TO SAY Camerons Policies are in danger of getting all disabled people labelled as "Scroungers"

[ScousyFogarty]

That is a wicked thing do do and David Cameron beeds to apologise or more likely get one of his flunkies to say SORRY

That is a very fair point Lesley, you are right, it is not the condition, but how it affects the individual that counts.

It is also true to say that many people who do need help won't apply because they can't face the form.

Others who do need help cannot apply because of the nature of their disease. The only reason I can get DLA for my cancer is because I qualify under the special rules. Otherwise I would quite possibly fail the eligibility because my treatment keeps changing, my symptoms are not consistent or predictable. I am aware, sadly, of many women who have metastatic cancer in their bones who cannot get DLA. These women can be in agony, unable to walk or dress themselves, unable to feed themselves, but because of the nature of their illness and it's unpredictable nature, they are not eligible.

I'm not suggesting they should be, I'm just trying to illustrate that DLA is not handed out willy nilly, as some on here seem to believe.

Under the changes, even fewer people, including those who currently qualify, will be eligible to receive PIP, all to save £2.5 billion, at the same time as the Government are touting the idea of scrapping the Equality Bill.

There is plenty on the internet from disability charities about how this will impact on some of the poorest and most vulnerable people in our society.

My Dad also applied for DLA after suffering a massive brain aneurism, he was lucky he survived it, most people don't. The surgery which saved his life caused him to have several small strokes. He couldn't feed himself, his face was partially paralysed, couldn't dress himself or take care of his personal hygiene for months afterwards. He didn't qualify for DLA because he was expected to get better. He was entitled to receive incapacity benefit as he couldn't work. He actually died of cancer less than a year later, but that is besides the point.

It's not just the severity of the disablement, it also needs to be constant and ongoing to meet the criteria.

here

I know i will lose dla under pip because i have a powerchair. This means i am not mobility impaired. Despite endless, sgeps, inaccessible buses etc etc. Without dla i cannot pay for a new chair or its batteries so will not have a chair for long. But they have that covered. You still wont get mobility dla under the new rules if 'you could use a chair if you had one'

I have read the stuff on autism and pips. I can see why people with autism will fail pips - especially as they are done by unqualified people. But surely people will be successful on appeal? Although I know going through the pip and appeal will be stressful.

Actually the govt is considering not allowing appeals to save money. Fabulous.

I cold save them 3 million a day. Stop attacking Libya!!!!

That is terrible Riven! I hadn't heard that.

I think lots of people don't understand that you don't get DLA for being disabled in itself. Our local paper had a bit of a campaign against PIPS which was great. But it kept featuring people who from their story you could tell were unlikely ever to get DLA e.g. person with amputated leg who wore an artificial limb, rather than people who should get it but weren't e.g. someone with autism or a head injury. It really annoyed me.

Yes, Lesley. it is a complex subject . I dont think most Disability claimants know hopw the government is entrapping them onto jobseekers allowance at 30 quid a week less. (Ministers say it is not about money.( they are widely thought to be fibbing on that.)
I dont believe the current assessments are honest. The agenda is to save money by further prejudicing vulnerable claimants.

The governments is mean spirited in the extreme. Nick Clegg, if he is still Liberal, should pressurise them on this. I suspect he wont. ( BBC radio 5-live take a hardline. BBC radio 4 is on the side of the vulneraverable. So is Channel 4 TVs 7 O,clock News. Contact any of them if you have srious doubts about Clegg governments policy on this.)
That apart it is a much nicer day today than yesterday. |Yippeee

we were not talking about my hole in heart lesley at all i mentioned it to wubbly is all i dont have dla its my husband who was injured serving his country and my autistic son who i faught tooth and nail to get a diagnosis and help in school for 8 years and then i applied for DLA for him as i dont work having been a carer for my husband son and MIL (she has since died) but yes according to new ruling (PIP) it does look like its unlikely my ds will get dla as will a lot of very sick / disabled people which is the lifeline my son has to services if he doesnt get that i will be house bound with him and my dh because we wont have a vehicle ( i cant aford a car myself) not even a banger as im a carer with no respite 24/7 i dont drink dont smoke or go out except tesco / school and after school clubs for my two teeagers i live to far away to push my DH and would be impossible with my DS but as ive said many times before the man/woman from ATOS are not disabled there employed to reduce the amount of claimants by20% figures say 1% of claimants are fraudulent so guess where the 19% are going to come from

just because someone has an artificial limb doesnt mean hes not in agony, it doesnt mean because your not supposed to keep it on 24/7 you can only wear them so many housrs a day (IF) its not too painful but people get lumps sores need further surgery the stumps themselves loose fat tissue so when you do try and walk your walking on bone then theres the oposite side you wear your hip joints out from having a gait there are ill fitting cheap prothesis's the NHS give you they dont fit you with state of the art ones then theres phantom pains which are agonising so just because your fitted with el cheapo prothesis on the nhs doesnt mean on your fit as a fiddle

Yes I know people who wear artificial limbs often have pain and I know a bit about phantom pain and some of the treatments. But just because someone has an amputated leg does not mean that they can't care for themselves. With DLA they would have to be saying I have an amputated leg and this means I can't do x,y and z because of this.

And I don't mean to be horrible, but many people live with constant pain including myself. With the use of daily prescribed painkillers I can manage to do everything for myself. So I know that pain every day doesn't automatically mean that you can't look after yourself.

Pain is so difficult though, how can it be measured?

It seems wrong to me that we could deny a man financial assistance, someone who has ended up permanently disabled fighting for this country, because some pen pushing, penny pinching bureaucrat, paid to cut costs, says his pain isn't significant. Someone who isn't even medically qualified?

Oh, it's beyond wrong, it's sickening actually.

Maybe dla pays for the painkiller prescription for some people. Vital i should think

its still not as simple under the new rules there ARE people as ive just explained who cant care for themselves what if they have other injuries as in my DH case he has loss of two limbs altogether and limited in the other hes in constant pain then my dear friend i mention yesterday whos terminally ill in pain tired in an awful mess but because hes now outlived his 6 months expectation has been removed and YES sorry but there are many many things especially if in constant pain a person cant do when they have a limb missing for instance ..walk unaided this is what disability was brought in for it shouls cover physical/ mental pain disability so im not trying to be awkward but people knowlege of disability as youve just mentioned is proof you dont understant the complex needs of disabled people my husband lost his job his life his dignity for his country and will be thrown off dla and incapacity because he has two painfully ill fitting prothesis he has a shoulder injury and hip injury yet on pip he will be forced off these regardless of pain regardless of inability to wear more than two hours a day no dignity in any of this and my autistic son will be expected to walk unaided as id be sent to work alone to and from school as there cutting the school bus service hes at a special school hes moderate asd and has no sense of danger including road sense or stranger danger its insulting (im sure you didnt mean it that way or personally ) but it is still insulting that you think people are not in pain my DH has daily painkillers lots and lots of them 4 types plus phantom tablets , and as he was blown up across a road he had prozac too but that doesnt seem to matter and it certainly doesnt to mr cameron or 90% of people on MN. pain every day OFTEN does mean you cant do everything for yourself if also added to that your limbless more than the poor sole who has his limbs but is still in agony and cant control there fingers or ben their arm . the thing is lesly is people can just as easily fake saying they have pain but i can asure you that if a man or woman with limbs missing says there in pain and you can see sores and lumps and raw bone on their stump i thnk we can definately say yep thats gotta hurt unles your the man/woman from ATOS that is

benefits to stop being starving in their homes or on the streets

i just read lol@ a bit of phantom pain you dont have the faintest idea one person might not have any at all but you imagine the pain as if youve only just had your leg sawn off today constantly and jerking shooting pains in your limb thats not even there because your brain still thinks it is ... cramp as if your limbs still there but you cant rub it, itching when your hot in bed in summer but you cant put your leg out of the duvet to cool off or walk around. you cant get up to the toilet in the night if you need to ever pick up your child again play with your kids in the garden do gardening or decorating anymore do the sports you used to at all (dh used to swim play golf play hockey for the forces) cycle daily when not on deployment. ever go out again because your on such a low income.... its not FUN its not nice being ostracised by society losing your job / career sorry im so upset by those off the cuff comments

Of course ongoing pain is draining and awful. And it may mean that you can't do everything for yourselve, but it doesn't automatically mean that.

Do you know about therapy for phantom limb pain using mirrors? It has a very high success rate at curing phantom limb pain.

lost my reading glasses excuse the terrible typo's

I'm sorry I didn't mean to upset and my post wasn't aimed at you. It was about an article in my local newspaper where it sounded as if the person, although in some pain, was not having frequent pain.

I don't have phantom limb pain, but I do get neurological pain that often feels like electric shocks, as well as itching, etc. The pain clinic helped a lot. But I know phantom limb pain is often very painful.

Actually I just read my comments and I didn't say a bit of phantom limb pain. I said some people have it and some don't.

no one said it did automatically mean that what were explaining is ATOS unfortunately DO think that and as i say 1% of fraudsters will make 19% of people really suffer and everone on this benefit suffer because under PIP they are going to give those people on the bradline £30 a week less too.
yes i know about that mirrors my DH is under northampton limb service has not worked at all but then again hes still struggling getting over his injuries atm it will take yers not a couple of months as ATOS will expect learing to walk again with prothesis that they cant fit properly because his legs were blown off and later he had to have 8 surgeries to repair the damage then got mrsa and had to have a further op to remove more tissue making them abnormally short tbh he would have been better off if they took them even higher so he could wear a better fitting style of prothesis as the type he has are held on by sheer tightness aqaint to wearing a pair of shoes 3 sizes too small rather than straps

ive pasted this from your post ? and I know a bit about phantom pain so sorry you didnt say that either you claimed to know a bit about phantom pain... its very complex problem its like saying i dont drive but i know a bit about car mechanics. if i sound angry im sorry but the whole situations ludicrous and i AM angry i feal like giving up really like riven at this rate i will have to institutionalise my son just out of sheer lack of care/ help and MONEY plus feeling bloody suicidal to be frank everyone thinks they know best but there not living in my shoes

Lesley33 your post at 23:54 is very eloquent and to the point. How do you distinguish between two people with the same disability and one pushes themselves to go out and work and the other sits back and demands their entitlement?

Some of the posters on here would wish to prevent us from posting up individual instances we are familiar with, and only to post general soundbites supporting their ideology. They don't like it because experience of individual instances mocks their claim of 0.2% fraudulent claims, where they confuse conviction rates with perpetration rates.

I actually find the demanding, entitled attitude does little for those who hold it. Neither does the attitude that no-one else faces difficulty in life other than those in receipt of disability benefits. People are willing to help those who help themselves. Constant demands and claims for entitlement and ramming down people's throats how needy you are eventually pisses people off. Claiming average people are evil when all they do is go out to work, pay their dues and live a good life because they don't want to give even more money to you, is duplicitous.

I know plenty of people, working full-time in good jobs, with university degrees, who cannot afford cars. So complaining that you have to pay towards a mobility car, for instance, does not always come across well. But having regard for anyone else's feelings, other than your own, has clearly gone out the window long ago.

im not trying to attack you im sorry Lesley im also not trying to say my cats bigger than your cat but my situations dire atm and i dont think ill be able to carry on much longer if these services are removed like this ive no idea how ill cope because im not living im just coping

and here we are again with Nijinsky saying most people are lazy layabouts if there on DLA and im selfish as sh said yesterday for not worrying about her friend who struggles to make his childs private school fees . im as down as i can be keep kicking keep kicking