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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

to think that play 'fighting' is normal behaviour for young boys?

163 replies

LetBoysBeBoys · 04/02/2011 21:05

Had to have a meeting with the school this week regarding DS2 (yr3) being involved in 'rough play' which basically involved a group of boys being in a rugby like scrum with general pushing and wrestling. The school policy is now that any type of 'rough play' will not be tolerated.

Now I will not tolerate bullying at all and if either of my DSs were involved in anything like that, they would be in big trouble, but this is nothing like that at all. The teacher also is very clear that this is not that at all and all involved are willing participants .

DS1 has been disciplined in the past for breaking a branch off one of the many trees surrounding the playing field while swinging from it. His teacher rang me at home to notify me of it and kept the branch to show me at pick up time. He was also taken round all his year group class rooms with the offending branch so all the other DCs could see his crime first hand . I do not condone hurting trees of course but I think this was way OTT.

Also at hometime, DS2 was wrestling (not hurting each other, just laughing) with his friend on the school field while I and the friends mum were chatting. We were watching them when a teacher rushed up to them shouting 'How dare you play like that on school property - leave the premises at once'. I mean really shouting in full knowledge that we, the parents, were standing there and looking at us with daggers in front of all the other parents. It is pretty normal that the DCs have a run about in the playground/field for 10 mins after school so there were loads of other DCs/parents there.

Now is'nt this relatively typical behaviour of boys or are my DSs and the majority of their friends abonormal little thugs? I understand that schools need to keep control of the kids so that no one gets hurt but they are not all little robots. What the hell are they supposed to play - hopskotch?

AIBU to not take this particularly seriously?

OP posts:

Ragwort · 04/02/2011 21:28

This is quite difficult - my DS is very much like your's OP - he loves rugby (watching Six Nations at the moment) and he is very physcial, he does proper rugby club as well as loads of other sports but I can sense that some other parents don't like him playing with their children becuase he is so physical - I have begged, pleaded etc etc with him to 'tone it down' when he is not on the rugby pitch as I believe it is not appropropiate to be so physcial all the time. He tends to mix with other boys who are equally physical and DH (also a rugby fan ) just says 'that's what boys are like'. I think the tree incident is somewhat OTT - I would rather my son be playing sports and climbing trees than doing indoor stuff but I know that not everyone agrees.

Sorry, not much help but much sympathy .

Original poster

LetBoysBeBoys · 04/02/2011 21:31

DS does do sports and gets plenty of exercise outside of school thanks. Obviously when at school, he is with his friends so much more temptation to 'play' with them at playtime.

OP posts:

tougholdbird · 04/02/2011 21:33

my concern is that if schools continue to try and eliminate all risk for the child, then opportunities for real life lessons about social interaction and dealing with stuff will be missed.

scurryfunge · 04/02/2011 21:35

Glad to hear that he is getting plenty of exercise elsewhere -perhaps it is time to talk to him about what is appropriate and what is not, LBBB. I am all for rough and tumble but believe there are suitable arenas for this.

School is not necessarily one of those places.

cantspel · 04/02/2011 21:36

social interaction doen't involve wrestling each other

how many grown men do you know who have a quick rugby tackle with their work mates at lunch time?

Original poster

LetBoysBeBoys · 04/02/2011 21:36

While they are legally required to be at school and I unable to supervise them at playtime, I did suggest to DSs teacher that if are they so concerned about this that perhaps the playground supervisors should 'supervise' some more gentle games with the chidren rather than standing around chatting and drinking coffee. Did not go down well!

OP posts:

Original poster

LetBoysBeBoys · 04/02/2011 21:37

cantspel - young boys are not grown men and I would not expect to act as such .

OP posts:

tougholdbird · 04/02/2011 21:37

oh fgs, cantspel that's how children learn. Adults don't behave like kids because they have grown up. Or do you still stick your tongue out when someone upsets you?

scurryfunge · 04/02/2011 21:38

I am not surprised that didn't go down well

Panzee · 04/02/2011 21:39

Do they definitely do that? I would be very upset if you said that about our school as that does not happen at all.

Sassybeast · 04/02/2011 21:40

It may be 'normal' for some boys AND girls, but it's not normal for ALL children and I think that if the school have raised it as an issue, then you really need to work WITH them on it. Although I suspect that you are firmly of the opinion that YANBU

cantspel · 04/02/2011 21:42

No boys learn by being given clear boundaries about their behaviour. They learn when and where rough play is acceptable via these boundaries. The school playground is not the place for it where the rugby field, park their own back gardens is.

Ragwort · 04/02/2011 21:42

I am not condoning rough play but I can understand LetBoysBeBoy's point of view - if you have a DS who is not physical it is hard to imagine what it is like - just as I cannot imagine what it must be like to have a DS who enjoys playing with lego .... I am sure my DS is equally 'lively' at playtimes, he wants to run around, kick a ball, rugby tackle - even a game of 'it' (do kids still play that ) can turn physical in some people's eyes.

tougholdbird · 04/02/2011 21:43

LBBB, YA totally NBU to not like or agree with this, but unfortunately I agree with majority you will have to get your DS to obey the rules.

slightlymad72 · 04/02/2011 21:45

I am a mother you has a son that has been on the recieving end of 'Rough play' it occured all the way through his time at primary school. He has had skin ripped off his face, bruises up his arms and legs, his glasses damaged, coats ripped, jumpers damaged, pinned up against walls, flying kicks at his body. I could go on but I think you get the picture.

When I complained to the school, it was always passed off as ROUGH PLAY that got out of hand, NO IT WASN'T it was bullying, it ended finally when 1 teacher saw it for what it was.

The lovely child that inflicted most of this suffering eventually mangaged to hospitalise a child, he smashed his head against the floor whilst his mates pinned him down, the bully got to remain at the school because term was nearly up. The victim thankfully didn't suffer any longterm damage to his head.

IMO there should be zero tolerance to rough play in the school yard. It is not a necessary part of interacting with each other and has the potential to cause serious harm

tougholdbird · 04/02/2011 21:46

cantspel and what happens to those boys who for whatever reason, don't get the same opportunities outside school to learn these boundaries? Or is school just for academic lessons in your view?

geraldinetheluckygoat · 04/02/2011 21:46

the school my ds1 used to go to seemed to have a problem with play fighting getting too rough. He used to get involved and in trouble for it. There at play time, a few balls/hulahoops were provided in the playground. The lessons at this school were very worksheety, the work was often well beyond my ds's ability, bad behaviour was picked up quickly good behaviour didn't seem to be overly rewarded or commented on.

He started a new school after christmas. As far as I can tell (so far) there is no problem with playfighting. there are organised games in the playground such as hockey or football. The class works towards collecting golden minutes for good behaviour. This week my son's house was rewarded for getting the most housepoints last term, with a bouncy castle for all the kids in that house. The lessons are active, there is less copying, less sitting down, more dancing, acting, playing and learning by doing. Have not had a worksheet sent home yet.

My son used to be cross and depressed coming out of the old school. He would never want to talk about what he had done. he is practically boucing all the way home and can't wait to tell me what they have done in class.

I do think some kids need more activity, less sitting, more engagement. I really think that the new school has less of a problem with playfighting becuase the lessons are active and engaging, the kids are doing work that they enjoy and is achievable. The kids aren't bored. they work of their energy doing great stuff all day, they dont need to get bored and fighty.

Rant over.

scurryfunge · 04/02/2011 21:47

My ds was always very physical and was up for wrestling at every opportunity - school just wasn't the place for it. I channelled energy into more appropriate activities so that he was not forcing people to comply with his idea of "play". Nothing wrong in running around and kicking a ball if that is what was organised safely.

geraldinetheluckygoat · 04/02/2011 21:48

*Work off, not of.

gapbear · 04/02/2011 21:51

My school is on the verge of banning rough play. There are daily incidents of children getting hurt, either directly from play, or often the younger ones get hurt if they are in the way.

Too much lesson time gets used up sorting out 'he did, she did'.

There's no need for it - energetic children can burn their energy off in different ways - running about, football, tag etc.

I don't think schools should be sending out the message that fighting is acceptable - play or otherwise.

cantspel · 04/02/2011 21:54

why would they not get these opportunities?

surely if you know you have a very physical child you arrange suitable activities?

The parks are free and plentful so even if you live in a london flat you can access open space for running around and letting off steam.

Schools teach many things and one of them is how to behave and follow rules.

Pictish · 04/02/2011 21:55

My son loves tig, and a bit of football, and playing Star Wars and thinking up secret missions for their gang and all that sort of wee boy stuff.
However, he's not in love with being thrown about and jumped on. I'm not so precious as to think he can't withstand a bit of rough play - it IS normal little kid behaviour after all....but OP you are imagining that that it's enjoyed by everyone that is 'participating'.
Being bulldozed by an overenthusiastic wannabe Hulk Hogan isn't actually that pleasant if you're not into that sort of thing.
You can't tell the teacher though, because that would make you a jessie. My son fights them off asap, then bodyswerves majorly, while glowering.
That doesn't equate 'participating'.

In my experience - kids who play rough don't much care who wants to participate or not....not cos they're bad or owt, but just because they enjoy it and they are having fun.

At school, all the kids are forced together regardless of common interest. Allowing rough play isn't really fair I don't suppose.

mutznutz · 04/02/2011 21:56

I've got 3 boisterous boys. Rough play is not allowed at their schools due to too many injuries and because each 'scrum' 'scuffle' can not be individually supervised.

If your son got a serious spine injury for example and it transpired it was due to 'rough play' at school...I'm sure you'd wonder where the hell the supervision was.

Either encourage your kids to listen to their teachers and obey school policies...or find them a school whose policies you do support.

tougholdbird · 04/02/2011 21:57

cantspel I would love to think that all kids have the same opportunity for regular after school play outdoors with their mates. Trouble is, I don't believe it.

conkersdropped · 04/02/2011 22:02

I'm a lunchtime assistant at a primary school.

I have 2DS of my own. I know what boys are like.

Believe me when I say "rough play" in the play ground is a nightmare.

I spend most of my time asking them not to be rough, sorting out games/teams/equipment for them. Turn round and they are rolling around on the floor, then someone is crying, and then propper fighting starts.

Kids get hurt, parents complain. Some parent sue.

Some kids are ok with it, others aren't.

The only way to deal with it is zero tolerance.

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