To be utterly shocked at my friend leaving her family...

[threeinmybed]

I can't believe this is happening, I can't believe I'm posting about this... Been hanging about for a few hours trying to work up the courage and trying to word is post right.
Longtime poster, serial name changer so please bear with me.

My best friend of about 15 years has just upped and left her family. She has a husband and two children (one boy of 3 and a baby girl of 10 months). It happened totally out of the blue, and I did not see it coming at all. I actually work with her DH, who is as shocked as anyone.

We last saw one another on Sunday, for lunch. It was just she and I, and she seemed happy enough but a bit distracted. She said that she and her DH had been going through a rough patch and marriage was just such bloody hard work; she felt too young for all this etc. She asked me if I ever thought about just buggering off somewhere, leaving and never coming back. I laughed and said yes, in my worst moments I did and made a stupid joke out of it. I can't even remember what I said now, it seemed so trivial at the time. She said later on that she'd never seen herself being like this five years ago. I asked if there was anything I could help with, she just brushed it off and said 'nah, I'll get over myself!' like it was a joke and we just carried on chatting.

Yesterday, I was on a team building day at work and I got a text message that said not to worry, but that she was safe and she'd be in touch really soon. I was in the middle of no where so I couldnt call her back. I got home later in the afternoon to find her DH standing at my door, in an absolute state. He said they'd had an argument the night before and that she said she was leaving and not coming back, she wanted a divorce and she couldn't take the kids anymore, not one more second of them. She said she was happy to pay her way for them, but this wasn't the life she wanted and she was sorry.

I should say at this point that she did have PND going back about 8 months ago. But her DH interjected quickly, and she got the treatment she needed. She cited this as well apparently, saying the AD's had helped her see clearly for the first time in years.

When the initial craziness had calmed down, and her DH had gone back home I called my friend, who pretty much confirmed all her DH had said. She said that she was seeing clearly now, she'd not been happy for a while and that being a Mum just wasn't what she wanted. She's happy to pay maintenance for them, but she's not sure about visitation rights etc, maybe when she gets settled she can see the kids at my house? It seems she's been thinking this over for a while. I'm distraught. For her poor family, even myself a bit. I'm cross at myself too. Why didn't I talk to her more on Sunday? Push the issue a bit?

She is staying at her sisters who is a few counties away. Far enough, anyway. I don't know what else to say... I can't think of any other information right now. I couldn't think of anything else to say to her. Please help, I don't actually know what advice to give, or how to help right now. My friend and her DH are a massive part of our lives.

For those people who think that she'd be condemning her children if she stayed to a life of rejection... I can't tell you how wrong you are. They adore her. She is a good mum. I I take my tips off her. She's so balanced, you know? She's a fantastic bloody mum. I'd love it if I could have had her as a mum. I know first hand what makes a crap one. Don't know what else to say about that.

threeinmybed - just because you could see that she was a great mum, doesn't mean that she can see that herself, which may be part of the problem (only she knows)

Nicky- if your DH left, the courts would make you 'leave' (if only temporary) your DC's to give the father access. Women serve in the army etc, in past times children were 'farmed' out to relatives, whilst the parents worked, especially in African/American families. They have one thing in common, they can be utterly unsefish to do what is best for their children, under the circumstances.

Why has she got the right to either force her DH to leave the house or take the children off him, to sleep on someones couch, away from everything that they know?

Your so right three

Those poor children. It brings a tear to my eye. They could be asking right now "where is my mummy?".

They could be crying their little souls out for her

They are going to start to get very distressed soon. How can she do this?

I would dearly love to go on holiday without dd for a week but I sure as hell would never abandon her. Children are very hard work. Being a mum is very hard work. Most of us miss the freedom of not having kids however it takes a very ill person to abandon their kids completely. Poor babies. I agree that dads seem to get away scot free. I think that there should be harsher penalties for both men and women who abandon their kids. Why not just send them to boarding school in the future if she hates it that much.

Right this is what i think

I think your friend has done the kindest thing she could .

She hated being a mum , she could not stand to be around her own kids . She expressed dispair and distress at the situation ...was given AD`s and told she had pnd . Mabey she does . Mabey she doesnt . I dont know her so cant say.

What i can tell you is life with a mother who resents being a mother is utterly soul destroying.

My own darling mother , constantly told us that she had given up her entire life for us , and we were nothing but ungrateful bastards who had ruined her life, her chances and her looks.
She verbally abused us , hit us , refused to clean the house or enable us to keep ourselves clean . She wouldnt provide soap shampoo deoderant tooth paste ect. She would allow us to use hot water to wash .
Some days she would not feed us. She treated the dog better than she did us.

It would have been a blessing if she had just fucked off and left. We would have had a better happier life . Even if she had just visited once a month ...

I think some women are just not good parents , in the same way some men are just not good parents . Its just society finds women who leave their kids aborant , somehow it goes against nature .Women grow children in their bodies and to abandon them seems to go against the assumption that women will protect and nuture their offspring no matter what .

Rarely the only way for a woman to protect their child ...is to actually leave them. It is better to be abandoned by your mother than abused by her .

Dont judge your friend too harshly on this , she has obviously thought about this long and hard . Perhaps in time she will regain an intrest in her children and will go on to have a better relationship with them.

I wonder if she is escaping from something a bit...creepy. Someone doesn't need to be physically abusive to be a controlling menace of a person behind closed doors. Just an idea! It sounds so implausible otherwise.

That crossed my mind too Keith or whether there was another man on the scene.

droves I'm so sorry to hear about your Mum but my friend isn't that. She loves her children. Honestly, I know she does.

And Keith I suppose you never know what goes on behind closed doors, not really but we've known them forever. I think there would've been something that suggested all was not right before now.

Toptramp absolutely agree. Men do get an easy ride on this one, which doesn't make it right. I feel very sad at the thought of such young children being without either their mum or their dad. I think she has done them a disservice and I would say that if it was their dad who'd left, too.

OP - Her sister, I think, is in favour because she is telling your friend what she wants to hear. Tread very carefully on this one because it will be very valuable for her to retain some confidence in you. If she starts to have doubts about her course of action, you'd hope that she won't think 'Can't say anything to threeinabed, she'll just say 'I told you so' ". That doesn't mean you have to lie about how unhappy/angry you are but you need to leave a door open. I think you are doing as well as you probably can with this at the moment. Doubt anything you could have said on Sunday would have changed her mind - it was already made up by then.

The 'not sure about visitation rights' is a bit . Again, there is plenty of double standarding on this point because a man reported as saying that would be ripped to shreds on MN.

Flames that's so sad. :(

OP I think its hard for you as you have in some ways lost a friendship, can you see things ever going back to what they were.......... But I do think its sadder for her DH and most of all for her kids

and her sister sounds....odd

alot of people are very angry towards her behaviour, and I am one of them

I dont know what I'd so if a friend of mine did this, I would not cut them out but I would be very very angry too

we just dont know enough, so my overall emotion is pity for those babies

Is it just me who thinks there is a lot more going on as evidenced by the behaviour of her three-year-old who all concerned think is a major handful. Why is he such a handful? Is it just normal toddler behaviour or is he reacting to a terrible atmosphere or worse behind closed doors. It is telling imo that he was fine with his gps.

So many many people put on a different face to the outside, and by outside I mean friends, family, church - everyone. Nobody but the people in the house know what goes on behind closed doors. My friend's brother committed suicide, it was a total shock to everyone and noone knows what led to it, they all thought he was happy-go-lucky.

And OP dont beat yourself up that she didn't come to you. It sounds like her sister is far removed from her life and therefore could be easier to open up to than a good friend you see all the time. If her sister knows a lot more to this it may explain her weird response to you. It is not uncommon to hide things from those you love and if she knows you well would have known you wouldnever have condoned her actions so therefore didn't consult you.

To me you have half a story at best. I think you need to see if she will open up to you a bit more over the next few days.

My H is the nicest man. He is kind to everyone, fun to be with, funny reasonable and chilled out. IN PUBLIC. At home he is sullen moody controlling mean thoughtless vindictive and selfish. Just because it's not obvious doesn't mean it's not happening. Would also explain why your friend's sister didn't go to the wedding- if she knew.

Hope for her sake it wasn't though.

At the moment, her DH has told their DS that 'mummy has gone to see auntie X for a little holiday and a rest', apparently he's happy about the extra time in nursery because it's fun and they do lots of painting. My DS also goes there, and I've advised her DH not to tell the nursery what's actually happened for now. (I took on board about what people said about burning bridges, I'd not want her to feel awkward dropping the kids off if she's back).

This evening, i can hardly take it in tbh. I can't help but think she'll be back, because she is brilliant. Honestly, it'd just be like your best friend just upping and leaving just like that. Can you imagine that? Your best friend, not mine. Yours. I bet you can't, because that doesn't happen to you, it only happens to other people. That was me. People don't get this I don't think, just how normal she is.

Sometimes the people who seem the most normal are the ones hiding the most.

I agree, there must be a lot more to this. She must have been desperately unhappy to leave. Absolutely desperate. She had a good reason, whatever it is. You didn't see any of this, so naturally you don't understand. But you will have to try not to make assumptions about what is going on until you have more information.

I just dont see how she could be able to hide something this big from me... We really are a huge part of each others lives. I can't believe I wouldn't have spotted something. Even a little thing. I'm not a stupid person, I'm not.

She was so happy to be pregnant with her DD, so happy. She was desperate for another after her DS. In the last few weeks, she'd talked about trying to convince her DH to have more. You surely wouldn't do that with an abusive person?

I think if the dh was abusive she would have taken the kids surely.

"People don't get this I don't think, just how normal she is".

Normal people end marriages every day. As said would it have been better for the DC's to be crying and asking why they cannot go home to their beds and toys, while she drops lower and lower?

Then SS would have to be involved whilst he goes for residency, as life as they know it would come to an end.

He should tell the nursery in a few days, they will all need support. The 3 year old may regress etc, they should be prepared.

Yes SHPP I think she would, she must think the children are safe, I didn't think of that.

Take a step back and let things calm down. I wouldnt make it your issue, its not your fault nor is it your job to fix her. I do hope you get some support.

Its all conjecture, you won't know until you have a heart to heart with her, but do you think her three-year-old's behaviour was normal? And I'm not necessarily suggesting anything sinister, he could just be reacting to a very bad atmosphere or very sad mummy.

It sounds like there are a few different things going on here for you, threeinmybed. There's your long and deep (at least for you) friendship with this lady that you appear to feel has taken a knock, which you have to get to grips with. There's the fact that you yourself have suffered from PND, which it sounds like you have battled hard to claw your way back from, the frustrations and effort of which perhaps you are projecting onto someone you know well enough to be able to do so confidently (no judgement here, btw, we are all quite capable of doing this from time to time). Separate from this is your reaction to her unquestionably extreme/dramatic decision, on which you would presumably have certain views whether you were friends with this person or not. Finally, there is the fact that your friend has involved you in her decision, by seeking your co-operation in maintaining some sort of contact with your children. So, four pretty major things to grapple with, unfortunately all at the same time.

I would venture that the impact of your friend's actions on your relationship with her is perhaps something that you can, and should, mull over and settle on over time. It doesn't sound like you are so (for example) offended by her actions as to instantly lose all respect for her. You seem to want to help, while still being very angry with her. Perhaps give yourself the luxury of mulling over whether this is a relationship to be mourned, or one your want to work at maintaining, and in the meantime try to proceed on the basis of what you consider to be the right thing to do.

As for the PND, never having experienced it I would prefer to leave it to those better qualified to comment to do so.

The last two questions follow on from one another. If you can, I would try to reach an objective view on what you make of your friend's behaviour. Is it something you can bring yourself to understand and accept but not forgive? Is it something you cannot even begin to understand? Is it something that you think that ultimately you can help your friend work towards overcoming? I imagine that you probably have a gut feeling about the rights and wrongs of her actions, and I would trust your instincts.

Once you have worked out how you feel, I would let your friend know, and proceed accordingly. This could mean anything from supporting her unquestioningly including by offering your home as a meeting point to facilitate contact with her children, to cutting her off and letting her know she can't count on your assitance, to anything in between.

I would also add that I would try not to let myself be swayed by any third parties in reaching your decision on how you feel about this, although of course they may colour your understanding of what is actually going on.

Good luck, threeinmybed, this is huge emotional turmoil to be going through.

Hi crosshair, I remember you from earlier. Yes, I told her earlier I couldn't ring her because I needed to get things straight and sort out a few things, but that I'd ring her by the weekend, and in the meantime if she needed me, she can stay here and I'll come in my car and get her. She seemed to understand, I think.