To tell my nanny she can't take days of for her wedding.

[Foreverondiet]

Have had same nanny for several years and each year she does some sort of retreat thing in June, 2 weeks. She is allowed 2 weeks holiday when she chooses and the rest when we choose (usually another 4 weeks worth).

Anyway she tells me she is getting married.... I think nothing of it until cleaner says did you know it was in September this year. I ask the nanny and she said, yes she was thinking she's take some unpaid leave. Try to push how much she needs, she wants another couple of weeks. I suggested maybe she wouldn't do the retreat this year but she was almost in tears and said she couldn't believe I wouldn't give her time of for getting married (she's going back home to eastern Europe to get married).

I asked her why she thought it would be ok, as I don't have enough holiday to cover it because we have already committed to go away with DH's parents. And yes I can take unpaid parental leave but this would be very expensive, and leave my boss being a bit annoyed with me.

The reason we have a nanny is that I have 3 DC, aged 4,7 and 9 months and its the only way I can work (full day nursery/childminder for baby plus after school would cost almost the same and this way she looks after older DC if they are ill or during school holidays).

Her wedding is on a Saturday and she works for me Mon/Tues and Thurs so its not as if she HAS to take time off, and if it really was that important to her why does she not cancel the retreat?

But she gets 4 weeks, Onmyfeet; she has to take two weeks when her employer dictates and the other two weeks she uses for her annual retreat. The two weeks the OP will not be needing her don't work for her wedding and it's unreasonable imo for the OP to insist she work a once in a lifetime family event in another country like her wedding around her family's schedule when there are other perfectly fine options available.

And lol (in a rather grim way) at the poor nanny needing a two week retreat and clinging to it in the face of all sorts of pressure from the OP - she must really need all that meditation and getting away from it all...

Good to see dittany

I'm afraid this is just part of being an employer. You take the ups with the downs. If she has been a great employee for such a long time and you obviously have a great relationship, it does seem a real shame to ruin it. Believe me, it is not worth the hassle of having to find another nanny over 2 weeks holiday!

I know how you feel though but I'm afraid you need to suck this one up and let her have the time with good grace - even tell her it's because she's been so great over the years that you're happy for her to go. And don't forget the wedding present ;-)

How ever will you cope when she gets pregnant and wants maternity leave?

I have not read the entire thread but was thinking, if you usually get her 4 weeks payed but she is asking for those 2 weeks unpaid leave, Could you not then give her just 2 weeks payed leve this year and use the money saved as your own wage for the time unpaid you would have to take yourself to look after your dcs?

Appologies if this has already been suggester or if this is illegal/not compatible with contract.

My opinion is if you have kept her for several years she is obviously doing something right so it might be a nice gesture to let her go?

As a comparison, I work in a school and a colleague got married last year. The wedding was during term time and on a Saturday, because that was the best time for most of their friends and family to attend, but she wasn't allowed to book her honeymoon until the school holidays. They were even a bit grudging about allowing her the Friday before the wedding off.

We all felt it was a bit mean, but also completely expected. When your job revolves around the term-time calendar, you have to expect these sort of challenges. From a purely professional viewpoint, I think you're in the right.

I can't believe how many people think that the year you get married you should take all your usual holidays and demand extra for getting married (without discussion or basic consideration for colleagues).

I thought it was usual to use annual leave for your wedding, not use it for other things and then cry because your boss "won't give you time off for your wedding".

I've sent DH into work today to have a little cry how his employer won't let him take time off for his daughter's 1st birthday. I mean, why should he miss out on such a momentous occasion just because he chose to use his holidays for other things?

I'm sure his boss won't think badly of him for this, apparently this is how to get bosses to give you what you want.

Math, the nanny is the one choosing to take unpaid leave, so I can only presume that yes, she can afford to take it.

"She gets four weeks and must apparently take two of those weeks when her employer decides. This is highly unusual and it is highly unreasonable to make an employee arrange her life and her family's life around the schedule of the 'business' like that."

It is NOT unusual for a nanny though, it is standard practice. As Sprogger said, effectively the employer and the employee take their holiday at the same time. The 50/50 split is the fairest way I can see to ensure that both parties are able to at least have some holiday at a time which is convenient to them. The alternative is that the employer and her family fits their life around the life of the employee, which is hardly usual or fair either.

In any sort of job you have to make some sort of compromise between your needs and the needs of the employer, I hardly see this as any different. I would like to have both days at the weekend off, my employer would like me to work both days. As a compromise I only work one weekend day. Similarly, the nanny would like to choose all her holiday. The employer(as an employee in her own job) would also like to chosse all her holiday. As a compromise, they each pick half. Yes, I agree given the reason for the unpaid leave it would be in the employer's best interest to try and arrange a compromise, but if we remove the reason for the unpaid leave (a wedding) and look solely at how the nanny has behaved in booking a holiday without even checking she will be able to get leave, I do think the nanny is being UR in that respect.

OP - you're getting negative reactions because you are clearly middle-class and relatively well-off...2 things Mumsnetters cannot abide [don't like].

A shame but better they vent their spleens on here [get if off their chest] than hurling invective [slagging people off] across a busy car park.

The OP is either a, rather skillful, troll or one of the most unpleasant people I have come across on Mumsnet.

So first it was:
I think nothing of it until cleaner says did you know it was in September this year.

Then it was:
but cleaner doesn't speak any english and only works a few hours a week for me and has other jobs so can't look after the kids.

Then you got called out on the inconsistencies so now it's:
The cleaner speaks very broken english.

Pick a story and stick with it.

She probably didn't bring it up to you because she knew how horrible you'd be to her about it. Let's hope she doesn't get pregnant, she'd probably want time off to have her kids....she'd have some nerve when she has YOUR kids to deal with.

"If it's that important to her"?!

Well at first, I thought she should compromise and cancel her retreat, then I read that she ghets 4 weeks hols a year, 2 of her choosing and 2 of yours......WTF. Thank God my employer doesn't tell me when I can take my holidays.

You have until SEpt to make arrangements, I am sure between you and dh you can sort this.

It's perfectly normal in plenty if jobs not to get a choice about when you take your holidays.

Teachers don't get any discretionary holidays at all.

Maybe that's an imposition too far by their employers and we should let them take unpaid leave whenever they choose. Also would be unfair to expect them to apply for this leave.

Work, after all, exists to keep people occupied when they don't have better things to be doing.

im glad i dont work for you!!

Have not read it all so sorry if it has been said

but when she said she was getting married did you not ask when?

Or did you just grunt and say the baby needs changing......lol

Maybe she [the nanny] should be looking for another job.....

In the scheme of things, if that is your contractual arrangement with her, then no, YANBU.

Of course, you're being a complete cow, and I would also be looking for work elsewhere too, but no, you are legally, and contractually in the right.

pascoe28 Wed 26-Jan-11 07:24:21
OP - you're getting negative reactions because you are clearly middle-class and relatively well-off...2 things Mumsnetters cannot abide [don't like].

A shame but better they vent their spleens on here [get if off their chest] than hurling invective [slagging people off] across a busy car park.

I know you think you are using big words, but you really dont have to understand their meanings you know. you're not that articulate!

I cant believe people still think this is inverted snobbery, its about treating your employees with decency and respect ffs.

How do holdays work? is it 6 weeks (2 unpayed +4 payed) from January to January? If so, she probably has not taken any yet for this year so it should not be impossible to arrange, by September, something that suita all parties?

I am surprised that it seems to be such a difgficult issue (admittingly haveno experience at all in subject) but then I am also surprised that an employee would book their holiday without checking with employer first (even as a formality) that it does not "clash" with anything.

Personally, I would let her go but make sure that in the future things are discussed first as a courtesy and not just blabbed out by someone else. If cleaning lady had not said anything, OP might not have known until much much later making the problem much harder to resolve.

Yanbu. I wanted 4 weeks off for my wedding. I agreed it with my boss 18 months in advance and saved all my leave. She should have asked, and been prepared to cancel her usual holiday to use the time for her wedding.

Having said that it would be a nice gesture to allow a bit extra as a one off if you value her.

She's saying that she can't have time off for her wedding AND extra time off for her holidays too.

If you were getting married, wouldn't you use your AL rather than use that on another holiday and just expect unpaid leave?

but the OP tells the nanny *when she can have 2 weeks of her annual leave, and from what i gather, it varies according to the OP's plans. should the nanny have gone to the OP and said: "when are you taking your holiday this year? I need to know when I can get married?"

I hope the nanny's parents never do anything inconvenient like dieing on her watch.

OP- seriously, you have what, 8+ months to find someone else for a week or so. It isn't going to kill you to do that, is it?

I'm not sure why the concept of the 50/50 split on hols is so hard to comprehend, makes perfect sense.