking into.

My dh married me whne i had one small dd aged 5 living with me. My other dc's are older and lived independently.
In the 4 yrs we have been married ds1 lft the army due to injury-he had to come home for a bit.
Ds3 has split with his girlfriend so lives bck at home now.
Ds2 has just been told he needs a kidney transplant,he will need to come home and be looked after.
DH has been fine about it all cos they are my kids and he loves me.
Dont get involved if you dont want his children as well.

Not saying that people should not go out with people who have children, but this couple have only been together for 6 months, and have moved in which is not long tbh, and does not sound as though they have thought it through properly and talked in depth about the possibilities and each others worries or concerns.

What the OPs issue is, is the fact that she has not known this man, or his daughter for very long, and now she is being dragged into a court case where he is saying that she will take on full time parenting responsibilities. At this stage in getting to know a new partner's child, for most of us it is still days out in the park or going to the cinema. Not full time parenting. I don't think it is fair on the child either.
Six months is far too soon. I think the OPs boyfriend is the most unreasonable in this situation.

My partner has a child. When I first met him I did not think to myself "I had better be prepared to be this child's full time mother". He already has a mum. People should introduce new partners to their children slowly and gently while they get to know each other and the children can get used to the new situation. Six months is also very soon for living together. Obviously if some sort of tragedy had befallen his mother, I would have done the very best I could in those circumstances. Or accepted that if I didn't like it, the child has to come first.

But it is silly to compare that sort of situation to what the OP is describing. Her boyfriend is basically using her as a pawn in his court case.

i do say if you're not ready to be a parent dont have sex - no form of contraceptive is 100% fool proof... if you old enough to have sex then you're old enough to deal with the fall out if something 'goes wrong'.

That's possibly the most ridiculous thing I've heard in my entire life. Should people who dont want children be confined to celibacy?

I managed 16 years of having sex before I decided I was ready to become a parent. Good contraception is actually highly effective if you follow the instructions. If it goes wrong you still have the option not to become a parent if you choose.
Nobody thinks that your average 21 year old should not be having sex really. But most are definitely not yet wanting to become parents.

Well, call me a bigot and offensive then, because when I was single and childfree, I would not go out with men who had children. Full stop. I did not want a man with that sort of tie or to be a step parent. So sue me.

I also wouldn't go out with short men.

I also dumped men with small cocks.