Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

feral teenage mum rioter- does she deserve her council flat and her child?

302 replies

porcamiseria · 10/08/2011 22:21

www.thisislondon.co.uk/standard/article-23977196-shame-of-the-mother-who-saw-her-bad-daughter-looting-in-tottenham.do

I get that there are underlying issues, and that castigating the "scum" underclass is not going to acheive anything but this story for me, epitimises things

how can anyone defend her right to be a mother, and her right to benefits and a council flat? now she will go to prison, her poor child will either go to his grandmother or into care, and the cycle continues

something needs to be done to disincentivise girls like this from having children. I am not advocating sterilisation, or having kids wrought off their mothers in labour ward BUT we have a society where girls like this have babies, and they are the kids that end up rioting

people say that education and support is the answer, but in some cases people should NOT have any more kids and I think we are being far too liberal, she's a bad un. end of.

OP posts:
organicgardener · 14/08/2011 00:50

This isn't a problem solving thread.

It's a textual riot.

MoominsAreScary · 14/08/2011 01:09

I must live in the wrong area!

fargate · 14/08/2011 01:14

It seems like the end of Parental Responsibility has become a moveable feast and is now extending to yp in their 20s. Whilst I appreciate that adolescence [in particular being dependent on parents] now extends well beyond what it was 20 years ago and that there is a correlation between the legnth of adolescence and the health of the economy.

In law, [Children Act, 1989] it has always been 18 but in practise has always been 16 mainly because the needs of 16-18 yr olds aren't clear cut, are greater, more complex than under 16s, limited resources are directed to younger dependent children. [looked-after children being different]

The needs of yp 16-18 tho well known are rarely met and there are few services for them - yp well-supported in childrens services are cast adrift on the day of their 16th birthday. As long as I have been working in my field there have been grave injustices visited on the families of yp and their parents of this age.

That said the welfare of an 8 year old is much clearer.

Hopefully, this will become a test case looking at the needs of all the members of this family.

madhattershouse · 14/08/2011 01:14

No moomin most people are on huge waiting lists, we were almost made homeless and were told that it could take 3 years to be offered a permanent place, and thats with kids. The common assumption is wrong..you have kids therefore the council house you...simply not true, ask anyone who works ther or has had dealings with the housing teams. There are vertually no places to house people as the councils have sold most of their housing stock. It is an urban myth that getting housing is easy if you have a child!

madhattershouse · 14/08/2011 01:16

Sorry moomin I was trying to say you are not wrong, didn't come out that way!

MoominsAreScary · 14/08/2011 01:29

I know! waiting lists are years long where we are, the hostels arnt nice places to be in either.

We were lucky enough to be offered a council flat after a year living in private rented accommodation as the landlord refused to carry out repairs (boiler broke before we moved in so no heating/ hot water amongst other things) the council condemned the house as inhabitable.

Me and h were both on low wages and couldn't afford to pay another deposit out. We didn't have to go into a hostel as h was working shifts ( I was on ssp due to pg complications) and you had to be in the hostel by 10 pm and had to stay there 5 nights a week ( dh shifts were 3 till 11 and night shifts) the flat we were given was only temporary accommodation though.

I know quite a few teenage sp and like I said earlier was one myself for a long time and they have all had to go into hostels before being given a council house,

BonnieLassie · 14/08/2011 01:29

Kick them out and make them apply for housing in a different area, they have abused the goodwill of the council where they are now.

TheFrogs · 14/08/2011 01:41

oh god my sides hurt. Goodwill. My own dad was a housing officer..I know their opinions on tenants. Grin

MoominsAreScary · 14/08/2011 01:45

I didn't think they let you apply in other areas if you were evicted due to behaviour or rent arrears, they class it as you making yourself intentionally homeless

ChickenLickn · 14/08/2011 03:38

Everyone in this country will have done something bad at some point and been angry etc.

Therefore AIBU to demand that EVERYONE in the country must be whipped for their sins? Its high time everyone paid the price for their badness, whip them all I say, starting with porcamiseria.

Rah rah.

beancounternomore · 14/08/2011 12:58

The OP worded the thread badly - she acknowledged that. However I find amusing that more scorn and vitrol has been directed towards her for asking a question on a forum by many, than towards those that burnt down homes and businesses and killed innocent bystanders.

But then it?s very easy to sat behind your computers, to compete to be seen as the most understanding/liberal. I wonder if you would all be quite so understanding if it was your home burnt to the ground, or your relative beaten to death?

PamSco · 14/08/2011 13:27

Er who is defending arsonists and murderers? I haven't seen that on this thread.

Gillg57 · 14/08/2011 13:36

squeakytoy - I've no reason to doubt what you say about access to council accommodation. Unless of course you are referring to London where that is absolutely not the case and the person who referred to a 10 year waiting list is spot on as far as I am concerned or my children for that matter.

beancounternomore · 14/08/2011 13:58

PamSco - fair point. I was referring to the general understanding (on various other threads) to the rioters, compared with the reaction the OP received.

maypole1 · 14/08/2011 14:02

ChickenLickn sorry speak for yourself never done any robbing, stealing or looting or arson and if I did I would loose my job then loose my home

And it really makes we giggle when I actually here people state they have nothing to do with their child's behaviour that attitude shows how big the problem with poor parenting is

Were I work we often here those who have failed to provide boundaries,guidance or good role models when their children are young ring their hands when their teens and out of control and say oh its not may fault he is just bad

maypole1 · 14/08/2011 14:04

And like I said any one who is really worried about this family can have them live with them. Unless its just hollow lefty bleating.

And when she gets kicked out it might focus her mind on raising the eight year old with better values unless she feels that has nothing to do with her either

Migsy1 · 14/08/2011 14:20

Mother and baby homes might be a good idea. They would be cheaper than dishing out individual council flats and there could be an element of care there. Therefore, the girls could learn good parenting skills and be under supervision looking after their kids. I think this would benefit people all round.

alemci · 14/08/2011 14:35

also it may prevent them getting pregnant again by another lad if the homes were strict about people staying round and helping with their education. No I am not suggesting anything like the Nuns in Ireland

MoominsAreScary · 14/08/2011 16:15

If hv or ss think teen mums are struggling they can allready go in mother and baby units,

So what are you planning on doing with all the bad parents who arnt teenagers or on benifits? Or is it just young single mums who are bad parents?

ChickenLickn · 14/08/2011 21:35

Has anyone read "the spirit level" on teenage pregnancy?

They said that because the 'healthy life expectancy in poor areas is so low, it actually makes more sense for people to have children when they are younger (and have less health problems and more energy.)

Therefore, to reduce teenage pregnancy, we must reduce poverty.

mathanxiety · 14/08/2011 21:44

I can't believe mother and baby homes are being seriously advocated here after the long and sad history of such places in the last century, especially in Ireland -- but they existed in the UK (including NI) too. The vilification of teenage mothers and single mothers is not a pretty sight.

No one is seriously falling over trying to defend any of the rioters, Beancounter, just trying to ask why teenage or single mothers are the villains of the story?

ChickenLickn · 14/08/2011 22:21

I will defend the rioters!

I was looking into why anyone would do this to their community. This explained it for me;

Why would someone look after a community that did not look after them?

We have seen rising food, utilities, trransport and more costs, and people are really squeezed. The cost of living has risen faster than social support like job seekers allowance. - This means people are living in deprivation and social exclusion (having to choose between a meal and a warm home, and cant even afford a pint at the pub). The children have no hope for the future, all they see is massive unemployment. All the things that gave them opportunities (EMA, university, youth clubs, etc) have been taken away from them, cut or placed out of reach.

AND YET! Cameron continues to insult them on a regular basis (scroungers and all that vile language), while they see rich individuals - who can surely want for nothing and have money beyond their wildest dreams - get away with not paying their taxes, with MPs fraud, bankers crashing the economy and still keeping their jobs and also being rewarded with bonuses!?!

organicgardener · 14/08/2011 22:23

LOL @ "Defending" the rioters.

Are you playing Devils advocate?

ChickenLickn · 14/08/2011 22:37

I am deadly serious!!! This is really important - No one has rioted like this since, um.. the last time the tories were in power?

Its important to understand why suddenly people are attacking their own communities. It is really weird and really serious.

This government has effectively been beating the poorest people with a stick. Is it any wonder they turn around and strike back?

maypole1 · 14/08/2011 22:45

ChickenLickn

news.sky.com/home/article/16048584

SHAME ON YOU

Swipe left for the next trending thread