I don't think I am but am prepared to be told I am if the MN Jury thinks so

[fuckmepinkandCALLmegoran]

DD1 is 12, she is at her dad's this weekend, and has gone to her grandmother as they have a farm and it is silage time.

She has just sent me a picture of herself in overalls DRIVING A TRACTOR WITH A TRAILER ON IT

I have texted her and she is delighted to be allowed to cart the "near home" fields where she doesn't have to go on the road.

I am most displeased about this. I think it's dangerous and irresponsible.

But past conversations with ex when DS was this age did not go well, as he cannot see the problem nor can his family. They all did it at that age.

So, oh MN July, AIBU to think she's too young, it's too much responsibility and far too dangerous?

I said up the thread. There was row after row after row about DS doing it.

And

"But realistically, with DS when I said he couldn't cart because it was driving on the ROAD underage and I wouldn't allow him to go, his Gran or Grandpa just lifted him from school on the Friday and I didn't get a say in the matter.

(me and ex were still married at this point)

I went down to get him returned, was told I was being ridiculous and they wouldn't tell me what field he was in, I was making a show of myself etc etc etc. I waited til he came to get his cup of tea, said I want a word in private, MIL went batshit and yelled and bawled and all of the 12 people round the table piled in and told me I was being paranoid. He was 14, bigger than me, I could not physically lift him like a 3 year old and put him in the car. He wanted to be there."

It's all don't listen to your mother, she doesn't know about farms and farming, she's stupid, she's paranoid, we've been doing it for years and nothing has happened blah blah blah

heard it heard it heard it

FMP, you are absolutely right that this battle is too big and multi-faceted to fight alone. This is why I really hope you will at least contact your solicitor and HSA to seek their advice, even if you cannot then take it further. The big hitters are needed here, you can't reason with unreasonable people.

It must be soul destroying to have to deal w

...deal with people who place such little value on a child's life, especially after your son's narrow escape.

Sorry for random phone posting BTW.

i think yabu too

we used to do this on my friend's farm a lot younger than 12!

You used to tow silage trailers on tractors unsupervised?

We used to travel in cars 4 on the back seat with no seatbelts when I was a kid. I always put ds in a car seat though.

Ever since the roll-bar law came in (30 yrs ago?), tractors are VERY safe.

When I mentioned this to my DCs earlier, they went nuts, & demanded I acquire relations with a farm so they could do the same. What fun for a 12 yr old, and @ £35 a day.

Word of advice: when she gets back to you, big her up for it. However uncomfortable you may feel about it, she has done something grown-up & responsible; she will feel very proud of it and if you knock it, it might undermine your relationship with her.

YABU (as long as its legal!), but I do understand the pangs of maternal concern

my girl friends used to amaze all with their trailer skills, such as reversing large trailers onto the ramps at tyre and exhaust centre etc, getting wedged lorry out of a car park for its driver etc.

Another guy I knew did mount a wall with his tractor and trailer, and a girlfriend jacknifed her trailer - father was furious - but neither came to any harm

But it's not legal - it's not legal for a 12 year old to even be on a tractor, let alone driving one towing a large trailer unsupervised.

Agriculture is a dangerous industry. I wouldn't be sending my 12 year old to work illegally on a building site or in a factory either.

Before you lawyer-up & get all Islington on her, think about how your DD will feel about it. Assuming she likes her father & grand parents etc, what is she going to think of you if you send in a bunch of officious strangers to stop her doing something she is enjoying / thinks she's good at? I'm sure that any decent solicitor will be able to find some regulation / legal precedent to allow you to have your way, but surely you can find a better way of getting back at your X?

Most farm DCs have done at least this by age 12; tractors are very safe to drive, mostly because the accelerator is hand operated and because they have safety cages. She'd probably be at far more risk riding a bike on suburban streets...

For the record - it is ILLEGAL for her even to be on a tractor at her age. Honestly, it won't take a decent solicitor, the leaflets stating this are linked to on the thread.

Again, to all those of you who say "we used to do it" - first off, were you driving a tractor round for fun or was it actually towing a silage trailer? Second, as I have stated a million times, it is the thin end of the wedge, next she will be put in the position of driving on the ROAD. Again, have stated this a million times on the thread, that's what happened to my DS. And third, IT IS ILLEGAL FOR A CHILD OF 12 TO BE ON A TRACTOR.

The fact it is illegal means there is NO INSURANCE COVER ON HER IF ANYTHING HAPPENS. If she has an accident and injures herself or someone else THERE IS NO INSURANCE COVER BECAUSE IT IS ILLEGAL FOR A CHILD OF 12 EVEN TO BE ON A TRACTOR.

Oh and as to a bunch of officious strangers stopping her doing something she is enjoying - just tell that to a policeman the next time you are caught driving your kids without car seats in the car.

And it is NOT about getting back at my ex, I have no interest in getting back at him, as I have stated again and again, I had the same arguments and discussions when it was DS who was driving unsupervised and on the road, so the fact that the ex is now the ex and not the DH is totally and utterly irrelevant.

And not all accelerators on all tractors are hand operated either.

Lifeisa4letterword- the OP has checked the law in her country which relates to this- it's more than a regulation , it is against the actual law for the 12yo to even be on a tractor.

Perhaps you'd be better off moralising about how safe tractors are for children to somebody else- the OP has already explained how her son was involved in a serious tractor driving accident while working on the same farm. The OP has first-hand experience that, actually, untrained underage children are not safe to illegally drive tractors.

FMP - I think a lot of the problem you are getting on this thread are coming because this is your daughter rather than your son. I think there are an awful lot of misplaced "it's empowering" type comments. If this had been your son (a few years ago) I think you would have seen a lot more YANBU type comments.

This is not a feminist issue it is a safety issue.

• It IS illegal (as you know)
• It IS dangerous (as your son knows)

By the sounds of it your ex & ex inlaws belong to that group who 'cant see the problem' in anything they do. From your description they are deeply unpleasant to anyone who challenges them. They use the shouting, bullying tactics because they dont actually have a good argument.

I would go via the solicitor & HSA route if I were you (did you get in contact with them by the way?). Undoubtedly if they are stupid and careless about your daughter driving the tractor then they will be doing something stupid and careless elsewhere. Getting authorities onto them will be doing their employees and everyone else in the neighbourhood a favour.

I just find it incredibly offensive that I am being accused of only doing this to "have a go" at my ex or the statement that "before you go and get all lawyered up and Islington"

If I wanted to "have a go" at the ex, when I discovered that the kids were being sent to his mother's on his access weekend is when I would have "had a go" - I didn't because I genuinely believe that what he does on his access weeekends is up to him.

But I cannot and will not allow him to act illegally with regards to the children. Why why why why is that so hard for people to understand? The Law in Ireland states that a child under 14 is not allowed on a tractor, much less drive it. So, that law doesn't have to be obeyed is what people are saying? But if I came on here saying my ex is taking my child in the car and driving at 100mph or driving without a car seat I would get total and utter support.

And I don't understand the difference?

It was dangerous, it is illegal.
12 year olds might be able to hold a steering wheel, but they have no road sense and a tractor is big enough to run someone over and also do a lot of damage. The reason 12 years olds are not allowed to drive 1 ton vehicles is a very good one.
YANBU, and your ex in laws sound like a right shower.

And to all those who are saying sure it's fun we did it etc - suppose its your child she knocks down and seriously injures. There would be no compensation if your child lost a limb, my DD has no insurance since she is DRIVING ILLEGALLY

Miggsie- x-posts. Thank you. That's the point I keep trying to make - the government have decided to make this law for a good reason. Just like the car seat law. It's not optional, it's the LAW

I think a lot of people who have posted on here saying you are being unreasonable are really only trying to cover up their own irresponible behaviour.

I have been shocked by how many people on here dont know the law yet are quite happy for their own kids to spend the summer on the GPs farm. It took me seconds to look this up for the UK.

I think at this point as well there are a lot of people posting who have only read the OP and nothing else, so don't realise it's illegal or how dangerous this farm is.

I still find it really shocking that so many people think it is okay - I hope they're speaking from cities with kids who've no chance of getting near a tractor anyway.

I can't even imagine responsible farmers allowing this either. To farmers, farms are businesses very much like factories and treated as such.

let's give 'em a big hint.

READ THE WHOLE THREAD.

You know, there are loads of posters on this thread who have been rude about me, about the feelings I have that it is wrong, dangerous and irresponsible to let a 12 year old drive a tractor. I have pointed out repeatedly that the tipping point for me with this was finding out it was illegal and as such it breaks the LAW and there is no insurance cover in place should anything happen.

How many of those posters would either let their own child break the law like this or would have no problem with my daughter seriously injuring their child in a situation where there would be no compensation?

Seriously I cannot believe how many people think it is "all Islington" to want to actually do what you are supposed to do and OBEY THE FUCKING LAW

LaWeasel -

I am finding the criticism of me and my parenting grossly offensive and quite horrible - do these parents drive their children about in cars with no car seats? Because back in the day when I was young we all used to be piled into cars with no seatbelts or car seats. Times have changed, we have moved on as a society and LAWS HAVE CHANGED.

Same thing applies in this case, and yet I am a spoilsport who is stopping her daughter doing something she enjoys and only doing this to get back at my ex.