How old should little boys be when they use the men's room instead of the Ladies' room with Mum?

[missinglalaland]

I only have two girls, so I don't know the ins and outs of parenting boys. Sometimes I am surprised at the height and age of boys being steered into the "ladies" room by their mothers. Often with Fathers waiting outside!!! (Lazy gits.) I am thinking that in a place like a train station you should expect to see mum's being fairly protective, but I get a bit annoyed in places like National Trust toilets, when the boys seem embarrassed/interested.

What's the proper etiquette?

My 8 year old DS comes into the ladies toilet with me if my DH isn't with us. There is no way he is going into a mens toilet on his own and I coudn't give a crap what anyone thinks about that. I think when he gets to 10/11 I would let him go alone but would still wait outside.

Doesn't it depends on the child and the circumstances rather than a one size fits all approach? Most 11 yos would no doubt refuse point blank to use the ladies. But I can see that there may be some children who lack the confidence, and some circumstances where a mother might feel uncomfortable letting an 11 yo go on his own. Not often, especially by the age of 11, but occasionally, for some children.

Isn't it up to the parent to do what they think it best for the child and for us onlookers to trust that they have made the right choice? At the end of the day a pre-pubescent boy in a ladies loo (which all have cubicles) is hardly a serious inconvenience.

Exactly Scroob: what I have been trying to say, only with much better phrasing.

I would worry if my child didn't have the confidence to use a public loo on his own at 11.
And mens loo's do have cubicles for those who dont want to use a stand up urinal or are a little on the shy side.

Now we just need the rest of the world to think like you two!

But who would we argue debate with?

Oh people find ways to argue with me LMAO

Becuase I am not very tolerant to bigoots an teh judgemental

Which make me judgemental and somewhat bigoted doesn;t it?

[confysed]

I need a lie down!

Yes men's loos do have cubicles although dh informs me they are more for poo than shyness

But you usually have to walk past the urinals

If it were all cubicles i would not give a damn tbh which gender's toilets I used

I've already posted on here that I will still be taking my DS into the ladies but thought I would add some background info before I get pounced on.

DS1 is 9 and is autistic as well as having global developmental delay, he's also very tall for his age, looks around 11ish. When we are going to be out for a long time I always put him in a nappy and a SN buggy as he needs it but atm, we are trying to toilet train and get him walking more so, for short journeys, I don't. Those short journeys, I take him into the ladies, every 15 minutes or so to prevent accidents. I get dirty looks for using disabled loos as he doesn't "look" disabled. On long days I use baby changing when he needs a fresh nappy, I get dirty looks for this too. There is finally one shopping centre that has adult changing facilities so use this when I can, but obviously am not always at that end of town. When I need to use the toilets I have to take him into the ladies with me, I can't leave him to wait outside as I'd never see him again. Thanks to all of you who have made my life even more difficult by frowning upon this, because I could really do with even more people judging me.

But peachy other people do care and wouldn't want uni sex toilets. I know because there is a place near us with unisex toilets - 4 stalls and shared washroom, that I have heard women complain about. So just because you are not bothered about the idea of unisex toiledts, it doesn't mean that everyone else feels the same.

And one of my male friends I know sits down in a cubicle to wee. He said through speaking with malefriends he has found quite a few men do this.

ohboy - I think it is unreasonable to take SEN 10, 11 year olds into the ladies. But as I posted earlier I used to give respite care to disabled children and teenagers in my home. I got the stares when I had to take boys into the ladies who didn't look as if they had SEN.

But tbh I don't think you would get these stares if over protective mothers didn't take their 10 and 11 year old non SEN children into the ladies with them. If that was the case, any older boy would be assumed to have SEN.

sorry mean't to say to take non SEN children in to ladies

Perhaps Lesley but I can't stop them can I? I just have to get by with my 4 (all of whom have some level of SEN_ suspected as, diagnosed as, suspected add and autism).
Somewhat regretfully me and the NT world have very few links these days.

If people start, I stare back. I will never like confrontation but am used tio it now- everyone seems to have a dislike don;t they? the boy's noises, eating habits, clothes- something.

Anyway men are as likely to feel uncomfy as women if 'their' spaces are invaded and why don't their views count? Why should women in locked cubicles get the primary say?

If I could access disabled facillities without being eitehr refused or judged ( anything from being physically barred and accused of lying about AS at a festival to disabled people accusing me of wanting their disability) then I would.

But I won;t accept that I am a second rate person becuase I am a carer whose needs don;t fit a clear box and be made to feel that our needs are an inconvenience. Embarassment? yeah right, you should try the inconvenience of having 4 disabled kids then you might get it (and yes well done on the respite care- but you got to choose).

Maybe I have just ahd to toughen up over the eyars but I fail to see why someone would be that embarassed by knowing that a child is outside their locked door - a child of a different gender - that they would insist their needs supersede those of the people using the other toilet that isn;t entirely cubciled.

Sorry if the existence of my child means that others feel he should be hidden rather than cause embarassment (as long as it's not my loo, right? the men can be invaded by you as carer without my concern....) but all cubcile supersedes part cubicle every time IMO. And it would be the same whether it was the males or females that were cubicled, it just so happens that in our society it is the female.

Ah you see scrap that now you put non sen chidlren LMAO

Until my boys were 5/6 they always went into the ladies with me even if DH was with us. After that DS1 wanted to go into the gents with his dad. I remember letting DS1 go into the gents on a station platform alone when he was 8. Unfortunately he came out of the wrong door and ended up looking for me on the wrong platform. He paniced but did tell a guard that he was lost. I just paniced!

I have no problem with 9,10, 11 year old males in the ladies on stations or motorway services. Maybe in restaurants, swimming pools etc. where boys are in familiar surrounding 7 and 8 year olds should be getting used to using the gents.

"but I fail to see why someone would be that embarassed by knowing that a child is outside their locked door - a child of a different gender"

Well exactly.

Unless women want to be able to prance round naked outside the cubicles I can't see that it really matters.

I wonder what the worried people would do if they have or had a son? After all, their son may be outside a bathroom door no?

Heck mine manage to sneak in all the time

You know what, I think this might be one of those British things.

IME a trip to France is not complete unless I have been engaged in earnest conversation whilst at the urinal by a couple of women seeking to avoid the queue in the Ladies.

I wouldn't mind but my French isn't what it used to be and I tend to get a bit flustered with my tenses.

MoreBeta, you clearly have not been to enough of the rougher type of nightclub have you?

]

My worry is far more for the non SEN 10 and 11 year olds who can't be trusted by their mothers to go to the toilet alone. I think over protectiveness like this is not helpful the boy. And I am sure if class mates saw a 10 or 11 year old boy being escorted to the ladies by his mother, he would at the very least get teased about this.

Yes I know I got to choose with the respite care and I am not expecting any kudos for that at all. I only mentioned it to say that I do know what it is like taking an SEN child - autism and developmental delay- who doesn't look disabled, into a ladies toilet. Just as I know what it is like to change a nappy on a 13, 14, 15 year old in public toilets - not easy.

I knew some parents whose children didn't look disabled but had autism, dress their girl in the stereotypical clothes that 30 years ago marked you as disabled e.g. flowery childish dresses for teenage girls. I'm not sure why this type of dress was stereotypical of clothing worn by disabled girls/women, unless it is associated with the kind of clothes people wore in institutions. These institutions were just beginning to close then and they housed a large percentage of learning disabled children.

Anyway the parents did this as they wanted strangers to realise she was disabled and to basically cut them some slack when she started twirling, or making strange grunting noises, or didn't answer a question as she couldn't speak.

peachy - no I am embarrassed to confess I have only been in a nightclub 4 times in my life and the last two times was Anabelles some 20 years ago where a man in a white jacket hovered behind you as you wash your hands ready to hand you a fresh towel.

I can see that Lesley: I trhink ease is why soem clothes become popular for sn kids- eg joggers.

For ds3 that's OK; he doesn;t care as long as it's pink tbh and it was joggers until recenty and he does look SN now. DS1 has his osn rules and us mere mortals must confrm LOL (wants to be a jewellery designer)

My friend who is a police sergent says he knows of 47 cases of assault on a child in a public convenience in the last 3 years.

Is that enough to make you paranoid.

9 I would say. That's the rules at my local swim baths change room- in own gender from 9 years.