TO POINT OUT...PANORAMA (TUES) Worse ever secret filming of abuse of vulnerable people.

[ScousyFogarty]

This was the most tragic ever "secret filming" by Panorama of abuse on vulnerable patients in care home. (arrests now made of some staff)

Did any of you manage to sit through the programme? It was an ordeal just to watch

I'm a lawyer and I deal with cases like this all the time, and trust me, that was really nothing... awful, isn't it?

It was so sad.

Dh offered to help 'look after' the carers.

I thought Simons Mum was fab.

How does it happen that the authority simply 'takes' these vulnerable people?.

Littlemum. I dont understand the last part of your sentence....but I think I get it....perhaps puncuation is the problem

Yes, it is beyond awful. Words wont really describe what was systematically going. on.. Some of it routine torture

Scousy I understood what littleonemum was saying.

I found it too awful to watch - I was crying

it was so sad - I was feeding my little daughter at the time and I thought oh my god that could be her - that poor Simone. They were cruel

hoofhearted Yes my wife, a nurse for 30 years found it impossible to watch. I stuck it out because I needed to write about it. To think that organisation owns , was it 70, other homes?

What we need is a more effective 'whistle blowing' policy for staff to use. Often good staff are forced out when they start to complain.

I was working in a 'lock in' dementia ward and i (as well as others) contacted what was C SKY, all they did was give the unit time to improve after they found serious and illegal faults. The whole design of the unit was not 'fit for purpose', every nurse and doctor that came in wanted it closed. The patients would not have been affected by a move and there were oppurtunities to close it after numerous deaths but for some reason they were allowed to still hold a licience. We should go back to purpose built homes in a similar way to schools, rather than the private system, that we have.

Let me make it clear scouser. I am a lawyer. I deal with cases like this all the time. I act for the Secretary of State trying to ensure that people who abuse in care homes/hospitals never get to work with vulnerable adults again. I have dealt with many cases where the abuse was far worse. And my view is that this form of abuse is really awful. In fact, all forms are. In some ways, physical abuse is more easy to deal with, as it gets reported, people know it is wrong and do whistle-blow. My view is that it is lesser abuse (psychological) which goes unreported for longer and it can be just as damaging.

I'll give you an anonymous example. One resident (severe SN) was diabetic. When everyone else was having pudding, the manager/staff would routinely goad him that he wasn't allowed puddings or sweet things ever because he'd been bad, and one day if he was good he'd be allowed. Every night he'd sit through pudding asking if he'd been good and the answer was always no. For months. This man literally became too frightened to do anything ever, all day, because he was convinced it would mean he'd been bad. He'd sit in his room through fear of going out and 'being bad'. it wasn't until months later than finally a junior member of staff whistle-blew and various members of staff were sacked. A newly promoted member of staff bought him some diabetic sugar free ice cream and he literally cried when he was given it, just because for the first time he could have pudding with everyone else. Abuse? Definitely.

The horrible truth is they don't shut the 'bad' places because there is far too many of them. Where would the residents go there isn't enough care places anyway. We would all like to think it a case of a few bad apples but actually the whole barrel is starting to stink!

What I can't understand is the levels of knowledge and planning and research on childrens learning and development and all these standards we quite rightly have to adhere to in this country, in schools, nurseries childrens homes etc... and so many elderly people are as helpless and vulnerable as children yet if we treated young children the way we treat old folk there would be outrage

there is ZERO respect for the elderly in this country. It makes me so cross

Ah, see now thread not about old folk...didnt see programme

They were just so fucking cruel, I was in bits last night.

Chances are my son is going to end up in some sort of home when we die, with no family left capable of looking out for him, all I could think of was his little voice saying 'can you go away please ?' (which is what he says when he's stressed ) And some thug goading him.

Fucking awful, the lot of them need shooting, society does not need people like that.

I'm terrified that one day when both me & DH aren't able to care for them any more this fate may await my children.

It's intensely distressing.

"Littlemum. I dont understand the last part of your sentence....but I think I get it....perhaps puncuation is the problem"

I think she was saying this is the tip of the iceberg, which it is,
was still horriffic to watch I don't think I could have stood by tbh I know there not meant to interfere but I think I would have.

I was crying too much to watch the end of the programme but I recorded it because even though it is uncomfortable viewing I feel I should watch it.
I don't understand why there hasn't been more uproar in the media about it??
Would also like to know at what point the abusers realised they had been filmed. I heard 4 people have been arrested and 13 people suspended - I hope to God they don't get let off with a warning or such.
The man (think he was a clinical psychologist) said it was torture. He was not wrong.
Heartbreaking.

Littlemum Great post....but in another area I dont think that Secretary of Statel is doing a very good job over knew disability benefits rules. (Its all over the press and the News this morning... Charities for the disabled are very unhappy.).....there is a thread with 700 posts on it on this matter....

Perhaps you might take a look...It starts "IS CAMEROn making scroungers out of disability claimants?"

Beesimo- you have a point. Part of the problem is the mass ownership of the 'homes' by a few companies. Bad managers and staff just get moved around and pollute what was well run places.

I don't think that the increase in qualifications for staff has improved things as i know many dedicated, caring people who no longer work in care because they are not capable of gaining the qualifications wanted.

I have no moved from a care role to SW and feel that 'care' fails without strong leadership but the managers are accountable for profits above the quality of life of those living within the system.

and that leads to another concern that is this what happens when you turn health care over to private companies?

I was in bed reading a book, but DH came up after he'd watched it and he had tears in his eyes.

Now he's not the type of bloke to get upset over things, but this had a real impact on him. He was describing it to me and I'm pleased I didn't see it, I would have been just too upset.

bbbbo.. People have been arrested. The story was widely covered on TODAY
prog.....Was it on 5-Live? Did Nicky or Victoria do it.

victoria is doing it now

Private compainies should never have been put in a position where they could make money from housing the most vunerable in our society, it was never going to work. The two, people in need and people needing to make a profit, don't go well together. There are now very few childrens homes that are council run and the government is looking to privitise the whole system and now the Quality Care Commision and the General Social Care Council are being disbaned, so things will not improve.

I have an autistic son with severe learining difficulties, he is only 4 but who knows what the future holds in respect of his care needs as an adult. I haven't watched it yet, I'm working up to it.

Another problem is it will upset relatives who have kin in other care homes. EVERYONE WILL BE WONDERING what,s happening?