yet another mil issue but not my fault (?)

[hayjon]

Hi, brief bit of background to start: dh and myself married very quietly a few months back (no dc's as yet). Anyway, mil (widowed) and his extended family all live at least 200 miles away from us and are basically scattered around country.
I don't have a close relationship with mil but she is allright and I neither hate or love her, she's OK.
About a month ago, she called dh to say that she wished to arrange a family gathering to celebrate our marriage, cue many phone calls between them to discuss the event. Mil very, very keen to do what we wished- must stress that I didn't really mind what happened- free meal, day out in nice surroundings, well I didn't care that much for the EXACT details so left it to dh to speak with his mum.

Anyway, basically a day before the gathering her and dh speak on phone and had a massive falling out because she didn't plan the event according to any of my dh's wishes and we didn't go after all. I tried to reason with dh to go but to no avail as I knew a lot of effort had been made. Although I kind of see why he is a bit peed off as she made such a fuss ringing all the time for no reason. He is not spoilt, either. Don't think he cared if she'd made a fuss or not-just hated having her ask him in depth what he wanted and then being ignored IYSWIM.

According to his brother, his mum is v. v. upset and we received a letter from her today saying that it was obvious to her that NEITHER of us wanted to go. This is simply not true; but what the heck could I have done? Gone by myself without dh? I am annoyed with her to be honest for this.
I don't know if I am BU or what or how to sort this.

Well I'm sure you'll both be very happy together.

Good luck in your marriage. You have bagged a real prince there darling.

Eek poor you. I think you've had quite a hard time here. Easy for people to say that you should have gone on your own. I agree that's easier said than done. I don't think I would have gone alone.

That said, to cancel the day before the party, and to cancel because football wasn't on offer, is really awful. I think that deep down you must surely agree with that?

The poor MIL, humiliated in front of everyone. I wonder if she told people why you weren't coming. If so, they won't have a great impression of either of you.

Good luck. This is a hard situation.

Even if you take the view that his mum imposed all these plans on him, if he really didn't want it he should have said no right at the start. To not go, knowing that people have travelled to attend and that his mum has put in all this effort and money is so callous. I can't imagine being so angry with my mum that I'd do that. He feels no shame about it either, which is pretty cold however you look at it.

I reckon he was lying on the sofa playing X-box, and stretching his head trying to see the TV if the OP got in his way. Bovvered? No.

I don't know if this has been asked already as I've mainly only read op's posts but have you actually discussed this with him? Explained how awkward for future family relations this has left you? I feel so sorry for your MIL but know that all situations are never black and white. Where are you going to go from here as a couple, ignoring for a moment what you should or should not have done?

i think that MOST men could be persuaded by their DW to go to the party, most men would see sense, would compromise etc. The fact that the OP says she couldn't make him go and that he is very stubborn tells me that this man is going to be trouble. OP - is he the sort that will become more stubborn the more you try to reason with him?

btw - how old are you both?

Wow, you're really determined that we acknowledge that YOU haven't done anything wrong, aren't you?

You think your MIL blames you.
You can see your DH is a twat, but still, what matters is that we on MN acknowledge that you've done nothing wrong.

It almost seems as if you're clinging on to the role of victim. You, the poor innocent, stuck between your big, bad DH and your sill, stubborn MIL.

Can you see you have choices, OP?

I saw this scenerio on some tv program, maybe it was Party Mama's, not sure. The only difference was the Mil didn't pretend to go along with the sport party, (bbq on the program). The son spit the dummy and refused to go. People had flown in from other countries, and he acted like a petulant child. Finally some people convinced him to show up for his wife's sake.

Your mil's only mistake was agreeing to a sports bar type of deal in the first place. She should not have been afraid to tell you what sort of party she was planning. Your husband was very unreasonable not to attend.
I agree with the people who said you should apologize to your mil and tell her you wanted to go, but he refused. He was vvvvvu. And be open about it with your husband. Just because he is extremely cruel and ill mannered, is not a reason for your to be.

Poor lady - damned if she does, and damned if she doesn't.

As are you.

Whip your man into shape pronto and pour oil over these troubled waters, or you'll be joining MIL and rueing the day.

You sound like a right pain in the arse.

You snuck off to get married and couldn't be arsed to invite the mother of the groom. She has been waiting for that day her whole life.

And then she tried to organise a party in celebration of your wedding at a later time.

And then neither guest of honour could be arsed to turn up.

Rude rude rude and selfish.

That poor woman.

The OP said some time ago that her MIL was at the wedding. It was just a small do and the wider family weren't invited.

I can totally imagine my dh behaving a bit like this. The way he behaves with his family is just totally different to the way I behave with mine and I find it quite incomprehensible (he hasn't spoken to his father for over two years over something where they were both in the wrong). But it is his family not mine and i can't sort the problems that have grown up over time. Also I just don't have the sort of relationship with my in laws where I could ring them up and talk to them as friends. All I can do is tell him that I think he is behaving badly, but I can't change the way he feels, and like the OP's husband he is very stubborn, and convinced he is right (and there is a lot of pain in there along with the anger).

There is no way on earth in the OPs place I would have gone to the party on my own. It would have been absolutely awful. However if I was the MIL I would have been upset with both of them even if I knew that really it was about the relationship I had with my son. I don't think that the OP should be upset with her MIL as it was her husband that put them both in such a bad position. I imagine it will take a long time to get over, indeed I hope it is possible for there to be forgiveness. I doubt there is anything much the OP can do about it either.

I think it's time to stop attacking the OP. She sounds pretty despondent. My one piece of advice now would be that it might be good for her to call MIL and try to talk to her. MIL may actually be very sympathetic to OP's position.

True wisdom from nooka after pages of some undeserved insults directed towards the OP.

Hayjon, it doesn't sound like you and your OH have been together very long, so I doubt you have/could pretend to have a convivial relationship with his family.

If I were in your position after years of being together with OH and meeting his family etc, then I would have gone alone. Had it been closer to the beginning of our relationship, I would not have gone either. You are destined to lose either way.

Go, and you "shame" your husband and I'm sure your MIL/associated family will wonder, "Why can't she control her husband? Surely, she could have convinced him to come! Something's not right there. After all, isn't that what we women do? Use our super powers of feminine persuasion to get our men to do what we want ... she obviously didn't do her best .... poor thing, he's going to eat her up alive ... actually, no, in fact, she's a wet drip who deserves everything the marriage throws at her .... etc"

Don't go, and it's "Oh, what a terrible son we have! As for that wife of his, how dare she let us go through all this trouble ... he should never have married her ... sure, we know he's pigheaded at times, but for a woman purporting to be his wife to be so lacking in any manners or decency ... she's a harridan who is going to make his life hell .... she could have come if she'd wanted, she could have made him see sense ... etc"

At the end of the day, we women are raised in the expectation that we ought to take far more care in social niceties and graces than men, which explains why you have had so much anger directed at you by other women on here. It's our job to soothe, to placate, to convince etc. Bullshit! Your OH is responsible for his actions - if he states adamantly that he's not going and you are unable to convince him otherwise, there is no reason for you to beat yourself up about it. He's a grown man that can make his own decisions. It's easy to see why you have, wittingly or unwittingly, aligned yourself with him - after all, if I didn't know my in-laws that well, I would have chosen not to get involved. In the future, with more hindsight, you will in all likelihood regret it, but you do not have the benefit of that now.

However, where people are right in making you see sense is that what your OH did was exceedingly and breathtakingly cruel, and I would seriously examine whether this is the sort of person I would want to spend the rest of my life with. Using his treatment of his mother as a barometer to how he may treat you in the future would be wise ... he has shown complete and utter disregard for her feelings. Even worse, he has placed you in an intolerable position with regard to future relations with his family - as what is/would have been their first formal introduction to you as his wife, he has done you no favours.

Is that really the sort of man you wish to remain with? Are those the values you would wish him to pass to your own children? I am not advocating that you leave him - after all, the first flush of love can close our eyes to the most obvious dire character traits - but I hope that you go forward with your eyes open as to just how oblivious to a person's feelings he can be, made worse by the fact that the person was his own mother.

tbh it sounds like the OP isn't that pushed about having a close relationship with her MIL - 'I didn't really mind what happened- free meal, day out in nice surroundings' were the reasons she offered for why she wanted to go, and that her MIL was 'OK'. She has been empathetic enough to understand the MIL's humiliation...but maybe she should also consider getting to know her dh's family a little better could be a good thing - the focus on the day out and meal do sound very detached from the human side of it.

I think the OP attending alone would have been weird and very difficult for her. What she was asking though really was what to do now - anyone got any good suggestions?

Maybe her and her dh should co-host a party with the MIL and all be involved in the planning and OP be less passive about it.

Maybe the OP should take control a little and be hospitable to her dh's family so she has a chance to develop her own relationship with them rather than rely on the rude dh as it sounds like he doesn't know how to do the right thing.

And maybe hold off on the Jeremy Kyle sneers - I've been at fancy weddings where the groom and other guests have sloped off to catch a bit of an important (rugby) match half way through the day, it doesn't have to be that big a deal. Maybe watching football with his rellies is the way the dh bonds with them and the match was a really important one? People do get their ashes scattered in Old Trafford.......

The dh does sound like he behaved like a total arse but who knows what has gone on before if he has a difficult relationship with the MIL? But sometimes being a grown up does mean going along with what someone else has planned - previous generations do often think that family weddings are up to the parents to 'host' and the MIL might have been at a lot of rellies' weddings and was trying to repay those invitations in a way she couldn't at the OP's wedding so the OP should be sympathetic to that.

sorry for the epic post but seriously - what should the OP do now?

OP, I've thought about it a lot and I truly don't know what I would have done in your place. But, in all honesty, quite probably what you did, particularly given the speed that events unfolded. You must have also been wrestling with shock and disbelief at his behaviour. But you have to live with DH and you don't have to live with MIL, and that does make a difference.

In hindsight, I think I would regret doing what you did, but it's only too easy to see it after the event. Anyhow, you'll hear no criticism from me about the past.

As in3minds say, the critical thing is what to do now.

You have two separate issues - your MIL and your DH. I don't think you can decide what to do about your MIL until you have a clearer idea about what to do about your DH. Rightly or wrongly, you need to factor in how your DH will react to however you handle your MIL.

You need to have a proper, adult conversation with your DH. He needs to understand that he behaved appalingly. If he has stopped sulking, calmed down and feels genuine remorse, then you can take it forward as a couple. You both have bridges to mend, but he should take the lead. (You can make it known subtly that you're the calming influence that has poured oil on troubled waters.)

If he doesn't think he's done anything wrong then you're in a whole other ball game. You then have a choice to make immediately and another choice to make for the long term.

The immediate choice is this: do you let things slide with MIL, or do you make a reconciling gesture on your own behalf but not his? The high road would be to make a reconciling gesture (flowers and a phone call sound ideal).

How would DH react? Would he make your life a misery? Punish you for days on end by not talking? Sulk endlessly? Only you can say how he might respond. But his response will give you a great deal more of the information you need to make the long term decision, which is about the future of your relationship.

I write this with a great deal of regret, but if he's showing you his true self then you need to think long and hard about whether you have a future together. I would really struggle to stay in a relationship with someone who could be so deliberately cruel, even in the heat of the moment.

in3minds - what should the OP do? Apologise to MIL! No question about it!

When you marry someone, you DO become part of their family. The OP saying 'it's nothing to do with me' is profoundly incorrect. If the OP doesn't sort this out, and build an empathetic bridge with her MIL, she may as well be cutting out half her future life.

OP says she's not bothered. Well one day you may well be bothered - something happens, you need help, for some reason your side of the family isn't available, who are you gonna call - even if they ARE 200 miles away - they're family and they will come to the rescue? Cutting your nose off to spite your face to not sort this out now.

Sometimes you have to step up and make your own decisions. If you disagree with what your husband did, then everyone needs to know that! Don't let them assume you're a complete cowbag. You're irritated that you've copped some of the blame for this - well fucking DO something about that. Apologise. Do what YOU would do as a person, don't let your husband change tyour behaviour.

Alternatively, if you think you shouldn't apologise, then you are a bit of a cowbag. Sorry.

This is basically the MIL wanting to take charge of the OP's wedding party though without really having been given permission to do so.

I presume the OP and her husbnad had a quiet wedding because that was what they wanted. For the MIL to ask the OP's husband what sort of party he'd like, for him to tell her and her to ignore him and demand he travel 200 miles to a gathering he doesn't want and was a reason he had a quiet wedding anyway must have been very annoying.

If I was organising a party for someone else (which I'm unlikely to do feeeling that if someone wants a party they will organise it themselves) I wouldn't ask what they wanted, do something else and demand they travel to it.

It all sounds mad. The OP should show solidarity with her husband on this though in the same way she should expect her husband to stand by her if she falls out with her family. This is for him to sort out.

I would make clear to my husband though that he should have clarified with his mum early on that if the event wasn't to his liking he wouldn't be going.

I wouldn't be married to a man who arranges all events around football though.

I suppose it does sound a bit weird if the MIL had extensive consultations and then did something completely different...how passive aggressive is it to ask someone what they want and do something they think is opposite?
The MIL sounds like she is disapproving of the dh - saying a pub is not 'upmarket' enough - so that could have been the last straw for the dh if they have previous in that area - but it does sound a bit mad that the OP and dh really didn't know what she had planned until the last minute.
I think the OP and her DH should definitely apologise - if he won't, then she certainly can without being disloyal to him - even if she hasn't a close relationship with the MIL it is just good manners.

Why is everyone so down on football?
My husband is football mad (or just mad at football at the moment since he's a gooner). I do plan things around football, because that's what he enjoys. So, if Arsenal are playing in the afternoon, we go out in the morning instead. And if there was a big Arsenal match on at the same time as a family gathering, they'd all be round the telly watching it. What's wrong with that?

We joke we had our wedding on a Friday to make sure it wasn't the same time as an Arsenal match (not the only reason but it was a consideration)

In return, he comes round stately homes/castles with me and puts up with my constant mucking about on the noisy sewing machine when he's trying to watch TV. He has his hobbies and I have mine - why, because it's football does it mean that it's Jeremy Kyle scum of the earth territory?

I agree that you should apologise to your MIL, even though you haven't really done anything wrong yourself - you are guilty by association, as it were.
Your DH behaved abysmally and if he wants to continue any kind of relationship with his mum he should grovel and apologise for being such an unconscionable brat.

In fairness to your MIL, I'm sure she is upset with both of you - she probably believes that you could have made him come along, despite knowing him of old - she's wrong of course, but that's not going to change her feelings.
My DH and his brother have a terrible relationship at the moment, due to his brother's appallling behaviour when drunk (police involvement and restraining orders) and yet MIL still managed to blame me for us not wanting to go to hers on Christmas Day and said I was "breaking up the family"!! Not me, her other DS is the guilty party - but it's easier to blame the non-blood relation than accept you've raised some boor of a son.

For myself, it's not specifically anti-football, but I think that if a one-off sporting event is so important to you, then you should take that date into account when planning the date of your family party

If it's just a routine game / event / race, then I don't think it should take priority over a family wedding celebration.

Cancelling the night before was not on

If my DH had behaved this way, we would have had a huge fight and I would have told him to get in the fucking car or I was going without him.

I would then have booked myself into a 5 star hotel near the party and possibly hit the spa before coming home the next day. (I actually did this once when we had had a fight about something in the early years, can't rememer what the fight was about but I do remember the massage).

She must have been so hurt.

How a man treats his mother is often a very good indicator as to how he will treat his wife. The first couple of years together are also when you really find out about each other and what you will put up with.

You can't control him, that is true, but you can control you. You can say 'This is unacceptable to me, I will not be married to someone who would behave like this. I am going to this party because it is the right thing to do'.

Are you afraid to have an argument with him? Why are you being so passive? Have you called her to apologise for your non-attendance?

My mum always used to say that it's essential to take a good look at how a man treats his mother before you even consider marrying him.

OP, I think you've got your work cut out with this chap. Good luck