7yo often home alone in the morning, WWYD? If anything?

[Hufflepuzzpig]

I genuinely don't know. Neighbour's DS (nearly 8 but acts very young for his age) always goes in the car with his mum in the evening to pick up his dad from work, and he's not allowed to stay home/on the shared front lawn on his own while his mum goes.

In the mornings though, DH has noticed the DS is never with them, so the mum comes back and then takes him to school. I guess he must still be asleep or just doesn't get dressed on time or doesn't want to go.

Is that ok at that age? I wouldn't leave a 7yo home alone, but I expect many do and I don't think it's as terrible as DH does. He is generally more paranoid/helicoptery than me though. I know it's a really subjective issue, and the age at which parents let DCs be home alone varies massively.

I'd be happy for him to just come over for that time (about 30mins) in the mornings, even if he's in his PJs, should I suggest it? We don't know the parents that well, they are lovely but very shy and his mum in particular struggles with English. I could suggest it to the DS though, he likes it here.

I guess what I'm basically asking is - is nearly-8 old enough for this to be absolutely none of my business and I (and DH!) should chill because it's fine? Or is it a bit young to be home alone even for a short time?

And there will be fewer and fewer joben where the family is an island and only mother can ward off disaster.
I was just making the point, frantic, that different parents have different ideas and I think that it is a very good thing to start leaving an 8yr old (who wants to be left) for short periods and I wouldn't expect anyone to wasting the time of SS over a responsible parent who wishes to give independence in an age appropriate way.
Although I can see parents having problems with getting a car out and being away for 20 mins, I think it is a bit OTT to have to get them to come outside at that age to hang out the washing. By 7yrs I had no anxiety about where they were in the house or garden. Going to boarding school has given them independence in a different way.
I would expect a school to be over cautious with DCs, they have health and safety and the prospect of parent's suing if something went wrong-they watch their backs.
I wouldn't leave someone's DC-I only left mine because I knew them very well.-

Exotic there is a world of difference between leaving an 8 year old for five or ten minutes to step outside the house to hang out washing and leaving a 7 year old for half an hour while you go out in a car! In truth, I would, probably, have left a 7 or 8 year old in the house on their own while I hung out washing, but not while I was gardening as the garden was far too big and, had I been at its furthest reaches, I wouldn't have been able to hear a child calling me from the house. However, when my eldest was 7 she would have been in the house with a 5 and a 3 year old which I wouldn't have been happy with, they were normal and did have spats over toys/books etc from time to time! So, as the weather was fine, (or I wouldn't have been hanging out the washing ), I used to encourage them to be outside, in the children's garden where I could keep an eye on them! By the time the youngest was 7 she was in the house with a 9 and an 11 year old, so I was just outside the back door and there were two other children to run and raise the alarm if anything untoward occurred. Therefore I never had the situation, as far as I can remember.

Nor did I ever say that I would involve SS, even in the OP's situation. I would go round and offer to have the youngster. Generally, I think some people are too anxious for their children to "grow up" these days, and that too much "independence", given too young, can be just as damaging, in a different way, as keeping them "tied to apron strings" too long. I am firmly of the opinion that regular spells alone in the house, while parent/carer is out in the car is too much, too young for the simple reason that it increases the odds of an accident happening when no adult is around to cope, that's just simple maths!

I hate anecdotal "evidence" but I suppose some of my attitude stems from an incident which happened when I was an 18 year old newly wed. We lived in a modest, semi-detached cottage at the time and the attached cottage was occupied by a couple in their late 20s or early 30s who had two DDs aged 4 and 7. One summer's day, I was out in the garden when the lady next door's head appeared over the wall. We were standing there chatting for no more than 10 minutes or so when I suddenly saw an upstairs window open, next door. In the seconds that it took me to alert my neighbour and for her to reach her back door, her older DD fell out of the window to the concrete below. Apparently she had just worked out how to work the safety lock on the window and had opened it simply because she could! (Fairly typical behaviour for a 7 year old as they are programmed to be inquisitive.) She knew the dangers of leaning out of windows, the mother swore, and was "very sensible", the locks had been "for the younger one, really". The child died three days later in hospital, of head injuries.

I let my children (5 and 7) do what they like in their own time, I hated all that over management (play outside for an hour, don't read for more than an hour, let's all do this/that).I often don't hear anything from them for up to one/two hours, sometimes I go and check on them, but I don't need them within my vision to feel they are safe in a house/garden, I actually think that's odd, they are not extensions of me and don't need to do what I'm doing in the same place all the time. I trust their piercing screams or running to tell me if there's a problem, obviously if they hit their head silently I would not notice for a while, but that's as true of me as it is of them, and with more than one child, I trust them to be on the alert for each other when I'm not in the room.

"Far from it, I have felt that I have needed to defend myself from the insinuations, mainly from you and seeker, that I am, or have been, an overbearing mother whose children must hate her and can't wait to leave home!"

I have made no such insinuations. You have, however, repeatedly called m, irresponsible!

I have said this before on this type of thread but having moved to Britain from germany I am horrified by how little people trust their children here. Having grown up with a single mum independence was very important-she was not neglectful before anyone jumps in or expect me to do too much, but she taught me well how to behave when I am alone, around strangers, in emergencies etc.

We all walked to and from school by primary 1, so age 6. We practiced the walk a lot, sometimes my mum came and accompanied me because it was nice quality time for us. At one point my teacher actually made a joke about her coming, as in it is not normal to walk with a 6 year old. So it's very much expected for children to be capable by themselves.

I did go to an after school club for a while but by the age of 8 I was going home with my keys, went into the house, locked behind me, made myself lunch and then started my homework.
Every now and then I was really daring and turned the TV on... oh how scared I was that mum would find out and be upset at me and take away my independence.

I was also alone in the morning, German primary schools start at different times and end at different times every day.

It was only just an hour or two I guess, as my mum worked part time. I am sure she wouldn't have left me a whole afternoon at that age.

I do believe not leaving kids alone till secondary age is really odd. I even know families here now who don't let their 13 year old take a 30 minute train by themselves.
How is it surprising that these kids then struggle when being expected to live by themselves about three or 4 years later?

I always think that if you give children responsibility and freedom they learn to deal with it. I was allowed to use matches with my mum around, it was a special thing we did together. I understood why I couldn't use them without her.

When working as a nanny I told a three year old that she could of course use a knife, but only when I am around. She never took one without me being there and always asked. Even at that age she understood the importance but was also proud that I trusted her to be such a 'grown-up'.

Same with alcohol. Whoever said they tried alcohol while their parents were out-maybe if the parents wouldn't have mystified it that much when they were in you wouldn't have done it. I remember trying wine at primary school age, finding it absolutely disgusting and would have never tried it by myself because of that.
Being allowed to drink a a teenager as long as mum was in/knew that I was drinking made me try alcohol and never ever drink too much when I was old enough to buy my own. Unlike a lot of people I have met at uni who were never allowed to try a bit and then went totally overboard.

So yeah, of course things can happen when we are out, but we need to equip children with an understanding of danger and tell them that we trust them etc. Being shouted at never upset me too much. But the fear of losing my mother's trust by doing something stupid did.

I would go with littleducks suggestion.....

seeker "perish the thought that they might want to paint". Is this not specifically directed at me? Does it not imply that I am an overbearing mother unwilling to let her children do anything they wanted? Actually, when they were very small, we had an agreement. In the mornings they did what I wanted to do, so I got my jobs done while not having to stress over what they might be up to. In the afternoons, they chose the activities and I concentrated on keeping tabs on them all and didn't even try to do anything in the house or for myself. A good lesson in turn taking, sharing and respect for other's needs.

On the other hand, I have used the word, "irresponsible" twice. Once in direct response to the idea of, possibly, leaving a sick child of 7 with a temperature, which was misunderstood by the poster I was addressing at the time and subsequently apologised for. And once in general after your snide remarks to me. Hardly calling you repeatedly

To get back to the OP; said child is taken to the afternoon pick-up, not left at home alone. Said child plays with OP's child and OP is next door neighbour, yet OP has not been alerted to the fact that 7 yo is home alone in the morning and may call on her for help in case of anxiety.

This doesn't convince me that child knows that he is alone in the morning (still asleep?) or that he would, necessarily, be happy to be home alone (therefore how would he cope if he woke up?) It doesn't convince me that there is a contingency plan in place for child if anxious. It doesn't add up.

I wouldn't be calling SS, nor would I be accusing them of neglect. I would go round and say I had noticed he was home alone and was genuinely concerned. I would ask if they would like me to keep an eye/ear out or bring him round? OK, I'm over protective and nosy, so shoot me!

It just amused me that if a child was happily inside painting a picture they would be uprooted and taken outside because you wanted to hang the washing out, and it's not safe to leave a child alone inside the house.

You have used the word irresponsible several times. As I am the only person on this thread who has said that they regularly leave thie child alone at home, I'm not sure who else it could be directed at! Particuarly as you seem to be sepcially bothered by planned alone-ness, ratater than emergency aloen-ness.

It amuses me that you seem to think your children always doing what they want or feel like doing at the time is of paramount importance but...[shrug]

I would ask you to point me to my use of the word "irresponsible" other than in the two instances I have cited. I did use the phrase "not the most responsible" once, which is not "quite" the same thing. I genuinely hadn't noticed that you were the only one who left your child habitually at age 7, if that is, indeed, the case. I wonder why I got the impression that more people were doing it? [shrug]

As to planned vs emergency "alone-ness", I will continue to be bewildered by anyone who would increase their child's chance of being in danger if there was an alternative. Equally bewildered by anyone's view that any 7 year old is capable of judging whether or not they would be ok if left alone. Would you think your 7 year old the best judge of when to go to bed? Even if that meant they were staying up until midnight, or beyond, every evening?

Having re-read your posts I think your DS must be older than 7/8 now and so its all fairly academic anyway.

Here Here Wanna

Im a laid back mother who many would think irresposible. My kids play out everynight from 4-7.30 riding bikes, building camps etc.

I did the same when i was little. I used to walk to school alone in the Infants as this was the norm where i am (in Gateshead). I will be letting my DD's walk to school and back alone after the holidays. I couldnt let them go earlier due to an extremely busy road.

I think its vital to teach kids how to be independant and make their own choices. It never used to be like this years ago here.

I think it may depend a lot on the size of garden. You mention a 'children's garden' which intimates there is an adult garden. My garden is such that I would have heard any screams or squabbles and the only time to worry was deathly silence-in which case I would investigate. Every one has different circumstances, expectations and DCs -which is why it is impossible to say 'what is right for all DCs'.

I don't think the DC is judging whether they can be left alone. They are asking if they can be left alone and the parent is doing the judging. Mine constantly said they went to bed too early-again they were asking-I was judging.
We can all criticise other's choices. I wouldn't criticise your choice of boarding school-you may have excellent reasons that have nothing to do with me. I was lucky and didn't have any reasons, so I would rather mine learned independence by being left alone for a couple of hours at 13yrs than going away to school. I don't know why we get this idea that one person's choice is fine and another's isn't. People make the right choice for them-and while I appreciate that you have said that you wouldn't call SS, frantic,-others just jump on their high horse and say they would! I would contest the fact that they were actually good parents for shuddering and saying 'never'.

There is no way I would leave my seven year alone in the house not even for a few mins. This morning for example I caught him climbing up onto the kitchen unit as he couldnt reach the jar of jam! Accident waiting to happen! Other children may be a bit more grown up at that age and this is just my opinion

Didn't notice the boarding school element. Now there's irresponsible!!!

I'd be far more inclined to make a teenager walk to the bus in the morning, than leave a 7 year old in bed while I drove her there!

In retrospect I remember that, when DD1 left pre-prep (end of year 3) she moved to another prep school which didn't have a bus service from our village and so I had to drive her to school. I did leave her in the house while I walked the 4 and 6 year old to their bus pick up point but she could see me from the front windows at all times and, had she needed me, could have opened the front door and called me.

Why is boarding school irresponsible?

It is cutting the apron strings a bit more drastically than 20 mins home alone!

In reply to frantic

This discussion has left me with the overwhelming feeling that I am an over-protective mum
I left my DD10 home alone for 10 minutes while I popped to the shop for the first time ever a week ago.

I too was under the impression that leaving a primary-age child home alone for even short periods of time regularly (daily?) in a planned way would be enough for SS to "have words".

I intend to re-evaluate my own family life in light of the opinions expressed here - it opens up a world of new opportunities for me
I doubt DD10's dad (exH) will be happy - but it seems clear that my position can be justified if I were to plan for DD10 to be home alone for an hour or so a day.

And, thinking about it, while I don;t think that leaving my child alone for 10 minutes every morning is putting him in danger, I often let them do things that do. They both sail boats, canoe, dd rides horses, often barebac, without reins and over jumps, they hike, ride bikes, swim in hte sea and own penknives. The cook, use tools and light fires.

Irresponsible? You be the judge!

The SS will not have 'words'! If they do you can have some back-politely.
I don't know why UK lags behind the rest of Europe in terms of responsibility and independence.

Swallows and Amazons, Famous Five and most DCs literature would have to be re written!!! In the days when I read them -it wasn't strange, they were things that any DC did if lucky enough to live in the right area, have enough money for boats etc.

exotic, someone, I think it was seeker but don't hold me to it, said something about mother's who believe they are all invincible and that only they can thwart danger. I have never subscribed to that particular school of thought and you will see that most of my posts specifically refer to parent/carer. "Cutting apron strings" is not the same as "putting at risk". Apron strings need to be cut!

HopeForTheBest I don't know the figures for childhood accidents in the home in the countries you mention. I base my judgement and decisions purely on statistics and keeping risks to my children to a minimum without mollycoddling them to an extreme. I wouldn't leave a 7 year old at home alone under any circumstances. Statistics show that they are still at a pretty high risk of having an accident (compared to older children/adults) and I wouldn't be comfortable thinking that, should something unfortunate occur, they might be unable to summon help as, quite apart from the immediate physical danger of such a situation, such an experience might dent their confidence, resulting in them actually regressing wrt coping alone.

For me, it is a purely pragmatic, mathematical exercise no matter what the child may feel capable of. I wouldn't start to leave them alone (for more than five minutes or so and certainly not travel from them by car) until they were a good bit older. I don't know where you got the idea from that it was common practice to leave children alone at home at this young age here 30 years ago? I would have been "popped round" to the neighbours and so would my nephews and nieces, who are all now in their 20s and 30s.

Probably I am a good bit older than you frantic and I walked to school and took 2 younger DCs with me.(over a mile down footpaths to the next village) We went out to play in the village and came back for meal times. There were no mobile phones.