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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to think this poster is a heap of sexist woman-blaming SHIT?

362 replies

QueenOfFlamingEverything · 19/10/2011 16:23

Here - a nice bit of misogynism from the police in Wales.

How about a big poster suggesting helpfully "Rape. Don't be a rapist. Use your dick sensibly. Rapists feature in 100% of rapes??"

OP posts:
upahill · 19/10/2011 17:32

here'sthescarthing Fair enough I made a mistake.
If a person does get attacked and injured are they not a victim of crime?

I still think that one should do what they can to look after oneself.

I also think the rape trials in this country are a sick joke and the verdicts even sicker tbh.

thefirstMrsDeVeerie · 19/10/2011 17:36

Could they put a picture of a man on it?

Men get raped
Men get drunk

What would happen if they did that?

If they had a poster of a potential victim of male rape on a poster and stuck it all over town?

Do you think that people would nod and say 'sensible'?
I dont, I think there would be a HUGE discussion, debate and a fair bit of frothery .

Thats what I think>

BeyondLimitsOfTheLivingDead · 19/10/2011 17:37

More prosecutions = Less repeat offenders, if nothing else

squeakyfreakytoy · 19/10/2011 17:37

I think longer sentences would be a way forward. Not a slap on the wrist and a suspended sentence.

I am struggling to find the right words now, but what I am trying to say is, if you have been raped, you can never take that feeling away. No matter if the man gets caught, and got the death sentence. You would still have been raped. To me it is a no-brainer that you do what you can to avoid putting yourself at risk wherever possible.

I know it isnt always possible. I know that the majority of rape is done by a known attacker.

If I go out in the car, I know I am a good driver, I know I am not going to speed, or crash. But I wear a seatbelt in case someone crashes into me. It is self preservation. It is reducing my risks of getting hurt due to something that was not my fault.

If I go out drinking, I do not walk home alone, swinging my handbag around, and making myself a target to anyone, be it a mugger or a rapist. I am not complacent in thinking that it wont happen to me. Because it could. Anwhere, at any time.

I dont walk my dog on deserted commons, because there have been many incidents of lone women being attacked in the places near where I live. Yes, we should have the right to walk wherever we want, but the reality is that we cant do this with 100% safety. Its a shit world we live in, but I would rather be safe than be attacked, where I have the ability to do so by making a certain choice.

HeresTheScaryThingBooyhoo · 19/10/2011 17:43

mrsdevere i strongly beleive that if there were posters of male victims of rape people would be up in arms about the 'sick fucks that would do that to someone' it would sicken people in a way that female rape doesn't for some fucked up reason that is beyond my comprehension. of course i am speaking based on the people that i know so it may be different elsewhere.

GalaxyWeaver · 19/10/2011 17:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

handbagCrab · 19/10/2011 17:45

I think there's lots of magical thinking on this thread I.e. 'If I'm a good girl and I don't drink and I get a taxi home with a friend then it won't happen to me', which I think is the message the poster is giving out and is utter tosh!

My friend was attacked & she was completely sober, I've been attacked when sober and drunk. I'm careful & try & look after myself but it hasn't stopped it happening to me. It's really dangerous for things like this to imply that if you were better at looking after yourself then you won't get raped. Like heresthescarything says it implies you have a choice but if you are unfortunate enough to find yourself in that situation, you'll see that really you don't.

HeresTheScaryThingBooyhoo · 19/10/2011 17:47

this is all a jumble in my head but what i mean is, i think there is this idea that female rape is to be expected and whilst people do think "ah poor girl" there is this underlying acceptance of rape as being a risk of being a women that you jsut have to hope wont happen to you. whereas male rape incites (is that the right word) far more disgust and anger in people.

MarginallyNarkyPuffin · 19/10/2011 17:48

And yet Squeaky, you're far more likely to be attacked by someone you know in your home. It's lone men who are more at risk of being attacked by strangers when out alone. But when they are, it's reported as 'an unprovoked attack'. It's not reported that he was 'returning home from a night out' or 'walking alone.'

MarginallyNarkyPuffin · 19/10/2011 17:50

We're back to that idea that for women though she didn't consent, penetration is part of life, wheras for men to be raped is an invasion.

BeyondLimitsOfTheLivingDead · 19/10/2011 17:50

I think I disagree with the poster message for another reason. Knowing conviction rates and some peoples opinions of victims, if I were going to be raped I'd rather it be when I'm so drunk I won't remember than when I've only had one or none drinks...

pigletmania · 19/10/2011 17:50

YANBU ANYONE can be a tartget for a rapist fgs, stupid poster.

HeresTheScaryThingBooyhoo · 19/10/2011 17:53

yes marginally, that is what i was trying to say in a longwinded way.

LindenaVerySpookyPresense · 19/10/2011 17:54

Squeaky - what about the idea that you are probably more at risk of being raped when accompanied home by one of your male friends than if you went home on your own?

Peachy · 19/10/2011 17:55

''I dont walk my dog on deserted commons, because there have been many incidents of lone women being attacked in the places near where I live. Yes, we should have the right to walk wherever we want, but the reality is that we cant do this with 100% safety. Its a shit world we live in, but I would rather be safe than be attacked, where I have the ability to do so by making a certain choice.'

Yes, alongside longer sentences and far more of the zero tolerance attitude

rape is always a crime and the rapist's fault but if some tosser is going to try and rape you, betetr to be in a fit state to recall his face for the police and try to run away if at all posible

MarginallyNarkyPuffin · 19/10/2011 17:57

'If its ok to tell us to lock our doors and not leave things on display in our cars to prevent burglary, its ok to use these posters.'

How do I hide the fact that I'm female?

'Its sensible to tell women not to get in unlicensed cabs or to get so drunk they cant at least attempt to protect themselves if someone does attack'

The Black Cab rapist, who carried on attacking women because the police didn't believe early victims? The (registered) taxi drivers that came on to my friends and I as teenagers, offering drugs?

And realistically, even if you're stone cold sober, the majority of men are physically stronger and larger than women. Fight back hard and a) it's still very unlikely that you will even stall their attack and b) they may respond with greater violence.

MmeLindor. · 19/10/2011 17:58

Handbagcrab makes a very good point.

This kind of campaign gives the impression that if women take care of themselves, don't get drunk, don't travel in unmarked mini-cabs that they are safe.

That rapists are strangers lurking in alleyways.

It gives a false sense of security.

Peachy · 19/10/2011 17:58

Even in your own home a sober woman is more likely to be able to spot arning signs in advance surely?

It's quite possible to be vehemently anti rapist and accepting that it is 100% the fault of the rapist whilst simultaneously wanting people to protect themselves.

It took me years to even accept I was raped: my own fault for putting myself (and him bizarrely) in that situation, etc etc. I'm just glad I had at least a clear memory of events to process and eventually understand.

Whatmeworry · 19/10/2011 18:01

I don't get your anger. I might be a feminist, but it doesn't mean my rapist is. Idealism only works in an ideal world

That.

BertieBotts · 19/10/2011 18:01

Actually I've just thought of another thing.

If it is aimed at stranger rape, say you read the poster, decided it was best to keep your wits about you, so stay sober and fend off the advances of some lech while thinking "Phew! I'm glad I wasn't really drunk, who knows what might have happened with that guy." You go home, having had a good night, and think no more of it.

But do you think the lechy guy just gives up and goes home at that point, having seen that you aren't interested? No, he will most likely head for some other poor woman, who perhaps is drunk, young, naive, depressed, or whatever else makes her vulnerable. The rape still happens. It just doesn't happen to you.

THAT is why it makes more sense to target the perpetrators.

Also, has anyone posted this yet? Don't get raped

limitedperiodonly · 19/10/2011 18:01

I've no doubt that South Wales police and others like them are genuinely trying to be helpful when they put out posters such as this.

However, they misunderstand what I require of the police and criminal justice system.

Crime prevention advice never goes amiss, but in the event of my becoming a victim of crime I would like them to do their fucking jobs rather than advising me to stay indoors so they don't have to pull their fingers out.

Therefore I would like them to deal with me sympathetically, efficiently and to gather evidence without ballsing it up.

I would like them to assist the CPS in successfully prosecuting the bastard who did it to punish him and deter him and others from doing it again.

They could do that by not perpetuating rape myths that allow defence barristers to portray certain victims as foolish, unreliable or culpable under cross-examination.

I could also do without certain posters, equally well-meaning I'm sure, tellling me how I might feel after a crime and warning me that I might blame myself for it.

No need to worry about me. I assure you, I know who's to blame.

HeresTheScaryThingBooyhoo · 19/10/2011 18:02

peachy spotting the warning signs? if someone is intent on raping you, knowing it's going to happen isn't going to help you, they will still rape you.

and can i just ask, what are these warning signs?

garlicScaresVampires · 19/10/2011 18:02

Realise I've probably missed others saying the same thing.
The problem with all these "stay safe" advisories is:
They assume rape is a natural hazard.
It makes sense to say "Don't get drunk, you might fall into a ditch."
It doesn't make sense to say "Don't get drunk, you might get raped" - because a rapist is not some harmless, everyday feature that can't hurt you unless you're bladdered.

Even more bizarrely, nobody says "Don't get drunk, you might fall down an unmarked excavation" - because even if you got hurt while drunk, everyone would blame the hazard. It should have been marked, yes? Sue the council.
If you fall down an umarked hole while drunk, it's entirely the council's fault for not putting up barriers.
And yet, if you get raped by an unmarked rapist, it's your own fault for putting yourself at risk by being drunk.
This demonstrates that:
They assume rape is less avoidable than a hole in the road.

It is extraordinary that rapists are not held 100% accountable for putting their penis into other people's bodies without permission.

If I stick a skewer into you without permission, it's assault, right? Even if you're completely shedded, I should know better than to stick a skewer in you.

But if someone sticks their penis in you and you are drunk, it's partly your fault. Why is this? Shouldn't the rapist know better than to stick a penis in you?

MmeLindor. · 19/10/2011 18:05

Peachy
You could put a man in any kind of position, and only a rapist will rape. Saying that it was (partly) your fault, taking that blame onto yourself makes me feel rather sad and angry for you. Without knowing what happened to you, I cannot see how it could be the blame of anyone but the rapist.

BeyondLimitsOfTheLivingDead · 19/10/2011 18:05