Being blackmailed by in laws.

[Daisytrotter]

Sorry, more of a wwyd but am sitting here in pieces, really need advice.

Apologies if I don't reply straight away but have to pick up my friend from the airport.

My mil was diagnosed with dementia two weeks ago. This is after a year of some behaviour which could be considered odd. Interestingly, it was me who suggested that she visit her gp after I found that she had taken the fluffy inserts out of my croc shoes and was wearing them as slippers Also, she has been having some significant memory problems, but all in all she functions quite well.

Since ds was born 14 months ago, mil has come to stay with us for a week every month. Fil comes down twice a year or we go to stay with them (they live in Swansea. It's not an arrangement that I was ever happy with but ds is her first grandchild and I wanted her to have a strong relationship with him. however, her visits have become increasingly hard work for me as she turns the fridge off at the mains, leaves the back door open as well as other things which a not dangerous per se but annoying. Also dh is at work all day so I am at home with her.

When she comes down she really badgers us to go out so she can babysit. On the three occasions she has babysat, we have come back to find ds absolutely hysterical. I put it down to the fact that he doesn't really know her but now I think she may be leaving him for long periods to cry.

Anyway, since the diagnosis came to light, I spoke to dh and said that I am no longer happy for her to come for a week every month and I don't want her to babysit. I suggested that her and fil come every two months. I just have a feeling that she was using the time with us for a break for herself and i feel as her disease progresses, fil will be using the break as respite care. Dh thought this was a good idea and put it to them when he called them.

They went ballistic. Mil insisted on keeping to the arrangement of monthly visits and babysitting and fil said we were compromising her dignity. I understand that they are struggling with the diagnosis but I also have to think of ds and my own life.

Then fil dropped a bombshell. They had lent us money to buy our house and he said that if mil was not good enough to babysit then their money wasn't good enough for us either. He has demanded it back which essentially means we have to sell the house and rent as we would not be able to buy another property. He has also threatened us with legal action if we do not pay the money back in full by the end of June.

I don't know what to do. They are extremely well off and don't need the money so this is tantamount to blackmail. I have no issue with them visiting I just don't want mil every month and I certainly don't want her to babysit.

Help?

why not let her come down for a wk as she was but you dont' go out , let her babysit clearly,. This may be her last chances for her to get to know her grandson, in few mnths she may not be able to travel, to spend time away from home etc....

daisytrotter I understand that it is hard for them, but under no circumstances would I have MIL babysitting, she is just not safe now. I would rather sell my house and pay them back then put my child's life at risk. Mabey in the future you both can work something out with FIL

'why not let her come down for a wk as she was but you dont' go out , let her babysit clearly,. This may be her last chances for her to get to know her grandson, in few mnths she may not be able to travel, to spend time away from home etc....'

Did you just not read the thread?

I do think your DH and BIL have a responsibility towards their Moyer and father in this matter. I think you and your SIL have a responsibility to support your dh's in discharging this responsibility. However, your mil visiting for a week at a time, for most of which her son will be at work, is not the solution. It sounds like your fil needs to drive her down, even if he then leave again, for a weekend at a time only. Or, that your DH or all of you as a family need to visit his parents regularly instead.

Your DH is clearly talking lots to his father, and you need to support him in doing so. But ultimately the loan side of things is a wild goose chase; fil doesn't care about the money, he cares about his wifes health, happiness and how he will cope. Your DH, I'm sure, is worrying about the same things, and if he keeps talking, will be able to make this clear to his father.

"There is a husband and two sons who need to step up to the plate before the DIL has it all land on her shoulders, where it has been for quite a while already."

absolutely, I completely agree with Dittany, this is a grave injustice, and as perfectstorm says, appalling ingratitude

Not to dismiss anyone else's posts, they're all great, but perfectstorm I'm really liking your work on this one.

OP, any progress (um, when it's not stupid o'clock in the morning, obviously)? Please tell me you and your husband are going to stand your ground, this is beyond ridiculous. "Disrespectful" to refuse to act as an unpaid respite carer for seven day stretches. Has your FIL always been a sexist twat? It's a serious question - the dynamic here suggests that he's a wanker very patriarchal sort of bloke.

OP-I´m thinking I would be wary of having MIL brought to you-apart from the fact that she might feel more comfortable in her own house, FIL might not collect her when he said.

I think visits need to be at ILs now tbh.

Just a thought, could you have her for a trial week with your dh off work and document all the stuff she did that makes it unsafe for you to have her by yourself whilst in charge of your toddler, present FIL with the information as proof of your desire to keep MIL and toddler safe but your inability to do so.

If your PIL are quite well off could they pay for your toddler to attend a nursery one day a week so you can lengthen the fortnightly/monthly weekend stay offer ? It's not what you would prefer to do I'm sure but time will surely be limited with your MIL before coming to visit you is impossible.

I also wondered if a chat by FIL (preferably with your dh and BIL in attendance too so there are no doubts over the advice received/interpretation thereof) with an appropriate health care provider knowledgeable of dementia would appraise him of the fact that it is surely hastening her decline to be shuttled back and forth and to have to re-adjust to different surroundings each time.

This has made me feel really sad. I haven't read most of the posts, so i may be well behind the times but this is how i read your first post:

MIL is a big part of our lives and of our child's life.
She has just been diagnosed with a dreadfully sad illness.
In response we told her we don't want her at our house anymore because - i quote "I just have a feeling that she was using the time with us for a break for herself and i feel as her disease progresses, fil will be using the break as respite care."

I'm glad your not my family. You should be stepping up support - not taking it away.

I agree that she shouldn't be left to look after your child alone, but have a thought how you would like to be treated by your child if this happened to you - or indeed when other faculties go as you get old. It happens to most of us.

sorry fr spelling errors. LO' b/fast getting soggy.

"I'm glad your not my family. You should be stepping up support - not taking it away."

What about the support that the FIL owes his own wife?

If it wasn´t for the OP, there probably wouldn´t be a diagnosis?

Shouldn´t the FIL actually be saying that can visits now be to them as it´s obvious MIL can´t travel alone-or can he now come for the week also?

I've not read the thread fully yet, but there is no way I'd be looking after my MIL for a week at a time and no way would she be left with my child when she has dementia. If you are paying back the loan, then I doubt the court would make you sell your house to return the money all at once. If your IL's never got a legal document drawn up then they took a risk in lending the money and will have to accept repayment at the rate you can afford. See a solicitor though to find out where you stand. I'd imagine that the court would set you a repayment schedule, which you have already.

If someone attempted to blackmail me like this, I'd tell them to fuck off and wouldn't see them at all. I'd not be inclined to do anything to help them from now on. They are basically saying that their loan buys them control of your life, which is not on

And it not blackmail. Yes, your FIL has broached it badly but i'm sure he is very hurt.
But you can't blame him for wondering why should he help you financially, if you don't help him and his wife when they need their family.

The opening poster has not said that they don't want mil around -just not so frequently when there is a small child -how anybody could think them unreasonable for this I do not know!

Besides which, the fil is (effectively) blackmailing them over this.

If the op and husband are capable of getting a loan from elsewhere, they should do so and pay their pils off. It may be robbing Peter to pay Paul, but at least a bank would not emotionally blackmail them like this. They should then tell blackmailing see-you-next-tuesdays pils to piss off forever which is what I would do cos I'm a bitch like that offer to have mil around on THEIR terms not pils.

I hated receiving ANYTHING from my ex-mil, even if it were a meal. I knew that she was the controlling bitch sort who would turn such generosity against us-luckily, we'd have had to have been starving to accept money off of her.
Daisy, you and your dh are going to get out of your pils pocket, you really are, you are at their command and-in the best possible way- your dh needs to man up.

She's being expected to act as an unpaid, unqualified carer to a person who is not her mother whilst at the same time looking after a toddler.

Pretty shameful to suggest she's not being 'supportive'.

I'm glad you're not my family, either, estya, because I'd tell you to take a long walk on a short pier if, like the OP's FIL, you demanded respite care.

Both my parents instruct us every single time, if they get dementia, please put them in a home.

I feel the same way. In fact, I'd go a step better and ask for my own children to please put me out of my misery if we can come up with a way to do it that won't involve their going to prison. Although if I'm able to I'll do the job myself first.

I'd FAR rather be dead than a burden to my family in such a way.

"They are basically saying that their loan buys them control of your life, which is not on"

True.

But perhaps OP & her husband have done things because of the loan that also make FIL feel entitled.

Depending on the size of the loan and the rate at which it´s being paid back, I think a lot of people might think that certain "rights" go with it, I´m afraid.

I agree with Morloth- it's a really bad idea to borrow from family, particularly where it is done on an informal basis like this without proper documentation. Your FIL has backed down on the foreclosure threat for the moment, but you've had fair warning now, this is what he will do if he feels stressed/ doesn't like something you are doing/wants to get his own way. Get that loan repaid, whether via a bank loan, by downsizing or whatever you have to do. He's done it once- he WILL do it again.

And YANBU you are a terrific caring DIL. It's a pity your FIL isn't thinking about the safety of his grandchild or the comfort of his wife (who is going to be increasingiy unsafe and uncomfortable on the long trips to you). He is only thinking of his week off.

I also can´t really see what the problem is in paying FIL back by a loan tbh.

Surely until it´s been paid back,he owns the house?

Also, he might need the money for care for MIL in the future, so may ask-and mean it at another time.

'Surely until it´s been paid back,he owns the house?'

He may cause to press for a lein on the house if it came to a court/legal issue, but the house is owned by whoever has the title deeds, which is probably the mortgage lender.

Well it reads to me as if FIL has bought the house & OP & her husband are paying him back.

Either way, it´s not likely that he is named on the deeds, is it?

God the emotional bribary must be hard to take. And shame on the men in this family for pushing all of this on you! Cowards!

Lending them the deposit (informally) doesn't give him any rights over the house. As far as the mortgage company are concerned, the OP and her DH paid the deposit and are paying the mortgage. Unless he had a legal agreement giving him a stake in the house, then it is not his.

If the OP wanted to be arsey, she could not pay her FIL back at all and unless he's got legal proof that it was a loan and not a gift, then there's probably jack shit he could do about it anyway. Now, I'm not saying that the OP should take this stance, just that, if you lend someone money and don't have a legal agreement, getting it back is not always easy.

If this went to court, it is likely that the OP would be told to repay the money at a court agreed rate which she is doing anyway.

I agree that there are some people you shouldn't borrow money from and toxic in laws fall into that category. I still think the OP should tell him to fuck off and should continue to pay back the loan at the rate she initially agreed to. As far as I can see her FIl has done her no great favour by lending his son this money. He didn't actually give it to them, it is getting repaid. And the OP has had her MIL stay for a quarter of the time.

Personally, I'd rather live in a shed!

"unless he's got legal proof that it was a loan and not a gift,"

Surely the fact that OP is regularly paying back shows that it is a loan?

I would disagree about FIL doing a favour though as without the loan, they wouldn´t be in the house!

But itshouldn´t come with strings.

I think that the opening poster and her husband own the house, but it would be quite clear that they had a loan from pils to do so, however, I think if this did go to court, the 'judge' would ask what prompted the pils to ask for money back in 'one go' and, on hearing that it was out of emotional blackmail of sorts, would take a dim view (the weakest most powerless person here is the toddler and the judge would have to make his safety paramount- i.e. having a person with dementia around a toddler for a week 24/7 would not be safe if other options available-which there would be) of this. My guess is that the 'status quo' i.e. them paying loan back at the rate at which they are currently doing would remain.
This is my opinion only. Obviously!