To be told to attend Cubs to observe son's behavior?

[carocaro]

Have been sent a letter by Cub leader who wants me to attend two sessions to discipline my son and watch due to behavior issues.

This is the first time in 7 months I have heard of any behavior issues. The letter is non specific and does not say what the issues are.

I have asked DS and he said he was told off last week for giggling during the flag ceremony.

I can't go as DH away and DS2 is 3 and will be in bed; a friend brings DS1 home from Cubs. I have emailed back (don't have his number) told them this and asked them to be more specific so I can talk to DS1.

Is this heavy handed? There are four our of 30 this has been sent to. Why can't they just pick up the phone or arrange to talk to me?

Vagueness drives me mad. There are no issues at school or elsewhere with behavior, so am mystified and want to get to the bottom of it.

sgb. It is a fair point though, if you don't want to do this stuff voluntarily, don't do it!

I don't see any evidence of the OP refusing to discipline her son. She has (not unreasonably) pointed out she would like to know what the problem was rather than a very vague letter - who would discipline their child for bad behaviour without knowing what that behaviour was? And she has also said that for various reasons it would be difficult for her to attend a session, and wasn't sure why that was required.

The OP is refusing to do what is asked of her, ie. to attend the session. Prehaps the cub leader wants to have a chat with her then.

If the OP cares about her son's behaviour she will find a way of getting to that meeting rather than making a pack of excuses.

I agree its unreasonable to expect her to go every week. Either her son has to improve his behavior or leave.

All the OP reasonablly needs to do, as has been said, is query what the bad behaviour is, discuss with her son why it's happening, tell him to stop and inform the leader that if his behaviour doesn't improve, the leader is at liberty to refuse to have him back.
SHe doesn't need to waste her time in a damp church hall when it's majorly inconvenient for her.
Because it's perfectly possible, for one thing, that the particular group leader is a smuggo who is crap with children and full of his/her own wonderfulness.

SGB think that was a bit harsh, most of the leaders I know DO have jobs and praised they should be for giving up their time. I know I wouldnt bloody do it :)

I am not aiming this at the Op at all.
But I do think if a child misbehaves at any out of school activity, be it cubs, football, judo- the leaders should be able to say "sorry mate, we don't want you".

"she would like to know what the problem was rather than a very vague letter - who would discipline their child for bad behaviour without knowing what that behaviour was? "

"Bad behaviour" can cover all kinds of things, of course. One of the kids in my pack was using very sexual language and gestures - bit worrying actually. I'm not sure I'd have felt happy putting all the details in a letter and luckily the mum was usually there to pick up at the end of the evening so I didn't have to.

I am a Beaver Scout Leader and have, on occasion, had the issue arise where we needed to speak to a parent about certain behavior issues.

I do agree that the E-Mail issue is a bit strange. In my experience if we could not have a chat with a parent at the end of an evening, we would try to speak at the drop off.

If this was unfeasible we would then contact the child's parents via telephone at a convenient time.

It's true that voluntary workers do put in a lot of work for their organisations but they know this before starting or they stop shortly after discovering how time consuming it is. So I don't think making a bit more effort than an E-Mail to resolve an issue is being unreasonable.

::Applauds Ecolady::

I am an officious self-important whanger, aka a Brownie leader.

I doubt that the Cub leader has asked the OP in lightly - I suspect that she's reached the end of her tether as far as the boys' behaviour is concerned. As someone else has said, I'd rather speak to parents face to face because it's so much easier and quicker to get to the bottom of things and agree how to tackle them.

I've never met a guider or scouter with a martyr complex. They're doing it because guiding and scouting offers children worthwhile opportunities to do things that aren't generally available at school or other out of school activities. They are also cheap - we can provide a term at Brownies for less than what it will cost for two nights in the after-school club.

I'm not going to get a job in child care because, err, actually, I already have a job. I also have a family (who have gradually been roped in to helping at Brownies because otherwise the pack would close) so I do try to preserve some part of my life that isn't devoted to Brownies by asking parents not to ring me over non-emergencies.

So shoot me.

Well no reply to any of the emails I sent, will have to wait till Thursday's session.

I saw both leaders last week for over half an hour and as I said before they never mentioned a thing; in fact praised him and his group for working so well together! The to get his heavy handed serious letter with no detail about what has actually happened.

As for the Cub promise 'to do your duty' etc does this not apply to the leaders also? They are not God to summon people as and when they choose with no explanation and little concern for personal circumstances.

The people on here are insane if they think it's ok to haul a sleeping 3yo from a car to a cold church hall who then may or may not wake up and be foul/crying due to tiredness leaving the opportunity to speak rendered.

'If leaders gave out number the phone would never stop ringing' - that I find hard to beleive. So they can dole out stuff but are not prepared to talk with a parent?

Giggling/not listening etc are very annoying and I understand the annoyance involved to the leader, but he has now attacked anyone with scissors, hurt another child or leader or used rude or agressive beahvior. And there have been no incidences before this. If I knew what beef the leaders had I could talk to Ds about it, he was not lying to me when we talked, he could not genuinely understand what the problem was besides what I had already discussed with him.

I also volunteer for the MS Society but never once have I whinged or acted like a martar ('I was doing things till 1am') well boo hoo for you, don't do it then. Just because you volunteer does not automatically give you the right to be all high and mighty and expect others to bow down to you supposed greatness.

LaVie - if it/was ever that bad, the leader is at fault for not speaking to the parents sooner and letting it get that bad. If parents don't know how can they help do anything about it? Parents are not telepathic!

Me or DH have been there many times if they really wanted to speak to us about it.

@carocaro... I really think you're building up a molehill into a mountain. Cub leaders are not 'God', no. They want to talk to you, that's all. You've replied by e-mail, talked to your son, the ball is in their court and if you don't want to go to the meeting or can't go for whatever reason, it's not the end of the world. But do accept that children in an out-of-school activity can occasionally take things too far - even if they're normally very well-behaved.

You'll be sure to tell us all what the problem was when it finally emerges, won't you?

Chill1234 - I will, I am bloody desperate to know myself!! Then I can deal with it at my end too.

It pisses me right off because when he was Beaver he was bitten by another kid who was violent in the sessions and he was allowed to stay and given treats galore to try and improve his behavior. Different leaders.

Need a cup of tea now, been copiling data from MS questionaiires into a report all morning as a volunteer, get the violins out people!!!

Just because you volunteer does not automatically give you the right to be all high and mighty and expect others to bow down to you supposed greatness.

Indeed it doesn't. But it does entitle you to expect a little courtesy and cooperation from the parents of the Cubs or whoever else is benefiting from your volunteering. I don't see how sending a note which says (in effect) "we need to talk face to face" is high and mighty - rather the opposite, I would have thought.

Of course the leaders take the promise too but they are not under a duty to make themselves available on the phone around the clock. Some choose to, some don't. I'm guessing that Cubs ends at about 7.30pm. Are you really telling us that your 3 year old has never, ever not been in bed asleep at 7.30? Or that the sky would fall in if they weren't? Likewise, if the Cub leader had sent a two page letter detailing your son's misdemeanours, wouldn't you then have started a thread bewailing "my son's cub leader sent me a long letter complaining about his behaviour. How dare she present me with this out of the blue - why didn't she talk to me about it first?" Oh, and it seems to me that someone saying they were up at 1am doing Brownie/Cub admin isn't martyrdom. It's just telling it like it is.

As you despise Cub leaders so much, why not enrol your son in the Woodcraft Folk where (I understand) parents are expected to get heavily involved?

@LaVieEnTechnicolor don't get out of your pram about it!!!

The OP has NEVER said she despises anyone. Please do enlighten us on where you got that from .

As for her 3yo, as with all parenting issues, it is her preference and if she doesn't want to disrupt her 3yo for what is, let's face it, not an emergency, then she should not feel compelled to do so by anyone. Especially not anyone on here.

Now climb back into your pram and take a nap, it sounds like you need one

Now I wonder why it's so hard to find volunteers to run these activities for kids? Hmmmm - let me think........

I assure you, Libra dear, I am very comfortably ensconced in my pram. This being AIBU, everyone is speaking their mind and rightly so.

But it's pretty clear reading the thread that the OP has a very low opinion of Cub leaders in general and her son's leaders in particular, so I really do wonder why she wants to entrust her son to their care every week.

@seeker...because there aren't enough martyrs in the world? - don't flame me, it's a joke

La Vie if you read the OP you would see that it finishes at 8.30pm.I do think the mystery letter is a bit passive aggressive actually,after all cubs are 7-10 year olds not teenagers .

Teh OP has clearly said that she wants to deal with the behaviour but its the manner of comunication which is the problem

Actually La Vie I don't think the OP has shown that at all,some posters have but not the OP,in fact she clearly says she is a parent helper at the same pack and can't understand why the leader didn't mention it to her in person as she is often at the meetings,just not on a regular drop off /pick up basis

Ooops, sorry. In reading the whole thread I missed that bit of info.

@LaVie I still do not see where you got that impression from at all. I can only assume you have not read all of her posts.

She's on the rosta and helps out there too. Her son started in Beavers and she's been involved from the start and he's done really well....where do you get that she has a low opinion or "despises" anyone....you're being a strong there imo - humble as that may be [flutters eyelashes]

And to top it all off the OP is a volunteer herself for MS, so is only too aware of the time sacrifices made by volunteers. I hardly think someone like that would not have a healthy respect for anyone who does volunteer work/activities.

Now I'm going for my nap, I'm 23 weeks pregnant and I've been up since 6:30am with DS (13yo) and I'm pooped...but I'll be back

Carocaro, I would try and go early & have a quiet word before cubs. Have younger dc in pjs, with blankie & teddy, they won't expect/want you to stay but appreciate you popping in/support. I'm guessing that whatever's happened, given lack of any concerns prior to this & your involvement with cubs, that ds is on the periphery & it's other children who are more of a concern but there's been a blanket approach. They really should have responded to your email.

Once more. I have read all the thread - including the bit where it is implied that the Cub leaders think they are God - and that was the impression I was left with. You don't agree with me. Fine. I've said my bit and am done. I won't be back.