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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to wonder why Katie Hopkins had three children?

215 replies

ShuffleBallChange · 05/05/2011 19:34

She went back to work three weeks after having her babies and thinks all women should. I was still bleeding heavily and surviving on about three hours sleep a night then!!!!!!

OP posts:
pickyourbrain · 07/05/2011 12:46

Quite.

I hated being at home with a baby. I have no doubt that had I not gone back to work when my dd was 12 weeks she would have had a crap time of it with her mother slowly going insane Grin

I kind of had to work, I mean I could have got by. But the sacrifce would have outweighed the benefits, for me and my dd.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 07/05/2011 12:47

Agrees with pickyourbrain... Most parents make the best choices they can for their children and their families. Nobody knows the 'inside story' or the reasons why and it's really nobody's business.

I too agree with the last paragraph of Pick's post; MN is full of women who defend their 'choices' even though those decisions affect their children. Anybody who posts anything in disagreement of those posters come under fire. Yet here, a woman who has three children who decides to go back to work is ripped to pieces. Her life, her choices, no? The fact that she's in the media doesn't mean that we know her reasons or even that we should.

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 12:58

Hairylights you can give me your no comments and cut and paste the bits of my argument that suit you all you like.
I also clearly stated I am not against working mothers in general and it is her attitude to her children and SAHM im annoyed with.

She had all three, knowing full well she would leave them at three weeks old to go back to work. I think that is wrong and I am entitled to think thats wrong.

hairylights · 07/05/2011 13:02

Why, thank you Grin

You are behaving just like kh but in reversal. Judgemental.

pickyourbrain · 07/05/2011 13:03

But why are you entitled to think that it's wrong? theyre not your children?

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 13:06

How on earth am I behaving like her?

Ok sorry my mistake, I am just a misogynist. Clearly havent read enough feminism books.

Now it has dawned on me that to be a true feminist I must do what I want make my choices no matter what they are and sod my children.

If I want to do something I just do it, bollocks to their welfare, infact I might just go and leave my DC now and go to the pub, thats what I want and its my choice . I might even meet a nice married man whilst I am there.

Thankyou for making me a true feminist according to your rules, hairy lights.

pickyourbrain · 07/05/2011 13:08

No no, leaving your children alone to go to the pub is negligent. Leaving them with a responsible adult while you go to work is not.

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 13:09

pickyourbrain Im entitled to think it is wrong because I am ebtitled to an opinion. And because I had a mother like Katie and have done alot of reading around attachment theory.
I think murder is wrong, yet im not a victim of it.

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 13:10

pickyourbrain, I will say again, I dont think it is wrong to leave your child with a responsible adult, or to work. I dont judge you for working.

I judge her damn well selfish attitude.

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 07/05/2011 13:12

Nullius... You're behaving like her because you're judging, just like she does.

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 13:14

Yes you are right, I am judging her. For something that is obviously wrong, calling SAHM's lazy and advocating that women should tolerate sexism and act like men. For sleeping with other peoples husbands, and then preaching to us about standards.

Oh well, im judgemental. Im happy to be, in this case.

hairylights · 07/05/2011 13:17

Because you are judging women too.

hairfullofsnakes · 07/05/2011 13:18

Oh for goodness sake nullius is entitled to thing what she likes and as for the comment from a poster about why are you entitled to think it's wrong - she is entitled because we all have opinions and that's what happens in the real world

pickyourbrain · 07/05/2011 13:18

I think enough of the dramatic analogies. Murder is illegal, it's effect is that someone dies - anyone knows that is wrong.

Yes calling SAHM's lazy and advocating that women should tolerate sexism and act like men. For sleeping with other peoples husbands, and then preaching to us about standards is all wrong. But no one is pulling you up on that. I was merely pulling you up on language like 'dumping' and judging a woman for having 3 children knowing full well she would be going back to work after 3 weeks.

hairylights · 07/05/2011 13:19

If you dint thunk it's wring to place your children with another adult, why did you use the term "dump"up thread?

LyingWitchInTheWardrobe2726 · 07/05/2011 13:22

She's not preaching though, Nullius, she's giving her opinion. Who on earth cares what Katie Hopkins thinks? I don't understand what's to get het up over.

If you judge her then you judge others here who are or may have been, in the same boat on a particular aspect. No two circumstances are identical but people do get offended when they're being judged. Do you like it?

NulliusInVerba · 07/05/2011 13:24

thankyou, hairfullofsnakes

hairylights, I dont aspire to be a broken record, so I will clarify this for you one more time, try to understand......

She is dumping them because that is her attitude. She is not thinking of the welfare of her children, or analysing working or any of that, she is dumping them because she wants to do what she wants to do, sod the rest of the world. She is dumping them so that she can preach to the rest of us how wonderful she is, and how terribly lazy we are. There is no compassion in that woman anywhere.

KittySpencer · 07/05/2011 13:28

Nullius, but surely you could say that all working parents are doing what they want to do in going back to work? Not many go back unwillingly.

pickyourbrain · 07/05/2011 13:32

I don't think it is her attitude that she is dumping her children. She leaves them with her mother (whom I have heard her say that she pays) if it were the case that she didnt give a shit, wouldnt she leave them somewhere less suitable?

hairylights · 07/05/2011 13:36

I do get it because I can read, thanks. Still disagree with you and wonder if you read back through your posts, you might find where some of us are considering your comments to be both judgemental and disrespectful.

It's her right and choice to place her children in the care if another responsible adult. It's a bug assumption to make that in so doing she (and by implication, others) are not considering what's best for their children.

There is actually no evidence to prove it's harmful, neglectful or damaging to do so and no rule book about when is the right time to return to work. There is no rule book that says women should only return to
work if they need to financially.

I completely agree that kh has no right to tell other peole what to do or what she thinks they should do and she's a bit of a knob for having done so.

But that doesn't give you free licence to put your opposing views forward as if your views were the right way, nor judge women in general who choose to return to work shortly after having children.

In saying the above, although you may not realise it, you are judging what some women choose to do, and your emotive language just makes it that little bit more inflammatory.

frgaaah · 07/05/2011 13:44

NulliusInVerba said: "She is not thinking of the welfare of her children, or analysing working or any of that, she is dumping them because she wants to do what she wants to do, sod the rest of the world."

I'm not sure how that attitude differs from a huge chunk of the workaholic men I've encountered over the years. I mean, in some cases they were genuine family men who just happened to be the breadwinner (my DH was one for a couple of years whilst I stayed at home - working fartoo many hours and was, essentially, a weekend dad). But in a lot of others they just wanted to do the nice things that parenting involves, whilst ploughing on ahead with their career plans pretty much undented. Their lives didn't change much once they had kids, as after (any?) initial paternity leave, if they choose to take it, there's back to the normal life at the office.

If it weren't the case, we'd see many many more flexible parental working setups e.g. both parents working 4 days a week or 3 days a week each, or morning/evening shift pattern workings, or more SAHDs - and certainly a lot less of the "my husband doesn't support me going back to work now that I've had time out, because he won't have a wife who'll drop everything if there's a childcare emergency"-type threads.

I don't wish to be male-bashing with this post in the slightest, but it does seem that what you are attacking KH for, pretty much 90% of the male working population is JUST as guilty of.

Yet no one calls them on it. Certainly doesn't label them as bad parents. Indeed, they are good providers.

I'd be interested to hear your comments on the above,Nullius.

AlpinePony · 07/05/2011 13:46

highlights you've been very judgmental yourself with the bullshit about "women who go back to work early don't know how hard it is to raise a family and look after the house". Haha that's right, we don't only do that, we do a real job on top of that. (Smirk)

NormanTebbit · 07/05/2011 13:48

We all have free licence to say what we like.

KH really isn't worth arguing about. She is fortunate to be able to get free childcare while she is pursuing her demanding and useful media career, she is fortunate that we all have an appetite for her cookie cutter stereotypes and fluttering eyelashes. She has no chance at a political career, she isn't shrewd or intelligent enough.

NormanTebbit · 07/05/2011 13:51

Christ these SAHM/WOhm 'debates' are pointless.

Just get on with it.

hairylights · 07/05/2011 13:52

Some very good points there frgaaah. That's where my "misogynist" point came from.

Why exactly is it seen to be such a bad thing to be a working mother?

A friend of mine commented that she didn't see the point of women having children and working, and having someone else bring them up. Bit there are some huge assumptions in that. I commented that it can be really great for children to have working mums ... They get to see great examples that woman can have good careers, that we can have independence, and they get to experience different environments and different people early on in life.