to wonder why Katie Hopkins had three children?

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She went back to work three weeks after having her babies and thinks all women should. I was still bleeding heavily and surviving on about three hours sleep a night then!!!!!!

I can really understand that if your parents didn't put you first, you feel very aggrieved. It's awful to feel that and fwiw I felt a bit like that about my dad so I understand how hard that is and I sympathise.

But I have taken your posts to be making a very clear statement along the lines that mothers who work are not putting their children first, which is a far stretch IMHO. Your use of words like "dump" is very emotive and your vitriol at one particular woman who has gone back very early.

I really haven't deliberately "twisted" what you've said, I've asked you to clarify certain opinions, that is reasonable debate.

See I was/am a SAHM for 7 years and this was for a multitude of (boring)reasons. One of them was that I was unable yo find decent affordable childcare. I saw excellent nurseries which had awaiting list two years long and others which had no natural daylight or mixed two year olds with 5 year olds in massive noisy rooms.

Another reason was DP starting a business and was working 12- 14 hour days.

And to be honest I have some regrets about loss of earnings, status etc, I have happy memories of sitting in parks eating strawberries, made loads of friends.
I wish people could be honest about their experiences working or not instead of being forced into these ridiculous polarised arguments.

Precisely Norman - I rearranged work to shorter days so i could pick DS up when he started school.

However he hated it as he wants to go to after school club with his friends, so we are now compromising on me picking him up 2 days a week . This is easier for me but I made the assumption he would want me at the school gates - it is all individual.

" it is all individual"

Hell yes!

I'll admit to watching a TV program this week where a mum took her 5 month old baby to nursery for the first time. It choked me up, and I said to DH "I'd rather not have children than have to leave them in nursery at that age." DH laughed and said I was bizarre.

The thing is I didn't know I would feel like that before I had DC. DH likes to quote something I said when I was pregnant with DC1; "I won't be one of those mothers who never leaves my child. I'm just going to leave my baby with anyone and get on with my life." Oh, yes, I have eaten those words many times over, and thanked God I didn't need to work to eat and have a roof over my head.

The world is not perfect, and not everybody earns enough for a fabulous nanny or nursery, or has grandparents on tap.

KH can keep her opinions on coffee drinking, toddler group attending mums to herself, because no one really wants to hear it. Especially the bit about brains turning to mush, which is just rude and patronising. If you feel bored hanging out with your pre-school child, at least have the guts to say it. If you do find small children dull, it's a matter of personality, not intelligence, IMO.

She is repulsive and a disgrace to her sex.

woe peppa your post at 16.41 was brilliant.

Just to add...some children are happier to venture off into the big wide world at an early age without a parent with them.
And if children are going to be cared for by someone other than a family memeber, child care should be the best it can be. I think in this country we are very lucky that generally childcare is pretty decent.

KH did make an interesting point re; small companies not wanting to employ women of child bearing age. I know that when DH looks to employ someone he would rather recruit someone into sales who is the main earner in the household, and who have DC, as these tend to be the the most driven, in his opinion.

Thanks pickyourbrain - sense I am a little irate by Mr James?

She was a contestant on the apprentence a few years ago. Became well known for getting everyones backs up and having a very high opinion of herself. If i remember rightly she made a comment about getting anything she wants -including someone else's husband!
For some reason she's back on the scene slating anyone who wants to enjoy being a mum.
I find the woman vile, but then if she didn't spout out such crap she would never be heard of now.

I'm another person who has never heard of her. She sounds like an attention seeker, whoever she is.

peppa I did sense that. You'll see frm my post above that I too laughed out loud at the suggestion that he was unbiased!

You can argue that he is unbiased, but as I said he was suggested as a "user friendly" way of reading attachment theory, that doesnt involve reading research papers. I dont agree with everything he says, but actually he makes some very valid points, and so what if he wrote the books because he wasnt happy with his own upbringing? Many people are driven to do things because of their past.

But our point Nullius is that he presents his opinion and his cherry picked studies as fact. Fine if you want to read that and use his opinions to support your own but as an overall unbiased source of information he is ridiculous - only beaten by that other one whose name I cannot remember!

I agree that he presents some good points of attachment theory but then he goes onto skew his ideas so far (probably to sell books). He uses his own experiences and suggests they apply to the majority.

I also cannot stand anyone who writes this type of opinion piece about what another group in society should do e.g. it is all very well for him saying mums should stay home as that suits him very well doesnt it (e.g. he was not a mum, nor did he actually spend vast amounts of time with his own children). It is like me saying everyone should just give up smoking - fine for me to say as I dont smoke or experience the problems of smoking. Actually this is a bad example as there is actually scientific evidence about the not smoking.

(p.s. I do not really feel everyone should just give up easy as that, nor am i comparing childcare to smoking - just same underlying ideas)

I am fed up of middle aged men telling women what they should do, especially when they have no scientific evidence to back it up.

Apologies, he drives me insane!

We know a couple who are very "attachmenty" but who, for financial reasons, have been pushed into a position were the mum became redundant so her 2 day working week arrangment has gone out the window and she has a new job which involves a 4 day week. Her dh, who is very Biddulphian and would wax lyrical about the importance of her 2 day week to all and sundry etc and how materialistic we all are eetc, is now faced with going to a 4 day week himself as they can't afford for childcare for their children for 4 days.

He is very, very down about it and what it will do to his career, that he will be expected to do a full-time job in part-time hours or given all the shitwork and that it will affect his progression/pension etc. Interestingly, none of this was a consideration when it was his wife who was taking the hit (though actually she was the higher earner and more interested in her job than he was)

Unfortunatly thats the way women and men have been raised over generations, to expect that to be the case. How old is the child? Next time he is whining to you, you should point out that actually, if he stays home with the child and looks after it well there should be no problem. Especially if his wife is the higher earner and he's the one concerned about attachment!!