To be utterly shocked at my friend leaving her family...

[threeinmybed]

I can't believe this is happening, I can't believe I'm posting about this... Been hanging about for a few hours trying to work up the courage and trying to word is post right.
Longtime poster, serial name changer so please bear with me.

My best friend of about 15 years has just upped and left her family. She has a husband and two children (one boy of 3 and a baby girl of 10 months). It happened totally out of the blue, and I did not see it coming at all. I actually work with her DH, who is as shocked as anyone.

We last saw one another on Sunday, for lunch. It was just she and I, and she seemed happy enough but a bit distracted. She said that she and her DH had been going through a rough patch and marriage was just such bloody hard work; she felt too young for all this etc. She asked me if I ever thought about just buggering off somewhere, leaving and never coming back. I laughed and said yes, in my worst moments I did and made a stupid joke out of it. I can't even remember what I said now, it seemed so trivial at the time. She said later on that she'd never seen herself being like this five years ago. I asked if there was anything I could help with, she just brushed it off and said 'nah, I'll get over myself!' like it was a joke and we just carried on chatting.

Yesterday, I was on a team building day at work and I got a text message that said not to worry, but that she was safe and she'd be in touch really soon. I was in the middle of no where so I couldnt call her back. I got home later in the afternoon to find her DH standing at my door, in an absolute state. He said they'd had an argument the night before and that she said she was leaving and not coming back, she wanted a divorce and she couldn't take the kids anymore, not one more second of them. She said she was happy to pay her way for them, but this wasn't the life she wanted and she was sorry.

I should say at this point that she did have PND going back about 8 months ago. But her DH interjected quickly, and she got the treatment she needed. She cited this as well apparently, saying the AD's had helped her see clearly for the first time in years.

When the initial craziness had calmed down, and her DH had gone back home I called my friend, who pretty much confirmed all her DH had said. She said that she was seeing clearly now, she'd not been happy for a while and that being a Mum just wasn't what she wanted. She's happy to pay maintenance for them, but she's not sure about visitation rights etc, maybe when she gets settled she can see the kids at my house? It seems she's been thinking this over for a while. I'm distraught. For her poor family, even myself a bit. I'm cross at myself too. Why didn't I talk to her more on Sunday? Push the issue a bit?

She is staying at her sisters who is a few counties away. Far enough, anyway. I don't know what else to say... I can't think of any other information right now. I couldn't think of anything else to say to her. Please help, I don't actually know what advice to give, or how to help right now. My friend and her DH are a massive part of our lives.

"It is her marriage that she has walked out on, not motherhood. "
I dunno birdsgottafly. I think we could have lots of interesting conversations about the social construction of motherhood, and the pantomime of same which is sold back to us by The Man, but really? One of the core attributes of motherhood is to 'be there'. Yes, we all make decisions about how 'there' we can be based on circumstance, finances etc. But bottom line, if OP's friend continues down this path - well, she just won't be there, at all.

SexualHarrassmentPandaPop I got that impression too, at the top of the thread.

Oh dear,I can't imagine how awful this must, be but the thing is kids always always come first with me.I can understand any woman leaving any man but I just cant get over a Mum leaving her kids.My heart would be ripped open.I think she might be A.Very ill B.Seeing someone or something has happened to tip her over you don't know about.I wouldn't feel shit about posting as you are only trying to ger support from others and theres nothing wrong in that.Shes lucky to have someone to care ,yes be there for her, but please please please put the support where it should be and that is with the children.
Also she had better be careful becasue if she changes her mind and wants her kids back social services and the courts will not go easy on her,sadly she has legally" abandoned" her children and the SS will deal with her very harshly and show no mercy unless she is very ill.Look after the kids as I was a neglected child and left to raise myself and I despise every adult that let me down.
Good luck to you

She wants contact. Who has decided that the children should always live with the mother, even if she knows that she cannot parent as well as the father?

Some of the damage wouldn't be done to the children of mothers who leave if society wasn't in utter condemnation of them. A bit like changing opinions on any other issue, sexuality etc.

I work with lots of families were dad is the parent who should have the children, imo, sexism plays a part in the reactions on here. You don't know until you give birth whether you can be a full time parent or not, put a less than ideal marriage into the mix and she is better off leaving.

It sounds as though they was not working in partnership.

It doesn't mean that she doesn't love them, she just isn't the best persn to care for them full tme, at present. She has left them in a secure environment, her DH will have help from his mum, they can all recover from this.

I still read DD2 a bedtime story. She's 14. She will kill me for telling if she ever works out who I am.

I skim read the thread and missed the bit about her wanting contact. If she wants contact and she's prepared to pay maintenance, I have to say I'm with birdsgottafly. A non-resident father who has regular contact and pays maintenance is usually considered a pretty good dad. Why should it be any different for a mother?

Some of the damage wouldn't be done to the children of mothers who leave if society wasn't in utter condemnation of them. A bit like changing opinions on any other issue, sexuality etc.

I still read DD2 a bedtime story. She's 14.

the only thing my mum read to me at that age was the riot act..... when I fell through the door at midnight on a regular basis...

Nk- SS won't 'go hard on her', if she wants to go for custody at a later stage then a parenting assessment will be done on both of them and the facts will be considered, she won't be judged on the fact that she is female and left them. She hasn't legally abandoned them, she has left them in the adequate care of the person who has equal PR and rights to them. You are bringing your own past feelings into your post.

I must say if that's the case it has put a different spin on it for me too. I'm sure no-one would advocate staying in a loveless marriage and there's no reason why the father shouldn't be the resident parent.

OP if you are sure it's not down to the PND then you will just have to accept that although it's upsetting that is what your friend has chosen. And try and support the family as best you can.

YANBU to be upset OP but I agree with the posters who talk about marriage and motherhood being some kind of idealistic goal that society forces on women, when in actual fact the reality of it can make you very miserable, desperate even.

And you can love your kids but hate family life equally, it sounds like a paradox but it's true. I adore my 2 but sometimes HATE the life "style" I find it boring, monotonous, soul destroying and have wanted to escape several times. I think women need to be more honest and up front about the reality of this myth that relationships and children are the ultimate fulfillment, because often the opposite is true.

If the children have decent, warm, caring, containing adults round them bringing them up they may well develop better emotionally than if they were exposed to an angry, bitter, resentful desperate mother day in day out.

It is not because she does not love her children. She may feel she has no choice. Whether its because she is depressed, burnt out or just can't do it any more this is where she is. She is calm because she has detached, probably because she needs to be to get through this.

I understand your anger but if she has been planning this and had told you she would have put you in an impossible position of colluding with her behind her husbands back. Or feeling you had to tell him. Or stopping her from going.

It has been a shock to you but I'm wondering just why you are so, so angry? Yes, unless she does have MH issues she has still behaved very irresponsibly. However, is there something in the dynamic of the whole situation that might be relevant? Not judging, just looking for insight to her actions.

Lindsey- you can help a child to make some sense of what has happened ie the parents marriage ending.

This is social conditioning to suggest that because a mother isn't physically with her children that she doesn't love them. It is important for a child to know that they are loved and that the person who they live with can care for their needs, if she cannot she should have left. I have seen the damage done because mum hangs on to the children thinking that she should, because she is the female parent, when she isn't up to the job, full time.

Just listen to her, thats all you can do. Hopefully all she needs is a break? Is it likely that she has PND still?

I'm also shocked at some of the sexism on this thread, about women being "selfish" if they leave and have intermittent contact whereas for a man it's fair game .

It's this attitude which contributes to the demonisation and condemnation of women in our society generally because of all the things we're "supposed" to be, and woe betide if we're not. And women are as bad at perpetuating it as men are.

So what you all need to do is campaign for single sex adoptions, only male, of course, to be stopped, because obviously, by your posts, men cannot parent equally.

I read it as 'contact in the OPs house', ie she didn't want them staying over and she didn't want them in her life in any way other than neatly boxed-off contact on neutral territory once a week or so. IMO she has walked out on them in that situation.

And yes, I get the 'hating the life style' thing - I did and do that too - but I am inextricably bonded to my child and could no sooner leave him than forget to breathe in.

Equally I'm trying not to judge and trying not to see this through the constraints of what a good mother 'should' do. As others have said, it may be that the best thing she could do for her children is leave them, but I do struggle with that. I honestly don't believe that my father leaving me (not my DM) was a terrible thing to happen to me, a terrible, terrible thing that I am lucky to have been able to overcome. So from my own experience, of course I judge other parents who choose to do the same thing. It's very complicated on all sorts of levels. But there are two little people sitting at home tonight wondering why their mummy doesn't love them any more, and that is actually heartbreaking.

Atcually the sexism annoys me too

Man leaves= shrug shoulders
Woman leaves= must be PND

So why can't men also have a form off PND too or deep depression?

Why can't women just be selfish?

No, women must have to have had some mental illness, where men can be perfectly sane!

'contact in the OPs house'

She hasn't got any stable arrangements in place yet, this would work out the best way to proceed. Seeing them in the children's (her old) home would be to confusing for them, she needs somewhere neutral, they need this to come to terms with the fact that she isn't going home. We don't know what type of DH her ex was, she may have a valid reason for wanting her marriage to end, or she may be depressed, but that is secondary to keeping contact with the DC's.

It isn't a selfish act to decide to leave your children, in their own home with the parent who can best serve their interests. It can be selfish to take them with you.

She may not be depressed, she may just be utterly, utterly miserable, there is a difference.

She may well still be acutely grieving her loss of life, I was so bloody angry for so long after dd was born, in the anger stage of grief over losing my previous life, and I hated myself for it as I didn't want to damage her so i overcompensated by trying to be "mother perfect".

I expect her holiday did make her see things clearly. Children can be like a hand grenade into a relationship and it's awful when you realise things are never going to be the same between you and there's no get out.

I think it's sad and unfortunate but I'm not horrified, she's aknowledging and acting on her overwhelming feelings as she can't deal with the rage and stress any more that can accompany being stuck in the prison that is family life.

no birdsgottafly, i;m not sayin for one minute men can't be single parents, but, as a mother, i cannot and will not understand how she can walk away from her children.

I know a parent at my boys school, who is a single 'male' parent, and their children are just as happy as their class mates, who have 2 parents or single moms xxxx

I think, to answer a question, that I'm angry because we share everything. Shared everything, should I say. We have been best mates for all our adult lives, we spoke every day nearly, babysat each others kids, went to slimming world together, the gym together, gossiped together... I knew everything about her. Everything. I'm broken hearted she felt this was too much to share. I'm so upset that I missed the signs on Sunday. I thought she was just a bit down, that she's had a tiff with her DH... She told me things before, we told one another everything. I love her, she's my bloody friend.

I'm upset for her, angry for her, whatever it is I want to fix it. Why wouldn't she come to me? She could stay with me as long as she liked, she's stayed here before for a weekend if she needed a few days to herself. It's not like I don't know it's hard.

People who are suggesting I stay out of it... I don't think I can here, actually. I can't let my friend of 15 years just disappear out of my life, apart from a few scattered contact visits.

I've never met her sister in person, she mentioned her occasionally. I think she came down to visit a few times, but because it wasn't often, I didn't like to intrude so I sort if left them to it, I suppose.

OP I think you are commendable. Its lovely too see your passion for wanting what is right and caring