to wish mil would stp ranting about ds learning to swim and to think a 4 year old doesn't *need* to

[lecce]

Sorry this is long, it probably seem something and nothing but it is getting to me!

Mil is quite a controlling woman - she loves being a gp but can be quite opinionated. Fortunately, we share similar opinions on most aspects of child-rearing, though she has made comments here and there, which I have tended to smile and ignore.

The main 'problem' (though it hasn't really caused and huge problem as such, yet) is that when she spends time with the dc she likes to be in charge and dominate them. I am f/t wohp and dh a sahd so we have mainly got around this by her seeing them while I am at work - thereby giving dh a little break and not annoying me!

When ds1 was about 6 months old and I went back to work she said she wanted to take him to swimming lessons. Now I can't swim and dh was new to being a sahd then and unsure about whether he could/wanted to take ds to the parent/ child sessions, so we agreed. I will admit I felt a little put out about it because I felt that she wanted to have a 'project' with ds - it wasn't enough for her to visit him, she had to be the one to teach him to swim. I told myself I was being silly/ a bitch and the swimming lessons went ahead, with much fanfare from mil.

Ds was always a little lacking in confidence physically and I became aware that mil was having problems getting him to join in with some of the activities the class were doing - splashing/etc. She was never horrible about it but she did make several comments comparing him to other children and this annoyed me. I raised it with dh and he felt I was just jealous of his mother taking ds swimming, there may well have been some truth in this so I let it drop.

Another annoyance was that I am a teacher and she continued with the lessons during the school holidays. This was ok in itself (though I will admit a couple of times I deliberatlely accidentally arranged other stuff on those days so it had to be cancelled) but she lives a 90 minute drive away, suffers from insomnia and the lesson was at 9.45am. She would arrive right at the last minute, in a complete flap and bark orders at me about the stuff he needed. It was a pain and I began to think if it was so hard for her why didn't she just drop it? We never asked her to take him. It became clear dh felt the same as I did as when I mentioned her lateness/stressed manner he agreed and said he was worried it was too much for her.

Fortunately, I then went on mat leave with ds2 and it all fizzled out a little and then ds turned 3 and too old for the accompanied classes anyway. We considered starting him on the next classes but money was pretty tight when I was on mat leave and it was not our priorty. Since then (this was over a year ago) mil is always on at us to start him on the classes saying we 'really must get it sorted' and asking whether we have 'managed to sort it out yet' and sighing heavily when the answer is 'no'. The thing is, we have looked into it but I really don't see any hurry. I have done some research and it seems to suggest that most children aren't physically ready to swim before 7 and he will get lessons through school before then, right? He and his brother do 2 other classes - both of which they asked to do and love and to do a third seems an expense we could forgo - or AWBU?

The thing is, now she has said that she is going to start taking ds1 to swimminng lesosns again - why???? Why can't it be our decision? I feel she has decided that we are so irresponsible we were never going to get around to it and it has all been left to her yet does he really need to swim now? I say no. I am also annoyed that she doesn't offer to take ds2 to the same classes she took ds1 to. Imo, that would be the more logical step and would mean she had treated them both equally but instead she has this obsession with ds1 swimming but couldn't care less about ds2! (Btw, I don't expect her to take ds2, just feel it would make more sense than what she is proposing.) Also, I am not sure how she would deal with any reluctance on ds's part (I am sure there would be some because he would be nervous) and just feel that she may handle it in a way dh and I would not be happy with - I'm not talking about endangering him, obviously, but he does lack confidence a little physiacally (though has improved a lot) and I don't know how gentle she'd be and how much comparing him to others in the class there would be. Most of all, I really don't like being told that this is happening.

AIBU to tell her no?

Your child needs to learn to swim. End of. It would do you good too, it's never too late. And for chidren it is so much fun!

I absolutely agree Cory. My 4 and 6 year old have been having lessons. The 6 year old is clearly absolutely ready and has started swimming unaided very quickly. The 4 year old is in no way ready and making no progress. I am going to have to continue with the lessons because his sister is getting them and it's not worth the aggro of stopping but really, I'm going to be wasting my money. What he needs at this age/stage is to be taking swimming regularly for fun.

And actually, almost all the kids in DD's class who've been learning since they were 3 made very slow progress (and we're talking small expensive groups of 3 not your bog standard leisure centre classes). She's caught up with the majority within 2 weeks. There's a couple who are like fish but they clearly have an innate talent.

I also think you need to look at your lifestyle - to be quite honest, we're rarely around water where we live and the kids are NEVER around it on their own.

YABU. As others have already said learning to swim is an important life skill. Your ds may not be confident in the water but by going regularly he can gain confidence. Wouldn't you like to think that if you went on holiday and spent time by the pool you could relax a little knowing he can be safe around water or in time, if he wants to go swimming with a friend and their parents?
Because you can't swim and never needed to, you probably think its something that isn't as important as it is.

I think your mil, despite her lateness, is doing you a huge favour by taking him whether she is paying or not. She is doing a 3 hour round trip so she obviously thinks its important.

Tbh, I think a lot of it is to do with jealousy on your part, your mil is doing something with your ds that you might like to do but don't have the time to do or it might be one of those things that you never get round to doing. I remember when ds1 was little I kept saying I'd take him swimming, never got round to it then we went on holiday with pil and my mil took ds1 swimming, inside I was moaning to myself that it should be me taking him for his first swim but if she hadn't done it I know it would have been quite some time before I did it and why should ds1 miss out?
Chill out and enjoy a couple of hours with ds2 :)

I didn't actually learn to swim until I was 10 but was best swimmer at school when I left primaryl know adults who have learnt and gone on to be brilliant swimmers. But I still wanted mine to learn as early as possible for fun and safety.
Ds has kayaked and sailed since he was 9. I wouldn't have been happy if he was not a really competant swimmer. He has bronze medallion and when he is 16 next month he will do lifesaving course so he can use it to earn money.
He had swimming lessons for 13 years and says he misses them.

Cory - I agree that it isn't necessary to swim at any particular age but most people do agree that learning to swim as a child is useful and can be life saving. And the best way to acheive that is not, IMVHO, to have two parent neither of which have ever taken either of their children swimming.

Its not going to happen magically with a few school swimming lessons at 7+.

I'm not having a pop at OP who does seem to have realised that her childree aren't going to magically learn to swim without actually being taken to a swimming pool!

If your MIL is annoying you about it then pre-emptive action and being able to say "yes we are taking him swimming this week" should do it.

I think it is lovely that she wants to do it, and that you should be more grateful. Yes, but being told to be grateful never quite has the desired effect, does it? As I have said, I have plenty of reasons for not feeling more grateful to her.

Well, ds2 (he's 2 btw as someone asked) is booked in to the accompanied class which is now at 11.30 on a Tuesday. Ds1 is booked in for Fridays at 4.30 - the nearest centre to us only offers 4-6 Mon, WEds, Fri and then Sat mornings. Ds already does another class on Sat ams and Weds pms so that only left Mon or Fri, so we have gone for Fri. This really takes mil out of that equation as I don't think she would want to be travelling back in rush-hour every Friday and no way is she staying over every Friday - and tbf, don't think she'd want to. I will ask dh to ask her of she'd like to take ds2 to his, though as I do think it would be nice for her to do for him what she did for ds1 and the later time would be ideal for her. We will be paying for all lessons either way (no free ones anymore ).

Thank you for all the detailed replies you've given me - guess this AIBU has a happy ending .

Can I ask - stupid question alert - does ds1 need plain black trunks or can he wear the summery/beachy ones he already has? Is there any thing else he needs?

My DS has just been wearing normal swimming shorts - not trunk. They use woggles and floats in the class but they're all supplied. Goggles maybe? Although the kids in my DC class who had them just seemed to spend an inordinate amount of time faffing and fiddling with them instead of getting on with what they were meant to do!

mrsgravy I am surprised what you say the younger kids making slow progress.

We live somewhere hot and it the norm to have a pool. When both older DC's started school at 3 there wasn't a single child in their class that couldn't swim 25 metres unaided.

Shorts: most pools allow almost anything vaguely resembling a swim costume. Not unusual at our pool to see some kids in their ordinary pants, or even in a full (Neoprene) wetsuit.

I spent my first 3 years on the beach (literally, was our front garden) in a Med. climate, & otherwise grew up somewhere normal to have backyard pools, and (despite my mother paying for private lessons, too) never learned to swim properly until I was an adult . That was when I got goggles, they made the difference.

I always pay close attention during Parent Watch Week when we get to sit close in and listen to DC swimming instructors, I've learnt a lot to improve my own swimming that way!

I think you take swim lessons, too, OP; it would do your own confidence no end of good.

Some lesson say that they should have tight shorts, but if yours insists on that then they will tell you, they won't expect it at his first lesson. It's just so that they aren't hampered by too much fabric. I'd just send him in the shorts he has for now. I'd also get him some goggles, but apart from that he just needs a towel and a bag to put it all in. Some swim schools give out hats as well, so they can easily identify what group they are in as they all have different colours.

I think you have found the best solution lecce. I think DC often respond best to qualified swimming instructors. As an addition to school lessons, very useful.

I think it was best to remove MIL from the equation. Even though her reasoning about the DC needing to learn to swim was sound, it is not her decision to make about where, with whom and be in control of it. Also the progress the DC make will not be subject to her scrutiny and possible adverse remarks.

hurrah, a happy endng. Tell your DH (or you if you take him) to stay in teh water for 15 mins and play with DS (both) after their lesson. It is worthwhile.

Any costume will do IME and goggles are well worth investing in particularly for older DS who may be more scared of the water.

What I would say is the following:

• You can teach them quite a lot yourself by just taking them swimming, re not being afraid of water.

• I think swimming lessons before the age of 2/3 are a luxury rather than a neccessity.

• If they start learning at 4/5 they progress very quickly anyway as their bodies are strong enough/their brains are developed enough to do the strokes properly.

• Before they are 8/9 (even after then you still have to watch and take care) you have to constantly supervise them in the pool, whether they are good swimmers or not.

• Sometimes a child being a good swimmer early on can lead parents to be overconfident and not supervise them enough in the pool.

• I've found it almost a middle class meme that kids have to learn to swim practically as they emerge from the womb. Came across grandparents on holiday bragging about grandkids being able to swim at 2/3 etc

• If your MIL is so keen on swimming lessons then perhaps she would like to pay for them? Ours cost £88 per term so £176 for my two girls

My MIL would like DD1 to have piano lessons soon. So would I but realistically we can't afford it. DD1 and DD2 are allowed to do two activities each - at the moment it's swimming and dancing (similar price to swimming).

Yes but if you have a pool your kids are presumably in it most days aren't they so they're bound to progress incredibly quickly? Here in the UK, if you don't have your own pool, you're probably talking about kids going to the local leisure centre once a week or so.

you seem very petty OP

spitefully arranging to do things on purpose so she cant take him to swimming, digging at her that she "jealously guards, barks orders"

it really isnt showing you in a very nice light tbh

This really takes mil out of that equation

ah well you achieved your goal in the the end didnt you

spiteful really

Well, it seems to me that MIL was making rather heavy weather of it so why not do it without her?

And if she was that bothered, she could have reorganised lessons herself & presented a done deal.

I don't see how it's petty to find someone controlling and overbearing.
GPs needs should be taken into consideration but don't come first.

If someone behaves in a controlling way towards me my first reaction is to reassert my control, rather than lie down like a doormat.

Scrambledeggs If you read my post, I said that those were the only times available, so I have not 'spitefully arranged' anything. I'm sorry, but after a hard week, there is no way I could cope with having mil to saty every Friday. If that makes me a bad person, then sobeit. As I said, I doubt she would want that either.

I have also said that I would like her to take ds2 to the other lessons, so it's not as if I want to cut her out altogether. I find it odd that she goes on and on about ds1's lessons but has never mentioned ds2 swimming. She also pays into ds1's ctf every month but has never set up anything for ds2, so that is aprt of a whole other issue as well...

Actually, recently she thanked me for being a dil who lets her do as she wants when she sees the dc and said that she has a lot of friends that don't have the same experience with their dils, so I can't be doing that badly .

I was, fairly, berated for the length of my op and I could mention many, many things that may explain my reasons for feeling cool towards her. Some of them would probably look petty as well, but, hey, I can'y help how I feel.
I don't think I've been spiteful over this, I really don't.

I have never seen a 3 yr old swim independently, and I'm in Australia. I have seen lots of four year old swimming. We didn't take ds to lessons when he was three, because he was too naughty, and we were too busy when he was four and I felt very guilty when I saw other four year olds swimming. I've started lessons now, at five, and in four lessons ( one a week) he has learnt to swim about ten meters on his own. I think it is quite important that he learns before he starts school in feb, or he will be behind his peer group.

I've seen 3 year olds swim independently - not my own DC, but friends of theirs - two of DS's friends could probably swim about 100 - 200m when they were 3.
Does it matter?

Not really - I'm just amazed. I see the three year olds at their lessons and they are all fairly hopeless.

I got DS a full neoprene suit from JojoMamanBebe when he had lessons for about £18 as the pool building is awful and he got cold but when he started going in unaccompanied, they asked that I not do that anymore as it improved their boyancy and I guess give them a false sense of security or make it harder for them to learn. These days he wears the sun suits I bought for holiday. I don't think pools have a uniform as such - anything goes as long as they're comfortable.

DD never gets as cold as DS used to (he would get blue lips!) so she never progressed past the baby neoprene suit and now wears just a swim costume.

Good news on starting the lessons - did you check when the adult courses are too? :)

When he started lessons sorry not had. He still has them now

I have seen 3 yr old swimming-quite often. I have seen mothers sitting in the swimming pool and dunking babies underwater as a peepo game. They were having great fun-I wished I had done it when mine were babies. Even if they are not swimming at 3 they can be getting water confident.