The Non-Feminist Point of View

[JamesHuff]

I have noticed over the last while that the Feminist section has grown over the last bit.

This does not surprise me, but I feel compelled to ask why this site has begun to ascribe to a sociopolitical ideology when it was originally a resource for parents.

I think that as a result of this discrepancy, non-feminist points of view should have their own section as well. I hope people who disagree with inequalities feminism has created within our legislation will be compelled to express themselves more often.

I don't see it as unreasonable. Since there will be disagreements on various topics, I just figure a non-feminist based section would be in order. This way parents have a choice that reflects both sides of the coin.

Aaargh, want to do it in order but read this

swallowedAfly "you surely don't want to spend your evening defending a potential rapist with a small prick ilyt."

No, I want to defend the right of a person to put across their point of view in a reasonable and polite way, without being sworn at, belittled and abused,

Isn't that the basis of a civilised fucking society?

I just googled AVFM and got AudioVisual Facilities Management.

They seem pretty reasonable unless 'speedy service by fully qualified engineers' is evil Menzpeak for 'down with Harriet Harman'.

Although their logo is kind of phallic....

A HA!

AnyFucker "politeness and respect needs to be earned and deserved..."

So when you first interact with someone, AF, do you treat them disrespectfully and rudely until they've proved themselves to you? Or do you treat someone politely when they are polite to you, even if you disagree with them?

"I am afraid he will be having a very sly smile at your naive take on the situation, ILYT"

I really don't care; I'm not doing this because I care what he thinks.

Twoddle! There was no arguement because he never produced one. Just because he used lots of impressive sounding words doesn't mean he was saying anything worth answering.

I have also seen much harsher things said to women on mumsnet then has been on this thread. This idea that people are more horrid to men then women on here is rubbish.

And finally as lots of other people have mentioned the reponse on here was based not simply on his comments on this thread but content on external sites. So even if you think he seems like a lovely young man here surely you are not suggesting that his publicly held views that women like to be raped, amoungst others, are ones we should feel the need to engage with.

SybilBeddows "ILYT I am totally confused as to why you think that we have to follow the rules he states on his blog and which he does not himself follow elsewhere. do you think he's, like, in charge or something? hmm"

Not sure where I said that....

I said that what I read on that blog entry about debating with someone who is diametrically opposed in viewpoint to you (and I don't think they were his ideas, just quoting) seemed very sensible, and that it seemed a shame to me that he was following those principles here, whilst the people on the thread, whom I consider totally capable of doing so, rejected any form of reasonable discourse in favour of puerile shit slinging.

well said Celadon.
You do reasoned debate if you want ILYT. Have fun.

Here here! In facts lets invite him back so that ILYT can have her reasoned debate.

swallowedAfly "would you feel the same way if he'd come on saying, 'i'm anti racial equality and i don't like the way those who like racial equality have such a strong voice on here and think those of us who don't believe in racial equality should have our own section'? and had then posted links to white supremacist sites?"

That's the first question that's really given me pause for thought. But as long as he is not offensive in the way he addresses people, I do think that any subject is up for discussion. He didn't use offensive language or insult anyone directly. Just because you find his opinions and ideology offensive, does that mean that the only recourse is to rubbish his sexuality?

See, I find it as offensive as racism, actually. If a black person is being a fucking twat, I want to call them a fucking twat. Not a fucking black twat, because it doesn't matter what colour twat they are. Similarly, I think the OP is a twat, but that doesn't meant I want to tell him he's got a teensy dick, any more than I want to tell you (assuming you're female) that you've got a big baggy cunt. Why would I?

How on earth would that add to your point?

ILYT, I examined the premise with which he (by his own admission) came to this site in the first place

I then followed some of the disgusting links he unilaterally decided to honour us with

And I formed an opinion, based on that

Just because he doesn't swear and uses long words doesn't confer any more kudos to what he says. That kind of thing doesn't impress me. Some of the biggest twats in the world could bemuse and confound you with their rhetoric. He wasn't even that good at that

Surface politeness is one of the most chilling characteristics when you get a hint of what lies beneath

I'm done

Without even reading any replies to my endless (chronologically mainly accurate) drunken posts, I think I might go to bed now.

I just fucking hate hypocrisy. Wherever I see it.

ILYT - I think it's clear that reasoned debate is always off the agenda in AIBU. I have commented on it in the past myself.

To those who think ILYT is deluded - then clearly ignoring the OP completely and not creating a 19-page thread of low-level insults and in-fighting is the only way to dissuade him and his views from this place. That worked well, then.....

ILYT...did you actually see the blog post where he stated quite clearly he was coming to Mn to cause trouble, sir up the "bees nest" (as he put it) and would be reporting back ?

Your responses on this thread will give him great copy.

MN'ers disagreeing amongst themselves over the big bad man ?

It's wank fodder, seriously

stir up

I am happy to go with MNHQ's decision to ban him (repeatedly) tbh

They don't ban lightly, at all

(if they did, my heels would be smoking)

Celadon you make some really valid points - coming back to that..

AnyFucker "ILYT, I examined the premise with which he (by his own admission) came to this site in the first place
I then followed some of the disgusting links he unilaterally decided to honour us with
And I formed an opinion, based on that"

Wouldn't it have been more worthwhile then, for anyone else reading the thread, to have addressed that, rather than just chucking sexual insults, AF? I know that you are more than capable of incisive comment, so why not directly challenge him on his views, rather than what was said?

Wow

I really had no idea hateful stuff like that was on the internet. Naive or what?

Well done, comrades, esp. Hully, Pag, AF and mayorquimby.

CaptainBizarro "ILYT - I think it's clear that reasoned debate is always off the agenda in AIBU. grin I have commented on it in the past myself.

To those who think ILYT is deluded - then clearly ignoring the OP completely and not creating a 19-page thread of low-level insults and in-fighting is the only way to dissuade him and his views from this place. That worked well, then....."

Thank you - that was my point, but made much more concisely.