To be told to attend Cubs to observe son's behavior?

[carocaro]

Have been sent a letter by Cub leader who wants me to attend two sessions to discipline my son and watch due to behavior issues.

This is the first time in 7 months I have heard of any behavior issues. The letter is non specific and does not say what the issues are.

I have asked DS and he said he was told off last week for giggling during the flag ceremony.

I can't go as DH away and DS2 is 3 and will be in bed; a friend brings DS1 home from Cubs. I have emailed back (don't have his number) told them this and asked them to be more specific so I can talk to DS1.

Is this heavy handed? There are four our of 30 this has been sent to. Why can't they just pick up the phone or arrange to talk to me?

Vagueness drives me mad. There are no issues at school or elsewhere with behavior, so am mystified and want to get to the bottom of it.

[LibraPoppyGirl]

Excuse me RMCW if I just interrupt you for a moment.

If you would like to read back through all of my posts, never did I once, say anything derogatory or low about volunteers in any capacity.

The OP herself is a volunteer, in case you forgot!

As for myself do not presume that I have no respect for volunteers. I myself ran a church girls group in Australia called GFS which was for yr1 through to yr6, so I know exactly how hard it can be but I also know how ott some leaders can be.

This was as an earlier poster said about 'communication' not about how good/bad the leaders are.

My attitude was perfectly reasonable imo, with regard to the communication issues. I raised no other issue at all.

I stuck to the topic of the original OP, it was posters such as yourself who expanded, unjustifiably, on what the OP was talking about.

[mathanxiety]

Not a teacher, but I do volunteer with children. The current group is now about age 12/13, but I started with them when they were about 6.

I don't think anyone should expect to do this without being capable of handling the children. Nobody has a good time and nobody learns anything much if a group is badly run, plus there's the issue of safety. People here have mentioned biting and scissors incidents at after school activities (maybe cubs or scouting?); really, if you are not capable of laying down the law, and at minimum keeping the children from hurting themselves and each other, you should either try to acquire the necessary skills and strategies to do it better or retire.

RMCW -- One way to keep them from mischief is to organise them into teams and have them do all the necessary jobs like washing up/ tidying up/ serving snack/ setting out materials themselves.

[StuffingGoldBrass]

I think the point is that some volunteer workers are bound to be whangers and/or totally incapable of doing the job properly. For every well-meaning helpful soul who wants to do good in the community, you're going to get some petty officious little clipboard wielder who'se got nothing much going on in the rest of his/her life therefore seeks status by volunteering and feeling inclined to claim some sort of authority over others. It's people like this who can;t cope with not being taken seriously (when FFS cubs etc is just something that's a bit of fun for kids to do in the evenings, it's hardly life-changing).

[Goblinchild]

'One way to keep them from mischief is to organise them into teams and have them do all the necessary jobs like washing up/ tidying up/ serving snack/ setting out materials themselves.'


Thank god you have never been in charge of the Beavers, cubs and scouts groups that my son has attended. That's the answer is it?
It took a lot of thought on the part of the volunteers to help my son develop the social skills he needed, and to develop an inclusive attitude amongst the rest of the troop.

RMCW: 'We also have a new child with SN. Last week was a NIGHTMARE and both the leader and I have been racking our brains all week on ways to help him and accomodate his needs. '

Thank you.

[Marlinspike]

I'm going to sound like a pompous arse to some people here, but scouting CAN be lifechanging - some examples for you:

Some scouts from my area spent 3 weeks in Kenya last year, helping to decorate a local school.

Others are fundraising to go to the world jamboree in Sweden later this year. They will spend a week with a Swedish family then a week at the jamboree where they will be camping with young people from other countries. Oh, and as the UK is a wealthier country, part of their fundraising will pay for young people from less affluent countries to attend.

Both pretty life changing experiences, and both organised through scouting.

[RMCW]

maths Beavers are aged 6-8 and we are prevented - legally - from doing cetain things with them by the HSE. As they get older they can do more/be given more responsibiltiy. Also, they come to have fun and have new experiences, not wash up and clean

libra You supported the OP who, in various posts, has used offensive and demeaning language to describe the leader of her sons cubs pack. I found her attitude a HUGE over reaction and. As I said, the letter was a request for her to attend, not an order and they certainly werent "playing God"!

As I also said, if you think that is ok, then we will agree to disagree.

The OPs attitude stinks.

That is my opinion.

You are entitled to yours.

goblin We have had a few ideas....we are going to make a safe "chill out zone" in one corner where he can go when it gets too much for him. We are also looking into putting our cap in hand and begging for some extra funds so we can fit a child proof door handle so he cant get out of the building on his own. He really seemed to enjoy it last night whereas last week he didnt seem to get anything from the session at all....I didnt sleep for 2 nights trying to figure out how we can help him....as has been pointed out, we are not experts, just volunteers. I hope we can give him a good experience when he is with us.

[RMCW]

marlin Our young leader went Kenya last summer too!!! Amazing opportunity. They helped build and paint a new school.

I only wish I had had the chance to do it when I was young!

[MrsBadenPowell]

Anyone who'd like to celebrate the positive and life-changing opportunities which Scouts and Guides can offer might want to visit this thread.

[mathanxiety]

@ Goblinchild -- it works for me and the group I work with. I do not have any SN children in my group right now.

@ RMCW -- wrt 'they come to have fun and have new experiences, not wash up and clean .'

The washing/cleaning/tidying part is essential in creating and nurturing a sense of responsibility and group cohesion, a sense of personal competence and a sense that the smooth operation of the meeting depends on how much each individual there is prepared to put into it, all of which are desirable scouting or guide-type ideals as well as being a sound way to try to get them to behave reasonably well.

There is also the psychological aspect -- when children see you doing the skivvy work they assume you are the skivvy. It's not a way to gain their respect or make them 'invest' in the meetings.

Giving the children responsibility for some of the work involved in the meeting also prevents the volunteer from being run ragged doing skivvy work while the children misbehave, stab each other with scissors, etc.

It has nothing to do with whether washing up and tidying is fun or not. Are you there to entertain the children or inculcate values in them and teach them something, bearing in mind that an orderly meeting is going to be more productive than a disorderly one, no matter what you teach or what activity you organise? Teaching them to tidy up after themselves is a skill they should use far more frequently throughout their lives than lighting fires, etc.

[LibraPoppyGirl]

No RMCW what you posted was :-

Attitudes like those of the OP and libra are sadly why people just arent willing to take on the (pretty huge) task of being responsible for other peoples children for any amount of time.

I supported the OP in her wanting to be communicated with better.

I NEVER gave any attitude toward any leaders/volunteers of any organisation nor did I use any offensive nor demeaning language.

Kindly do not portray me as someone who did just because I agreed with the OP in relation to the communication or lack of.

As for my attitude contributing to why people just arent willing to take on the (pretty huge) task etc I am one of those people who has taken on that task quite successfully imo, in the past!!

[getting a bit fed up now emoticon]

[RMCW]

Ah, I guess thats the problem...if you support someone with those views, people make the (pretty obvious) assumption you hold them too.

I apologise if I misinterpreted your support for the OP.

[RMCW]

maths I agree with you, but as I said, due to the age of our group we are prohibited from doing certain tings with them...for example, we have to et the akela from cubs to come and do campfire cooking (whcih we are doing next week) as we are not "allowed".

I agree that as they get older they need these skills, but at beavers, they are simply too young/not capable of some of the tasks you mention.

We have a couple of children with SN in our group too....just not realistic to expect them to be able to do what their peers can do wrt self motivation/tasks/keeping themselves safe.

(Although we do expect them to have made their own packed lunch and packed their own bag for the trip on sunday)

[RMCW]

Sorry for all the typos...up all night with sick child

[LibraPoppyGirl]

I appreciate your apology RMCW. However, in future it might be an idea to actually read what posters say and not assume anything.

The mother of fcuk ups is assumption!

[Waltons]

Sorry RMCW, but this is just not true - there is no rule that says Beaver leaders can't do campfire cooking!

And nor is this true:


Myth. They can do the same activities as Cubs and Scouts as long as it is age-appropriate (for example, they can only camp without a parent for 1 night & rifle shooting is not recommended, for example) and you risk assess it.

You are being fed a lot of tosh by someone, somewhere, so maybe ask them to show you where all this is written down ...

Hope the little one gets well soon.

[RMCW]

hmm..will have a word with the leader then....she gets quite agitated about doing some activities....

[Waltons]

If she's worried about running things like fires, fine - draft in other people (and go get some training), but making up local rules about "elf & safety" to cover up your own weaknesses just deprives the kids of fun.

You might find this useful: //www.escouts.org.uk

[RMCW]

thanks

[shaza3]

Actually not impressed with this. My husband is high up in a local college, and we have a serverly mentally disabled son, so I think we have quite a lot on our plate as it is, but we do this for our daughter and because without the helpers and leaders there would be no cubs or scouts etc.