They're coming into our country and they don't even have to register to claim benefits now

[bupcakesandcunting]

Not the words of me but of Alf Garnett my mother.

I feel that she has reached the pinnacle of twattery. AIBU to tell her to shut the fuck up with this? Honestly, it makes me so fucking angry, especially when it is punctuated with "I read it in the newspaper", like that makes it definitely true.

I am sure many immigrants coming here have been beneficial. my grandparents were immigrants.

However I think far too many people have come here in the last few years and we haven't got the infrastructure for so many people. We are a small island.

also it depends where you live. sometimes when i go to certain towns locally it is like being in another country.

Some of them do need housing because they have children so they jump the queue which stops someone who is indigenous who may have been on the list for a long time acquiring a home.

Most people i converse with have a similar outlook on the situation so I know it is not just me.

This thread reminds me of the woman I overheard on the bus saying how awful it was that 'illegal immigrants get so many benefits' I don't think she thought that one through.

I was secretly hoping that the BNP would win the last election and send me back to the old country with £50k in my back pocket. It would have been wonderful, or just a refund of all the tax I've paid over the years. I would have been happy with that. But no, they didn't. Because they are morons

" It is good for taxpayers who benefit from lower costs to public services. It is good for employers in low-wage industries like fruit-picking and food packing."
What about employees in low-wage industries? There's a lot more employees than there are employers!

"Despite all the truculent rhetoric about immigrants ?stealing our jobs? the unpalatable truth is that they do the low-status jobs which many Britons turn down, preferring a life of idleness on benefits."
Many Britons turn the jobs down because the pay is too low and the working conditions terrible. Mass immigration has caused this. If employers had to employ British people they would be forced to pay a decent wage and offer conditions that employees found to be acceptable, or the work simply wouldn't get done.

"Sainsburys told a House of Lords committee on immigration recently that the strong work ethic which motivates many foreign-born workers often rubs off on the British-born staff with whom they work. Many immigrants, like those who run the night desk in our hotels, are far more talented and highly-educated than many of those who do most of the complaining."
20 years ago you didn't have people with degrees working for minimum wage on a hotel desk overnight. If you think it is a good thing that that is the case today, I don't know what to say. "Strong Work Ethic" is one thing, I'm sure a lot of slaves had a strong work ethic. It is not always a good thing, if it means people being happy to work for low wages.

So many of the advances that the trade union movement worked and fought for for over a century have been washed away in a few short years. It's especially disgusting that so much of the so-called "left" has been complicit in allowing this to happen.

Not all immigrants (comme moi) work in low paid, low skilled jobs. There are tons and tons of immigrants who are highly skilled and provide great benefit to the UK in terms of industry.

e.g. friend who was working in Academia in Artificial Intelligence and was nearly poached by NASA. Me - I get contacted at least once a week by recruiters offering me interviews for positions, as there is a major shortage of people with my skills in my area. Controversial, I know, but if you go onto the trading floor or pretty much any department of any Investment Bank, 50% or more of the people working there are not British. It's actually quite rare to find someone working in financial services (outside of the FSA) who is British, as the individuals who are skilled enough and motivated enough are all foreign. For e.g. my DP's department has 1 English person (subtly moved on because he was useless), 1 Polish person, 1 Lebanese person, 1 French person, 1 Hungarian person, 1 Indian person. I my department of 20 people, there's only 3 people who are English born and bred (and two of those are the PAs).

last time I checked pharmacy managers didn't earn a low wage

Loaf of Balls

Research from the National Institute of Economic and Social research found that 17 percent of economic growth between 2004 and 2005 was a result of immigration.

Migrants are net contributors to the public purse and therefore subsidise services for UK born residents. Immigrants paid £41.2 billion in tax during 2003-4, according to IPPR.

Any reduction in student visas would devastate higher and further education. Students from overseas contribute at least £3.74 billion annually to UK universities and add £1 billion in GDP. Border and Immigration Minister Phil Woolas said that overseas students are worth £8.5 billion to the UK economy.

The public sector could not function without immigration: a third of doctors and dentists qualified abroad, according to Migration Watch.

47% of nurses in the UK are immigrants good luck running the NHS without that

And, the Economist did a big special on immigration a couple of years ago, in terms of economic benefits:
even if low skilled, immigrants are effectively much cheaper for a country, as most arrive as young adults. This is the cheapest time, in terms of government spending. Children are expensive - lots of medical treatment required, education. Older people are expensive - lots of medical treatment
immigrants are more willing to move to areas where workers are needed (whereas the local population will have ties to a particular area - family etc. and therefore less likely to move, even if there are jobs elsewhere)
immigrants are more likely to retrain to fill skills gaps than local populations

Ron you're talking shit, mate.

THIS "Many Britons turn the jobs down because the pay is too low and the working conditions terrible." got me chuckling, I must admit. I'm certain that the reason that career doleys refuse to work is because the working conditions do not meet some stringent criteria which means that they would actually have to get their pudgy little mitts dirty.

\link{http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3462/3840843136_89ccc74e0f_o.jpg\loaf of balls}

And if wages are too low - it's hardly the fault of immigrants. As far as i'm aware, and this may have changed, but isn't the minimum wage set by the government?

Anyone else wondering which planet Nick Griffin RobF is on?

What Phil Woolas would that be?
The one who was kicked out of the Labour party last year for gross misconduct?

I've had my suspicions about Ron since he said "the liberal left"

Classic Griffin.

I love how he's trying to argue that having a strong work ethic is a bad thing.

That takes quite a level of stupidity

twatkins... it's the indigenous crap that made me wonder

"Oh don't you just love it when you start to notice that you disagree with almost everything a particular poster says on here, and you think to yourself "cor that person seems a bit of an arse but I wonder if I am being uncharitable thinking that?" - and then they go and post something which definitively proves them to be a complete and utter arse and you thus have the green light to blithely ignore every last word they post from now on."

totally agree. and i knew before even clicking on the thread that a certain poster would have one of their spectacularly ignorant posts lined up.

Loaf of balls. yes just what i meant to say.

its um a what people who are "down with the kids" say here in essex. so there

constantly feeding the baby and typing one fingerdly

Vajazz... is that loaf of balls to be served with onion gravy?

You and your strong work ethic. Who are you kidding? What you want is no work ethic. No work ethic will sort this country out. No work ethic and indigenous Brits who will not work for under £20 per hour in the most luxurious of surroundings.

Heh heh.

"And if wages are too low - it's hardly the fault of immigrants. As far as i'm aware, and this may have changed, but isn't the minimum wage set by the government."

It is, but other than that, wages are set by employers. The greater the supply of workers, the lower the wages.

There are far more people working for low wages today than there ever was prior to the minimum wage being introduced. Jobs that fairly recently paid enough for a person to raise a family, get a mortgage with, now pay barely enough for a single person to get by.

Is a strong work ethic a good thing? Yes, but not when employers can take advantage of it by expecting workers to work hard in arduous jobs for only minimum wage. So many jobs pay minimum wage today.

I am no fan of the liberal-left. I don't think they give a shit about normal working-class people any more than the Tories do. At least the Tories are honest about it. I resent the Guardianistas for taking over the Labour party and leading it down the sorry path it has been headed down since John Smith died in 1994 (and to an extent, since the 1980s).

This is not totally relevant but anyway. According to the BNP website a while ago:
Immigration is destroying Welsh culture!

Why?
Because all the non-European (read non-white) immigration into Britain is pushing more poor indigenous English people into Wales resulting in Welsh culture being over-run and overpowered by the English.

Not sure where the Welsh are going according to that logic. Ireland maybe? The sea? I laughed so much about that one. Some of the stuff on the website is hilarious if you are in the right mood because it is just SO ridiculous. Sad that people believe it though.

loaf of balls its real

'Many Britons turn the jobs down because the pay is too low and the working conditions terrible. Mass immigration has caused this'

Sorry RobF but you are talking bollocks and are big businesses favourite type of person because you will turn a blind eye to what's really making things hard for all Britain?s and fall for their divide and conquer tactics which they used to distract people like you from the truth whilst robbing you blind.

Immigrants have not caused terrible working conditions and low wages. Many large companies are still posting record profits and have been every year for the last decade yet the average worker has not seen record pay increases and has actually seen their wages drop when you factor in inflation. The largest theft in history when a massive transference of wealth from the poor to the rich in the way of banking bailouts happened and there are people who won't say a thing about this but who will instead blame the 'Paki' next door because their local library is being closed down.

Workers? rights are being stripped away, just the other day the government said they would end flexible working etc. People like Sir Philip Green get to have a say what will be cut but don't pay taxes. But let's ignore that and blame the Nigerian cleaner who gets to clean his office at 5am.

People are being laid off due to advances in technology meaning there is no need for them. There are also many companies exploiting their workers. I just heard on the news that oil/energy companies are threatening to make thousands of people redundant because Osbourne?s going to pass the 1p off fuel duty he announced yesterday on to them. They have been announcing record profits for years and get tax deductions but won?t swallow a penny a gallon and keep their staff? Immigrants did not cause this.

We keep being told there's no money so services are being cut yet all of a sudden we can find money to go to war against Libya. How much do you think the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq are costing us? Immigrants are not responsible for the mess we're in but as long as there are useful idiots like you around, the people who have genuinely made things hard for everybody, regardless of their country of origin, will get away with it.

It's not immigrants making your life harder, its rich 'indigenous' business owners and the government also mainly rich and 'indigenous'.