to expect the guest I invited over not to send the nanny as a substitute?

[sabretoothtiger]

I hate posting in this category but am genuinely interested in whether my reaction is unreasonable.

DD1 is friends with a girl at school. DS is also friends with her brother. They all get on well but we haven't yet had any occasion to invite them over to play. I know the parents to chat to if I bumped into them but again not particularly well.

DD1 has been asking for the friend to come and play and so I sent a text asking if the mother would like to bring both children over to play and for tea and said that we could have a chinwag over coffee whilst they were playing and get to know each other better.

So the response has come back that the mother is busy but the nanny would love to come over for a chat and coffee. I was quite shocked and thought this very cheeky since the invitation was clearly directed at the mother too.

AIBU to expect either the mother to come or else to suggest an alternative date if she is busy rather than send the nanny (who I've never even met) - or is this normal?

mathanxiety - and I know at least two families who have, in the past few years, had a (tax) year when they employed 12 different nannies each

When we had a nanny she had a much busier 'school yard' social life than we did, but they were friends that she made, nothing to do with us. I'm sure no one regretted their friendships as she was lovely.

I was going to say that perhaps the problem was the texting, because it's not a very subtle communication method, but I do think the second one was rude, and even if lifts do end with a wave (I agree totally normal) that's not an excuse to not make it clear that you are very grateful for the help especially if the arrangement is not reciprocal (personally I'm always a bit shy of asking for help that I can't reciprocate in some way).

I have friends at school who are nannies but I barely know the parents. I don't think nannies and parents are interchangeable.

"She may or may not have felt like socialising with Sabretoothtiger for an afternoon as a way of earning her living."

When you're earning your living as a nanny, supervising playdates whether you feel like it or not is part of the deal.

Do agree the texts have been overly abrupt.

Supervising a playdate at the home of your employer is one thing but a chinwag over coffee with a total stranger in her house for a few hours is another. It's not quite into the realm of escort services, maybe more geisha.

What do nannies on his thread think of geisha analogy? I would say a nanny is in loco parenti and part of the job involves hanging out in other people's homes when kids are playing and making small talk.

I think part of a nanny's remit is to facilitate the children playing at other childrens homes and having other children over to play, if they are old enough to go alone and both sets of parents are fine with that then that's OK - but if either set of parents isn't OK with that then part of the nanny's job is to stay with the kids - UNLESS they have said at interview stage that it's not something they are prepared to do (which is fair enough if it's discussed before the job starts) so the parents can choose whether to take on the nanny or not. I also think that after one or two meet ups, if the nanny really doesn't like the other nanny or parents then other arrangements need to be made.

Mumonahottinroof - to a certain extent, but on the whole it should be for the nanny to arrange, not the parent. The nanny should arrange (urgh) playdates/meet-ups but on the whole should be able to choose who they are with, not have specific parents/nannies/children foisted on to her.

yes us nannies are in locu parental -but again if older then no need to stay and chat - enjoy the 2 hrs of peace/one less child you gain from playdates

as i keep on saying if op wanted to get to know the mum, she should have asked her and dh over for a meal one evening

Agree Blondes I a now extremely good friends with mums that I hosted playdates with over the years as a nanny - we have all moved on since then but I have several close friends who I visit throughout the year, and now 2 godchildren.

Yes a nanny and a parent are not interchangeable - I don't think my friends would have got on with my boss as well as we did - they would have nothing in common to start with - but whilst having a coffee with the nanny whilst hosting a playdate might not leave you with a life long friend - neither will having a chinwag with another mum from school friendships are made in a variety of ways and I am glad that on the whole 88% of the wives/mothers where I work don't mind socialising with the help.

I've been thinking about that post of the weekend where the not yet mum was going on about all the things she would do with her kids, ie they would speak a foreign language, play an instrument, eat their veg etc

well, I've been pondering. Lets face it, we are all on here, pretty engaged, care about our kids, trying to do out best.

Of course they'll be fine at school etc. But will they be dweebs or popular?

lets face it, which is going to seriously improve their quality of life - grade 2 in violin or being cool?

with that in mind, here is my list of things that I will do with my daughter to make her cool and popular in school and in later life

• be able to street dance. Imagine busting out those moves at the disco

- be able to ride a bike, swim, ride a horse, ski -be able to do that lovely dive into the pool that looks so elegant - ride a skateboard - have long hair, at least until she is 12 - only play an instrument if it is any use in forming a band. Tuba out, guitar in - have a sense of style (not fashion) and know what suits her - know her on mind and have confidence in her own opinion - a good knowledge of decent music. Am working on led zep, wu tang clan and minimal techno at the mo - not to be scared of stuff such as insects, dogs, being high up

what have I missed?

bugger! will put this last message where it belongs. bear with!

"as i keep on saying if op wanted to get to know the mum, she should have asked her and dh over for a meal one evening"

I disagree wholeheartedly with this. I have masses of Mummy friends whose DH's I barely know and the whole point of the Mummy-gang-friendship scene is to hang out with other like-minded women without men in tow.

then bonsoir, op should have invited mum over without the kids

op is miffed that mum isnt coming - she isnt pleased that the kids can come and play with her kids - regardless who bings them, she wanted the mum

Why without the children? The absolutely standard arrangement is that mothers chat/do girly stuff while children play together because children cannot be left alone.

I certainly don't want to socialise as a couple with other parents from school, other than on exceptional occasions, and to get a babysitter for my children and to expect another mother to get a babysitter for her children so that I can meet her is beyond loopy.

I think the snotty cow other mum has done you a big favour with her astoundingly rude second text. She has shown herself to be someone you probably don't want to get to know better. The nanny might be a better bet, but I'd cancel the whole idea anyway. Send a coolly polite text back saying that you are not able to collect her DD on Saturday. And leave out the "sorry," too. If she's in the business of curt texts, she shouldn't have a problem with it.

I think this thread has raised in an interesting side-issue of how family interaction, intimacy and social life changes when there is a nanny in the mix.

Bonsoir I don't think that is the standard arrangement when IRS dressed up as a playmate for the children and the socialising/coffee is an add on. Perhaps when friendships develop it's more mother focused but the OP doesn't know this woman yet and it reads as though it's childcentric.

As a mother I can assure you it is beyond standard - even in these nanny-rich parts! But I expect nannies have a different POV because their time/agenda is not their own to control and they are often executing childcare arrangements that have been made by their employers.

To be fair to mothers who are very busy at work, it does often pass them by entirely that there is a whole world of mother-and-children socialising out there that they (and their children) miss out on. My very-busy-at-work girlfriends tend to socialise in the evenings as a couple - probably because there aren't any other options. Or, at a pinch, they nip out of the office for lunch with a girlfriend or have a quick coffee at drop off before heading off to the office. But casual mother-and-children lunches/picnics/teas don't feature on their social calendar.

At first I thought this was really rude but I agree with some other posters that it probably wasn't a deliberate snub. The other mother might have thought,'Oh damn. I'm not free on that day. I really want to let the kids get together and I don't want them to miss out. Phew, the nanny is working that day.'
A friend of mine sent her nanny to our mothers' groups which the rest of us thought was really odd but in hindsight, this friend just wanted her daugher (age 6 months lol!) not to miss out.
Having said that though, if you did want to get to know the mum a bit (nice idea) I'd say, let's rearrange for when you're free. Why don't you text me a couple of dates that are good for you.

Bonsoir I think that's right.
I was in the park yesterday and it was heaving with groups of Mums and their flocks of children. Also groups of nannies and their charges.

Bonsoir is right- it's just a different concept about when and how you socialize. Also dd would have very limited social life if people didn't want her nanny to take her on playdates .

But this wasn't just a playdate. The OP specifically invited the other mum over too, to get to know her. And the other mum was very dismissive in her reply.
That's different from nannies in general facilitating playdates for their charges.

My DD has plenty of friends whose nannies drop them off for playdates - but the nannies don't stick around. And we do plenty of mother-and-children picnics when children whose mothers work are invited along - but without their nanny. So you might get four mothers with all their children, and another four miscellaneous unrelated children without their mothers and without their nannies.