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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

up shit creek without a paddle.... Urgent help/advice needed please.

263 replies

HolyFail · 31/05/2011 15:45

Regular poster with recent namechange here....

A friend of mine was seeing this guy - a lot older than her, he is very well off and as a birthday present offered to buy her veneers (sp*)

So she went to a dental clinic, had her actual teeth filed down to pins and is wearing temp veneers until her appointment next week.

1st payment was made (cash, by him)
2nd payment is due next week before the job is complete (thousands of pounds due)

He has dumped her! And told her to sort it out herself - she is a young woman with no money - sure she works, but is not earning enough to pay for this and she has requested to pay on finance but she has a crap credit rating so has therefore been declined!

In addition to "How could you be so stupid" What can I advise her here? Does anyone have any experience in this kind of thing?

Any suggestions welcome? We've been through how stupid she has been, we just need to find a way to sort this?

OP posts:
TidyDancer · 31/05/2011 17:28

OMG this is horrible. Is there anyone that can help her out? How about her offering the dentist half the money and explaining the situation? I don't know how that would work out, but surely it's worth a shot!

Poor love. :(

mathanxiety · 31/05/2011 17:30

Really, the legal route should NOT be the last resort here even if this man is a nut job. You can get half an hour free with some solicitors. They should be her first port of call. The contract or agreement with the dentist should be examined. Wiki article on estoppel here (sorry for Wiki). [see Reliance based estoppels section beginning --'All reliance-based estoppels require the victimised party to show both inducement and detrimental reliance..']

She really should go to a solicitor. The boyfriend made a partial payment and the contract between him and the dentist to make the further payments may be enforceable. Detrimental reliance is a bit narrower in the UK than it is in the US but she may still have a case. Please go to a solicitor with her. Under no circumstances should she sign any promise to pay the dentist herself (my guess is the dentist will require some sort of agreement if he is going to do any more work) without first seeing if she can get the ex to pay. She might also be able to have a solicitor negotiate on her behalf with the dentist.

Disclaimer -- I am not a lawyer. But a solicitor should be her first stop here. Asap.

mathanxiety · 31/05/2011 17:32

If it was premeditated then it is a form of assault. IF

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 31/05/2011 17:32

Well the dentist isn't going to pull her teeth out, so there's a good chance this can be worked out. As long as the money arrives each month, that should be good enough. This girl is going to have to pay for his mistake though - and it was her mistake. If you want something, get it yourself, work for the money and be beholden to no man (or woman).

MumblingRagDoll · 31/05/2011 17:37

Can she sue? He has gone back on promise and if it were me I would seek damages.

MumblingRagDoll · 31/05/2011 17:39

oooh x posts with math there....good! Sounds like good advice OP!

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 31/05/2011 17:40

The boyfriend might just say that he agreed to the cash payment and promised nothing else. Then what? How about this girl make an arrangement with the dentist and try to sort out this mess herself. Solicitors are just going to cost even more money.

GastonTheLadybird · 31/05/2011 17:44

I don't know whether she would be up for it but she could see if the daily mail would pay for the story? It's the kinda thing I could see a paper or mag publishing but not sure how well they pay, certainly not 4k but every little helps right.

Maybe with some free PR the dentist might fix for free?

verytellytubby · 31/05/2011 18:03

Flaming nora. What a bastard.

I'm actually speechless (for once).

cottonreels · 31/05/2011 18:21

Sorry, no different advice to the other posters, but just wanted to say i also think thats despicable behaviour on his part. It makes me think of the young model who got acid thrown in her face by a man. I know its not the same, but he's pretty much left your mate disfigured too. Poor, poor girl. At least it will be sorted one way or another, though a very expensive lesson Sad.

mathanxiety · 31/05/2011 18:40

There is no way the bf could have just agreed to make only the initial payment for a long procedure involving a few visits, with the friend not understanding she would be responsible for the rest of the payments, unless she is as thick as two short planks.

There is no way a dentist who cared about his reputation or his practice would proceed with the veneers without having a firm idea of who was going to pay, because not getting paid by either party is bad news for a dentist and because starting on the disfigurement of a young woman and then holding her over a barrel for payment is not good publicity no matter what way you look at it. My guess is there is an agreement between the bf and the dentist and not just something verbal since there is quite a lot of money involved. OP -- please take your friend to see a solicitor.

There is no way she should promise to pay the dentist without first getting legal advice. A free half hour or even an hour that she pays for would cost less than 5K.

I think she should contact the police too.

Catmilk · 31/05/2011 18:50

Seek legal advice definitely, I think you stand a good chance via the small claims court. You might even want to approach women's magazines - you could get paid for your rather unusual story, and name and shame the bastard to boot.

Original poster
HolyFail · 31/05/2011 18:53

all very good advice, I also like the idea of naming and shaming in the DM ;)

I haven't read everything thoroughly but will do later when dd is in bed, I'll be back later.

Many Thanks

OP posts:
Grumpystiltskin · 31/05/2011 19:10

Wow. Some people are just beyond belief. Unfortunately, whilst the NHS would provide an option to get some sort of "appliance" on the teeth, it will be nothing like what could be expected from a private dentist. I would echo what mathan said regarding the dentist and knowing who would be paying for it. I'm a dentist and I would never EVER carry out work like this unless I was a: Absolutely sure that the patient (not her bf) wanted it and understood it, and that I was going to get paid for it.

Just a point to note on credit. Some dentists don't do credit because you have to be registerd with someone (consumer credit council..??) to do so and it is expensive to register. That said, it may be possible to "pay as you go" and sort it in installments, certainly I would maintain the temporaries as a gesture of goodwill whilst money was found.

Lots of good suggestions but importantly, speak to the dentist, we are (mostly) normal people and understand that these difficulties arise sometimes.

Oh, and think of something delightful to do in return (wish I could afford a billboard poster type thoughts here)!

Northernlurker · 31/05/2011 19:13

Yes there's a good chance the dentist will be very humane about it. No reason why they should stand a £5000 loss though longterm.

SnuffleTurtle153 · 31/05/2011 19:13

This is awful, seriously awful. But please ignore anyone who suggests contacting the police. This is a civil matter, not a criminal one.

Hope she gets it sorted soon.

MmeLindor. · 31/05/2011 19:13

Oh, the poor girl.

Could she offer to work for the dentist part-time to pay off the debt?

Hope that she gets legal advice and that the bastard doesn't get off with it.

Flowertower · 31/05/2011 19:22

I have just asked my DH who is a solicitor. He says that she could be entitled to recover the cost based on a promissory estoppel ( as mentioned by Mathanxiety). This is when a person suffers a loss after they have been promised something. Her actions in going ahead with this irreversible procedure, without the funds to pay for it herself, show that she was reliant on his promise to come up with the full payment. She has also suffered a significant loss as a result. Poor girl - sounds absolutely awful.

springydaffs · 31/05/2011 19:50

psychopath? Normal people don't do things like this - even very, very shitty normal people don't do things like this. He's not right upstairs - frightening.

Poor, poor girl. Definitely the legal route as a first stop, not last, as mathan said. Like the sound of the DM, or womens mags - she'd definitely get it paid for that way - it is a very unusual story.

But you say he is a frightening individual - well, yes, that's apparent - and going public may rebound on her. Glad we got a dentist on here to give some advice, though tbh if the expected payment was a cash payment, doesn't that put the dentist on a sticky wicket? In which case, s/he may well want to hush it up, get the procedure done and absorb the cost. If all else fails, NHS dental students sound like the way to go, as someone suggested. She won't, surely, be left like this?

TheMonster · 31/05/2011 19:57

Poor woman.

RufousBartleby · 31/05/2011 20:06

Hmm - what a charmer!

Not exactly the same treatment I know, but I had braces privately as an adult and paid for them over the course of two years. This was interest free and my credit rating was not checked in any way. I would have thought this was standard practice.

Would also imagine that the dentist has a duty of care to try to accomodate her for the rest of the treatment in some way.

BabyDubsEverywhere · 31/05/2011 20:13

This may be a long shot...but this sounds like just the sort of rubbish my Dsis reads in those trashy Closer/Heat type mags. They pay for stories....could even pay for the treatment perhaps? Id be ringing a trash mag to sell my story if every other avenue has already been explored.

Ormirian · 31/05/2011 20:14

What would happen if she just turned up at an NHS dentist or dental emergency centre and bared her gnashers and said 'help!'

Grange · 31/05/2011 20:22

I had veneers and the temps only lasted 3 weeks-they discolour and look awful after that, however, my teeth weren't filed down to pins?! I got a payment plan from the dentist.........they are so expensive, i really feel for your friend

Glitterknickaz · 31/05/2011 20:24

there's a twitter account, talktothepress, they can scout round trash mags and get a good deal