to believe that most feminists are in actual fact giving women a bad name?

[Casey76]

I, along with most women I imagine are grateful that women fought to give us a vote.....

However I believe that things have gone to far..I hate women who moan and bitch about how they can't have everything!!!!!!!!

No your damn right you can not have everything ...if you go to work full time when your children are young, YOU WILL MISS OUT!!!!!

Why should women have it all???

I believe that most feminists think that they are more worthy of having everything then men and guess what you are wrong...men dont have it all...most men still work full time and still miss out on their children..

Men used to provide for their families...Men used to have a little pride...I don't think that that those women all those years ago wanted things to go this far...where some women see men as useless and think they can do everthing with out them..including having children...fair enough if you split up and you end up a single mum thats one thing but choosing to have a baby alone is just plain selfish....women should not be allowed to use a sperm doner if they are single..

So you feminists who think you are better then men and that you can have everything..YOU ARE WRONG...I FEEL SORRY FOR YOU!!!!!!!!!!!

And again I say.... where are all these twats coming from?

A bad name? What name is that, then?

Kourt-nee?
Jaiy-den?
Jocasta?

It really makes me laugh when people feel the need to pick up on and point out spelling mistakes....is it because you do not agree with me so you have to find a way to put me down?
Same to all those "run along dears" and "brain-dead OP" comments...is that the best way you can express your opinions?
It is this sort of response which justifies me in my opinions...
Also it is interesting that quite a few posts agree with some of what I say..and most of those who don't resort to putting down what they consider to be my lack of education..because of course I can not be educated if I don't think like you can I?
You let yourselves down by being bitchy...what happened to women treating other women as equals?

sunshine "sounds to me like your mother could have benefitted from nicer friends."

Absolutely! That is why I stay away from everyone telling me that I "should think again" (did already, thank you!..), that I "will have hard time going back" (maybe so...) should I change my mind... (I am prepared to rethink and make another decision but now I am happy with the current one).

I actually always thought I am a feminist, but then I went to the feminist boards here and there are so many things I absolutely do not agree with, I doubt I understand correctly feminism as an equal rights issue.

Casey - I think part of the problem is the fact that you haven't bothered, it seems, finding out what 'feminism' means before attacking it in your OP in a pretty insulting and misdirected manner. Hence whatever you have to say next is understandably held up to a bit of ridicule.
It looks like you have immersed yourself in some prejudice about feminism, so don't be surprised when someone hits back.

Have a look at other sources of understanding feminism if you have the inclination, and don't like to rely on these boards.

You let yourselves down by being bitchy

Agreed, casey.

Do you not think the OP could be interpreted as being "bitchy" to women who campaign for equality for themselves and their fellow women with men?
(Feminists, in case it's not clear who I'm talking about there).

Casey, read what Sunshine, Sparky , Awesome and many others have to say, they are not attacking you, and have given you some good pointers as to where you may have mis- understood what feminism is.

Yes, some feminists do take it too far.

The one who rant about the slightest little thing. That won't allow their daughters to wear pink and read books about princesses (even if their daughters want to).

The ones who think women can and should be just like men, when in fact women should be as empowered as men rather than the same as them.

The ones who refuse to recognise that it may be true that you can't have it all. You do miss out if you work. I work (not out of choice but for the money). I missed out on my daughter's first steps, and many other experiences she's had. I think you need to accept that rather than railing against it.

They do their cause no favours and perpetuate some really awful stereotypes.

On the other hand, there are those who think that feminism is obsolete, that the battle is won, when of course it isn't, and until women are paid equal amounts and treated with equal dignity and respect in society it never will be.

Those that wouldn't call themselves feminists - when in fact every woman should be a feminists - all it means is that you believe in equal rights for men and women.

I do agree that the extreme feminists do nothing to advance their cause and everything to turn people off it.

The problem with feminism is akin the problem with communism. It is a great idea in theory, but there are plenty of individuals who whilst proclaiming themselves as defenders in reality betray these principles.

I do not believe communism is attainable btw, whilst I do think a society can be completely free from gender-stereotyping.

Oh look! It's another thread about <a class="break-all" href="http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgurl=www.wartgames.com/crafts/occupations_scarecrow.gif&imgrefurl=www.wartgames.com/crafts/scarecrows.html&usg=__B8Z26Ou9PvHdQnj4qrDTRPakIfg=&h=648&w=491&sz=42&hl=en&start=0&zoom=1&tbnid=fGnvNmx6sZZPsM:&tbnh=149&tbnw=113&ei=0EvrTcrJLIbKtAbUv6iBCQ&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dscarecrow%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26hs%3DQBV%26sa%3DX%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-GB:official%26biw%3D1280%26bih%3D619%26tbm%3Disch%26prmd%3Divns&itbs=1&iact=hc&vpx=969&vpy=247&dur=2389&hovh=258&hovw=195&tx=116&ty=112&page=1&ndsp=23&ved=1t:429,r:14,s:0&biw=1280&bih=619" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">Straw Feminists

It is not worth engaging with someone with such an unintelligent, flawed premise for a debate.

YOu also have no insight whatsoever as you have not picked up on any of the constructive comments or questions on in response to your OP.

You are spoiling for some kind of fight. Look carefully within yourself and at your life you must be very unhappy and unfulfilled to simply want an argument with strangers on the net. Maybe that is why you are so unhappy and angry. Nothing to do with feminists.

Casey-im not attacking you.[id like to make this clear]
actually i have no wish to attack anyone-its the patriarchy im after.
the root cause for women[and men]suffering.
im a feminist because i deeply care for other hunan beings.
its only when we talk and not fight with each other that we understand each other.
i dont agree what youve said about single women and sperm donars
but you mentioning it has [for me]brought up something that i feel is important[not that anything else youve said isnt]
and i feel it needs to be discussed and looked at[probly not the best place this being aibu though]-so thankyou.

who are these feminists that 'take it too far'? What constitutes too far, believing women and men are actually not that different, that both WOHM and SAHM mothers are systematically criticised and judged for whatever 'choice' they make ? Realising that our daughters are being fed images about what they should look like, and all the pressures around that? Are these really 'extreme views'?

I personally don't know any 'extreme feminists'...and I know a lot.

I suppose it might be the difference in opinions between those feminists that feel it is mostly about achieving equality, and those for whom it must be nothing less than the annihilation of the patriarchy and anything less than that is spineless appeasement.

Strange that in this thread that there are more feminists tellling the OP to "go look it up" (paraphrased) than explaing what feminism is.

only yougivemumsabadname and sparky246 seem to have tried to explained it.

I once again wonder if feminists know what feminism is or is supposed to be.

((awaits flaming(:) )

agreed, Goblinchild. I would take an "extreme" feminist as someone who sees a putdown in every little gesture from a man, for example to be insulted at someone holding a door open.

I think there seems to be lots of "extreme" feminists on the feminism board here. They scare the pants off me....

bemybebe "I actually always thought I am a feminist, but then I went to the feminist boards here and there are so many things I absolutely do not agree with, I doubt I understand correctly feminism as an equal rights issue."

i agree with you (another ex trading floor girl here) - i had always thought of myself as a feminist, spent teenage years and 20s reading andrea dworkin and naomi wolf etc etc... but when i read some of the threads in the feminist section here i really am amazed that they appear to be living in a totally different world than me. am i worried that my daughter likes pink shoes? no i am not. do princess on board signs in other people's cars bother me? no they do not.

even on the relationships board, I think there's far too much "all men are bastards, leave him" advice flung left right and centre.

Now I'm not saying this is a feminist standpoint but those women seem to call themselves feminists and think that being a feminist is about hating men.

No I don't believe feminists give women a bad name. I do believe our society has grown up celebrating men's achievements. Oh look he got a job, he got a wife, he has enough money to keep wife and start having kids...

If we could go back and change how society worked, how would it be? Ideally society as a whole would work to provide food and produce kids. However we live in a competitive society where people want to thrive and strive to achieve the best for themselves.

How could it be truely 'fair'?

I sometimes lurk and occasionally post on the feminist threads but they make me feel inferior and somehow that I'm a traitor to "womanhood"....I agree with TFO and Mrs R.

Snowmama - 'who are these feminists that take it too far'
A male friend of mine (who works in social services) had a formal complaint made against him by a female colleague - his 'crime' was to call her 'love'
( as in 'oh thanks love' )

i am a feminist

it doesn't mean i think i am better than men, but i am equal and i should always be treated that way with recognition that men and women are different

i do not agree with everything on the feminist board but do not feel i have to to be able to believe i am a feminist, like all movements/religions/beliefs some are more extreme than others

i hate that feminism is such a dirty word but that is thanks to the many misogynists that control our politics and media sadly many women are influenced by them :(

'Where are these twats coming from'

So eloquently put -
I could link you at least 10 newspaper articles within 5 minutes on the subject of 'has feminism gone too far - has feminism let women down etc'
all written by intelligent journalists.

Go on then...

Feminism is about women having choices. The choice to be a sahm or to work, to marry or not, to have children or not, etc. It is not about saying there is only 1 right way to live.

And of course whatever choices you make will mean that you will "lose out" in terms of not experiencing the other choices. So you may be a working mum who spend all her free time with her kids, but you won't have the time a SAHM may have to do things - this may include lots of home cooking, gardening, etc. (And I know lots of women and men don't have a "choice" about working, but some do).

And of course men are the same. They have to make choices which mean they don't have the time to do other things. I agree thats life. And personally I don't like all the jokes about men being useless.

I don't agree with you about sperm donors and even if it was made illegal for clinics to treat single women, women would still do this privately. So whether you agree with it or not I don't think there is anything you can do about it.