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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

They're coming into our country and they don't even have to register to claim benefits now

454 replies

bupcakesandcunting · 24/03/2011 09:28

Not the words of me but of Alf Garnett my mother.

I feel that she has reached the pinnacle of twattery. AIBU to tell her to shut the fuck up with this? Honestly, it makes me so fucking angry, especially when it is punctuated with "I read it in the newspaper", like that makes it definitely true.
Angry

OP posts:
Snobear4000 · 24/03/2011 10:26

My experience is that the Daily Mail types who think they know anything about these sponging immigrants, usually live in areas that are almost completely white, in Fenland villages or the Isle Of Wight or wherever.

I am an immigrant. I was not allowed to claim any benefits for the duration of my first visa and also whilst on an indefinite leave to remain visa. I never have claimed benefits even though I have been a UK citizen now for many years.

Close friends who have emigrated from a country that does not allow dual citizenship, are on indefinite leave, but are not UK citizens. They have children (UK citizens) and jobs here, pay taxes, contribute. However they are not entitled to any tax relief, childcare vouchers, anything. Far from coming over here and going on to benefits, they contribute more to the UK economy by way of being barred from getting the tax relief that UK citizens are entitled to.

OP's mum is speaking out of her arse. As is fabbychic, who no doubt comes from North Queensland where they still have one bar for whites and another for Aboriginies in some of the pubs.

ShirleyKnot · 24/03/2011 10:26

Alpine - link please?

Cannot bear looking through that board, it's all vagina migranes and nit breast checks over there.

MsFaithless · 24/03/2011 10:29

AP - a MN thread is not 'evidence', it's anecdote at best if I'm being generous, or a bored troll if I'm not.

I dunno if they're not coming here to take our jobs they're here to take our benefits. Bloody fickle furriners should make their minds up Wink

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:31

Alpine - my exFIL came to the UK just under 2yrs ago - for a 6 month visit. The night before he was due to fly over here he was involved in a car crash. Had a pretty nasty head wound. Thankfully most superficial, but given that the flight was less than 12 hours later flying was out of the question even though he was stiched up and sent home.

He flew here a week later, but was having sight and balance problems. (almost certainly as a result of the accident). He saw many doctors, and consultants while he was here............paid for by his children. I think he had one free bit of medical care when they took him to A&E as they were concerned for him. I think (but am not certain) that emergency treatment is free for anyone. but everything else has to be paid for - unless you're from a country which has a bi-lateral healthcare agreement with the UK.

bupcakesandcunting · 24/03/2011 10:32

ROAR at MsFaithless benefits/jobs indecision Grin

I called my mum on that once when she was moaning that my deadbeat brother couldn't get a job after he finished college (strange that my two cousins managed) because of "all der powles tacking teh jobz" I was like "yeah yeah, last week they were taking all the benefits, which is it" She glazed over.

AND THEY STEAL ARE WIMMIN.

OP posts:
BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:33

haha OliPolly - I know - with a few exceptions to the rule (there's always a few aren't there Grin - it was certainly a trait I found while out there.

Ciske · 24/03/2011 10:34

My friend is from Venezuela and had to sign a form promising she would not claim benefits in the UK before she was allowed to stay. She is married to a Brit and has a child here, but trust me, there were no state hand outs and she has to work for every penny she gets. I'm an EU immigrant and I'm entitled to the same in the UK as I would be in my own country. Just like British people the other way around.

The Daily Mail and its stupid anecdotes are to blame for a lot of unnecessary hostility and misunderstanding.

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:34

bupcakes............well that bit is true.........an immigrant (though he wasn't whe I married him) stole me..........(still not sure whether that was a good thing or a bad thing given that we're now getting divorced Grin)

Snobear4000 · 24/03/2011 10:35

Heh heh I stole one ov your wimmin.

Birdsgottafly · 24/03/2011 10:36

But alot of those coming here are doing so that they can 'take advantage' (i mean that in a possitive way) of opportunities and/or education. Some peoples point is that there should not be a lack of the same opportunities in any country in the EU and if there is then we should be looking to put an end to that. Unless there is the same opportunity how can there be a fairness? because if a job is taken then that is one less, but if the equivalent job exsists in another country then that gives the youth of the UK and the EU,hope. It must be a terrible position to be in to have to leave your family and children, as i see some of the people not from the UK, i work with, having to do. There's more than one point of view to why immigration is not the ideal way to proceed.

ConfessionsOfAnAchingFanjo · 24/03/2011 10:38

I'm not allowed any benefits. Had to jump through hoops of fire to be allowed to come into this country. I am allowed to work and pay taxes. My DH is allowed to claim child benefit for our half British child (not me mind, has to be DH). Any health care I recieve here on the NHS is only because Britain has a recipricol agreement with my home country meaning Brits get healthcare there.
Will be jumping through more hoops of fire in a few months to be allowed to continue staying here.

May I point out my first (and only) language is English and the head of state of my home country is HRM Elizabeth II.

As someone else has already pointed out. Britain is part of the EU. people from other EU countries may come and go around the EU at will as may Brits.

Yes it is annoying when people start banging on about these things without really knowing what they are talking about. And yes you do have to register at the JC for benefits. But really these conversations are just tedious anyway.

Oh and I did register, when I had my biometrics taken back home, came into the country and had my passport stamped.

cookcleanerchaufferetc · 24/03/2011 10:42

There are too many immigrants here ..... Our country is becoming too over populated and we can't afford the cost or the space. Too many immigrants do get benefits as they claim them illegally.

What I hate though is people who are here illegally go on to break the law and don't get deported because a) there is no room at the detention centre so they are asked to come back the next day to get on a plane to go home (of course they are never seen again) or b) it is against their human rights or c) preach about how wonderful their country is and want to have sharia law here (please go back home).

Multiculturalism has failed in this country and we are sinking .....

I do however feel for immigrants who come over to work hard, integrate into British life and make a positive contribution without sending child benefit back to their kids in Poland.

nomoreheels · 24/03/2011 10:42

I have worked with asylum seekers for 8 years. I can assure you that they do not have an easy life. A person's situation is slightly better (if you can call it that) when you first claim, because at least you're receiving weekly cash (approx £38/week for a single person) from the post office.

You do get somewhere to live - but this is normally council or (verging on) slum landlord type property that no one else wants to live in. Many people I met suffered regular abuse or violent attacks from locals who were threatened by them being there.

I worked in a drop in advice and people came in every day to ask for help with rat infestations, no heating in winter, no locks on doors, broken windows, mould on walls. Trying to get reasonable repairs done was a nightmare.

If your claim was refused but there was no safe passage of return to your home country, or if you submitted a fresh claim, your only option is to live on Section 4 support which is a £35/week voucher only which can be used in a number of shops. No cash for even a bus fare - you're expected to walk everywhere, even if you're a single parent with a baby. The standard of accommodation for Section 4 was also generally worse.

You could apply for the right to work if you hadn't had an initial decision on your first claim after a year, but a) most people were refused before then and b) trying to apply for it was a very slow and laborious process. I only knew of one client who got it successfully.

It is a very complex system and there are many more examples and rules I could cite, but the main thing to remember is that most people are fleeing torture and persecution because of their political beliefs/gender/sexuality/ethnic group/religion. Those who come with agents are sometimes abused on the trip here and most have no idea where they are headed. The agent controls everything, from the passports to the border control interview. Once they are through the agent usually dumps them at a police station with no information.

Yes, there are of course some who claim asylum who are actually here for economic reasons, but most of the people I worked with this was absolutely not the case, and their lives here were very hard. They did not want to leave their country, were hugely homesick, but feared for their lives.

Even if they were granted status, this was just the start of another set of problems, because unless they spoke good English (and it's worth pointing out that free ESOL classes for asylum seekers were mainly scrapped) most were often pushed into any manual type job that didn't require language skills by the Jobcentre.

Fair enough, it's important to work and integrate into society, and I realise that we cannot subsidise them taking the time to study, but just illustrating the point that it's not exactly a life of luxury and delight.

LDNmummy · 24/03/2011 10:45

Fabby et al it doesn't work that way. When you read about things like that it is scaremongering. Yes there are a few places in the system where changes need to be made in terms of immigration, but overall, the percentage of people who are able to get undue benefits and the like is much smaller than you would think. In fact, I know and have seen plenty of MN threads to the effect of people who are 'from' this country actually being the one's who scam the system. You know, like those who pretend they don't have a partner living with them and claim all sorts of free housing and benefits.

The kind of living standard refugees and foreigners who come here seeking asylum have to endure is further below the poverty line than most people assume. Unless you have citizenship or leave to remain in this country, you are not entitled to any of the standard benefits to begin with.

The people who are entitled, are people from other parts of the EU from what I understand. Please correct me if I am wrong.

bupcakesandcunting · 24/03/2011 10:48

I've said this on a similar thread before but I have all but given up on trying to correct my mother in her wrong, wrong ways. Instead now, I make up fantastical tales of what "immigrunts" get up to including;

"They're bringing in a new strain of AIDS with them that can be caught when you handle money touched by them" (she turned green at this one)

"They're being given benefits NOT to work"

"Super Mosque with a million seats being built, it will be like Wembley for Islam, only loads bigger. They are making white men on minimum wage build it and they HAVE to observe Ramadam and fast but still work on the building, whilst starving"

"Mohammed al-Fayed will be King of England by 2018"

Proof that bigots are gullible morons.

OP posts:
BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:48

thank you nomoreheels for that insight - I've been looking for the current amount they get but unable to find it.

"Too many immigrants do get benefits as they claim them illegally. "

would you like me to do some links for your of British people claiming benefits illegaly - there's not shortage of them, a quick google and you'll find 1000's of new stories about British born people fraudulently claiming........

bupcakesandcunting · 24/03/2011 10:49

"Multiculturalism has failed in this country and we are sinking ....."

Really? I wish someone had told me earlier. And my Italian paternal family who have lived here since the 1940s seem to have done VERY well not at the expense of Billy Englander Hmm

OP posts:
BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:51

does anyone remember that episode of Secret Millionaire a few years ago. The bloke had really twisted views on asylum seekers and immigrants, and then he volunteered in a hostel type place (can't remember exact details) where aslyum seekers and refugees were living. He met one particular man who was (irrc) an accountant, but because he hadn't been allowed to work while waiting for his decision had been unable to find work.

He had a total transformation of his views and ended up giving this particular bloke a job

TandB · 24/03/2011 10:52

Ooh. Can I play the "what if" game too?

What if Captain Jack Sparrow walks in through the door of this Costa right now, snogs my face off and whisks me away down the Thames on a pirate ship.

[waits]

Saltatrix · 24/03/2011 10:52

Sounds like Daily Mail headlines to me

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:52

oh yes - that bloody multiculturalism

nomoreheels · 24/03/2011 10:53

This is a great resource for myth busting re: asylum seekers

www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/practice/basics/truth.htm

ShirleyKnot · 24/03/2011 10:53

Them bloody muslamics and their Saskia law.

BaroqueAroundTheClock · 24/03/2011 10:53

What if

I win the lottery on Saturday Grin

carminaburana · 24/03/2011 10:54

Op: I feel nothing but pity for you - a grown woman attacking her own mother on a website open to the world. If you were my daughter I'd disown you.

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