AIBU to not be "grateful" enough to DH?

[Sleeplesssister]

OK so I know I am being a spoiled brat but I figure I probably need to get flamed on here in order to get a grip. Have one DD, aged 8 months. Love her to bits but have been debating for ages about whether to go back to work part time. My old job was working for an investment bank however so although I could maybe do 4 days a week they will be long days, with DD in a nursery from 8am until 6pm. Have therefore decided to stay at home and not return to work. Don't need to go back to work, husband has a well paid job and we could manage financially on just his salary. But I have been a bit grumpy about the idea of staying at home, and as a result I've been moaning a bit to my DH, who is working v long hours (not back till 8pm at the earliest). He reckons I need to realise how lucky I am and be more appreciative of the long hours he is putting in to support us (he is hell bent on private schools for DD). I'm feeling a bit lonely stuck at home with DD and have not made many mum friends yet. DH is giving me the cold shoulder for the last 3 days because I've been grumpy. Sad about giving up my career but also can't bear the idea of leaving DD for that many days a week. Why is it so hard? I'm a spoilt so and so I know. Took me bloody ages to get pregnant as well...

"And yes, I am v bright (1st class degree)."

:o

PMSL

Should we call you Dancergirl BA?

:o :o

BSc actually!

Don't think you can compare hoovering to childcare somehow....

I am in the same position.

I was going to go back to work next month but have decided not to, I'd like to stay at home with my DS. OH runs his own company so money is not an issue.

We had a long conversation about it and he was 100% supportive of me either going back or not.

I was looking forward to getting back into a work routine - getting dressed before 11am, grabbing a coffee before work and being able to scoot around town without a pushchair!
But I'd miss him terribly and see no problem with taking a year or 2 off work if you are able. Don't stress yourself out about it

I have friends who work such long hours in order to provide for their DC.
I feel grateful that I am in the position that I have a choice.

"I am questioning the reason to have a child at all if the woman finds it difficult to cope at home looking after that child."

This applies to 95% of the men and fathers I've known in my life. Including most of my own family.

For some reason women are bad parents if they work fulltime, yet the same vocal objections are not raised if the male half of the parent pool goes out and does the same.

utter shite, and the moment you start to think on it or question people's beliefs (as i've done many a time in my own family) you find they're reduced to such banalities as "well studies have proven women are more suited to looking after them" or "women have a greater bond with their children" - certainly not true in all cases. i've been around this discussion cycle again and again and again, and it's always when i have it with women that i get depressed. men, i can understand that they have something to gain.. but women? is it the whole "sour grapes" thing again?

Asking what the point of a child is does rather reduce it to the status of a hoover.

Wasn't me who asked the point of a child!

There's a BIG difference though, IMissSleep between yours and the OP's situation, which is that the OP's partner isn't supportive of her.

Look, women have come a long way in the workplace. But, will they ever be equal to men? I don't think so and I think you're deluding yourselves if you think that's the case. How many women are there in top jobs or sit on a board? Not many. I imagine at least part of the reason is because it's difficult to climb the career ladder working part-time. I know many women who have good jobs and work part-time but their careers don't progress as fast as they would if they worked full-time.

You sound like me 5 years ago

I am a teacher and that is a massive part of me, like it sounds like your job is to you.

I had dd 5.5 years a go and I had a choice (ish) about whether to go back to work when she was 11 months. The best thing I ever did was to go back part time and I put her in nursery.

I would have been totally miserable being a SAHM. My dh has similar opinions to yours (I have since begun to educate him - slow but steady progress)

Make sure that whatever you do, yu have something in your life that makes you, you. Not just someone's mum or someone's wife.

Go back part time and see how it goes - there's no law that says you have to stay if it is all too much or making you unhappy.

Or, find soemthing else worthwhile to do, whether that be volunteering or doing some very aprt time advisory work or something.

don't sit at home and let you mind turn to mush and your relationship turn sour and resentful.

You need to tell your husband how you are feeling and ensure he doesnt just brush it under the carpet. Acknowledge that whilst you thought you liked the option of being a SAHM that is now not what you want - you are allowed to change your mind. He needs to relaise this is a joint decision and that care of your dd is also a joint responsibility.

Sorry haven't read the whole thread but I don't understand why your only choice is to be a SAHM or to go back to your old job.

If earning a high wage is not necessary, why not find a job (part time or at least reasonable hours) that you will enjoy without all the stress (and long hours) of your previous career? That is if you really don't want to be a SAHM.

Getting stroppy with your DH is BU, I think!

"Getting stroppy with your DH is BU, I think!"

Yes, how dare she get stroppy with a man who doesn't think her preferences matter and who stonewalls her when she doesn't do as he pleases.

The very cheek of her.

Spidookly (on all your posts!)

Dancegirl, degrees (including first class ones) are lovely but not that great if a person still doesn't possess empathy. What I have really liked about this thread, is the fact that there has been a generally consistent view from both WOHM and SAHM re the OP's situation. i.e. that her h shouldn't be imposing his views on her.

I find your post about women in the workplace quite depressing. I am in what is regarded as a "top job" in my industry. My parents (particularly my dad) were always complete advocates of me reaching my full potential and not assuming that I couldn't get there because I am a woman.

Dancergirl, there is a difference between acknowledging the difficulties certain groups face in the workplace (e.g. women with children who are part time) and the barriers in place preventing industry from benefitting from their true potential. But that's an entirely different thing to shrugging our shoulders and saying "well what's the point anyway? we're doomed to remain at the lower rungs of the ladder".

And, as always, there is a difference between equality of opportunity vs. equality of outcome.

That's fantastic novice...but don't you agree you are in the minority? I don't know many women who have top jobs.

It's fantastic for you if you can do that, but I also think you have to be realistic. It's women who get pregnant, give birth, breastfeed and do much of the nurturing when children are small. I just can't see that changing any time soon.

Dancergirl, perhaps this is an argument to structure the workplace around the changing requirements of modern society, rather than working as per males found pleasing to work in the past?

One of the primary gripes of women in top jobs is that they can only get there is they have a wife to help them. Be it a SAHD, or just a hired nanny, or an assistant to collect that parcel between 9am and 5pm, or arrange a dentist appointment when you have to wait on hold for 15 minutes to do so. Those are all the things that housewives traditionally did, yet the workplace hasn't changed its structure to reflect the change in family dynamics that most families operate under now. Hence the image of the bedraggled working mum, who still feels the need to fit in > 50% of the parental effort despite, often, doing 50% of the working hours out side the home.

OP I wonder how you're getting on - come back and give us an update!

Just to share some of my thoghts - I have a very very similar situation to yours (DH great job, long hours, me good job, carreer motivated, didn't have to go back to work). My DS is older now, he's 2.6 and I've been back to work full time since he was 1. Sometimes I miss him a lot at wrok, but overall it's OK. Would definitely go to part time if I had another DC. Aaaanyway...

DP and I had our own little "tensions" and grumpy moments when DS was little. Having DS was a MASSIVE change for both of us (lifestyle wise) plus I was hugely insecure and DP didn't quite understand when/why/how some of my pre-DS views have changed so dramatically (that's just him being a man :)). Hence some hurtful remarks on both sides and a few tears shed... but nothing too serious.

I don't think we can judge your DP based on what you have posted, so I really don't agree with posters calling him all sorts of names and making assumptions about him.

You have some sound advice here - I totally agree with mycatoscar and MooMooFarm - hope it turns out for the best for you, you sound like an intelligent, brave and determined woman.

"Look, women have come a long way in the workplace. But, will they ever be equal to men? I don't think so and I think you're deluding yourselves if you think that's the case."

No and you know why? Because there is still an attitude going round that women should be the ones to give everything up and not men. Men can go on to live the lives they always have whilst women are expected to give it all up or go part time and have to worry about picking up their dc from nursery/school. Men can just sail on through, not give up anything and not worry about leaving work on time to go and get the dc.

This attitude sticks and is why women aren't considered equal.

May have x-posted but this struck me:

"DH is against a nanny because according to him that would just be "outsourcing" bringing up our children (his words, not mind, don't kick off). I know that having a choice is amazing. . ."

If your DH won't countenance anyone but YOU looking after your DD, then where exactly is this amazing choice of yours? I am looking for it but can't see it.

Oh I wish you'd stop picking on these words. My DP would say something like that because he uses that a lot at work, and he's technically right, it would be "outsourcing"! BUT then OP says she has a choice - so to me, that was her DH's view, which he is not imposing on her!

It's the "bringing up" that so many of us object to, Trying. Nannies, childminders and nurseries do not bring up children, even if they're with them 5 days a week.

Subtle difference for a man - they don't think like that - at least I know mine doesn't....

Dancegirl, yes I know that I am in the minority, but it doesn't have to stay that way. As long as women continue hold the views that you hold, I will remain in the minority. No point blaming the men for holding us back if we can do that all by ourselves.

I think I am where I am for three reasons. 1. My parents. As I said my dad would never have let me think as frgr put it "well what's the point anyway? we're doomed to remain at the lower rungs of the ladder". 2. Determination and 3. My husband. He is 100% supportive of me and unlike the OPs husband, his starting point isn't that the childcare is down to me as a starting point. In addition, to be crude and put it monetary terms, we are in the fortunate position that dh earns well and so he could turn around and insist that I take a break from my career because we could live on his salary alone and that I should be "grateful" to him. He doesn't because this is 2011 not 1911 and also, I am actually the higher earner, so I could easily turn round and ask him to do the same. Why not? He 50% contributed to the making of the dc, which is the point that a number of people have made to the OP.

I think that certain women conflate fairness between the sexes to fairness to children. They are two separate discussions.

I really cannot see how a young child being 10 hours in a nursery situation can be as good as the one on one childcare and love available in a home. I can see how a good nanny might be BUT no nanny today is Mary Poppins. They have their own partners, they get pregnant and they leave. And then the children have to deal with what is almost a parent suddenly disappearing from their lives.

I can totally see why not all high flying women do not want to guve up their identity for being full time childcarers. It suits some and it does not suit others. On the other hand, leaping from there to deciding that subcontracting childcare is a great solution is not logical. Maybe men and women need to share childcare more but IMO subcontracting childcare if you have a choice is not a victim free solution.

sleeplesssister I know how you feel. I have 2 DSs - one 3 and the other 16 months old. I took redundancy last year on ML with DS2 as the long commute (about 1.25 hours each way) wasn't working for us. DS1 also went to nursery FT for 4 days and I felt it was too much for a young baby/toddler. I know I am very lucky we had the choice, my DH was doing well in his career and we could afford me not to work. However, I became the problem. I resented being at home all day long and I actually started to get a bit depressed. I know it was different from just feeling down as I could see myself the way my DH saw me and I hated the person I saw - I was moany, miserable and just not happy (very teary at every little thing!). The boys were hard work too, having the close age gap and being at that hard baby/toddler stage.

I was very lucky as a part-time job came up in the area I worked/trained in - two days in the office and one day at home. So now I work two days in the city and the day I work from home, I drive my boys to my in-laws where they spend the day with their lovely grandma. It's bloody tiring (went to bed last night at 9.30pm) but I am so much happier! And DH can see that too, he really encouraged me to go back to work as he could see being a SAHM wasn't making me happy. Do consider that option as not everyone is cut out to stay at home and be a full-time DAHM. Take care of yourself!

Finally managed to make it back online. This is going to be a bit jumbled, a bit like the state of my head at the moment, but here goes...

Have had some great advice, too many posts to mention, but it's been fantastic to hear from so many women who are or have been in a similar position. I know that DH has been an arse about this, and I do absolutely need to work on him and make sure we get all of this out in the open, otherwise I fear I will end up resenting him down the road, which is no good for my marriage or my DD. Yes, his attitude sucks, and yes, I have spoken to him about it, or rather we've argued a lot, and I'm tired of the fighting now, so am just focusing on what is right for our DD. I take the point that we should have talked about this more before DD arrived, but as it took me 2 years to get pg, work was the last thing on my mind. And I agree with some of the posters who said that until you are in that boat, you don't know how you are going to feel. I intend to ask to go back 3 days a week. If they say no at my current job, which is highly likely, then I will be resigning. But I'm going to give it a good fight and see what happens. You have to go with your gut instinct I guess and while I'm not judging anyone's choices, I think that deep down, as much as I love my job, I don't think its right for us as a family that DD gets put in a nursery/with a nanny, 4 days a week, from the age of 11 months. And they would be long days, I would be leaving her at 7:30am and then putting her to bed. My beef, I guess, is that like so many women, I would like to have it all. I want to be the one that gets to take my DD to swimming classes, but also want to be able to use my brain and the qualifications I spent 8 years getting. Nothing new I know, but trying to get a balance whilst also swimming against the tide like this in your marriage makes it just that little bit more difficult. Someone once said to me that you can have it all, but just not all at the same time, and that did strike a chord with me. As much as I like being with my DD, this thread has made me realise how much I also really need something else. I think I've always known it deep down, but really wanted to throw myself into the mummy thing in the hope that it would go away. I know that having made a decision to have children, I need to now realise that I can't be selfish about this, and that means putting the needs of my DD first, but equally a mum who has lost her spark is not what she needs, and if I give up work entirely I fear I will lose my spark. So I live in hope of the holy grail, part-time work that will keep my brain going, but also allow me to be with my DD.