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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to get angry when school threatens to exclude DS for smoking

206 replies

Sistah · 20/01/2011 19:10

14 year old DS smokes. We have taken him to smoking cessation classes to no avail. He has been caught smoking several times on school premises and today they are threatening to exclude him, after catching him again.
Now, seriously? My feeling is that they need some perspective. They want to exclude him for smoking, they want to take him out of a normal learning environment for smoking? I think they are being totally unreasonable but they just don't see it. I get the broken record routine: "He broke a school rule". Pfft.

OP posts:
bubblewrapped · 20/01/2011 19:40

Do you realise, if he smoked on the premises when he gets a job, he would be sacked for gross misconduct?

I agree you cant stop him smoking. But what you fail to understand here is that he should not be smoking on school property.

Let him smoke to his hearts content before he gets there, and when he walks out of the gates. But what is so difficult to grasp about him not smoking when he is actually in the school grounds????? ffs....

bibbitybobbityhat · 20/01/2011 19:41

Roffle at this

maryz · 20/01/2011 19:42

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

cory · 20/01/2011 19:43

On the one hand, you say you have no control over your ds breaking school rules, on the other hand the school are wrong to exclude him. So what should the school do- just accept that pupils don't follow the rules?

If your ds will not listen to the adults in charge, then he has to accept that it is his education that will suffer.

maryz · 20/01/2011 19:44

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

spidookly · 20/01/2011 19:45

I don't think yabu actually.

If he assaulted a teacher they'd all be saying that was fair enough and the teacher had no right to expect not to be attacked at work and all children are entitled to stay in school no matter how disruptive their presence is to other pupils.

But smoking makes him the devil, so they'd probably support the school if they wanted to flog him.

herbietea · 20/01/2011 19:46

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

MissTFied · 20/01/2011 19:48

Ha ha!

Why are you giving advice?

What an unamusing 'joke'. The OP is trying to have a larrrrrf!

toeragsnotriches · 20/01/2011 19:48

Temporary exclusion? Not permanent, surely.

If he wants a fag so badly as to carry on despite all the warnings and other stuff is the rest of his school life ok? I mean is he enjoying and feeling a true part of the school in most other ways? It's a vicious circle, I guess. He's feeling stressed so he wants a cig... I can't say this makes me feel sorry for him though!

And I make no assumptions about your parenting skills. You're working really hard on it but if he's still smoking so much and in school and at only 14 he's got to face their sanctions. They shouldn't have to justify that rule to you or any other parent.

caramelwaffle · 20/01/2011 19:48

F()£&;;;;g heck. A 14 year old can AFFORD to buy cigarettes these days?

Gizza paper round

NonnoMum · 20/01/2011 19:54

I agree with bubblewrapped. What the school is trying to do, is to create a rule that is reflected in the real world.

Most workplaces do not allow smoking. All public buildings have banned smoking. They are trying to train him up in these sort of rules, so that when he joins the world of work (perhaps in only two years), he will have an inking on what he can and cannot do.

Of course, if he turns into Simon Cowell, or Stephen Fry, he can smoke away to his heart's content, as long as it's not on camera.

cruelladepoppins · 20/01/2011 19:55

OP, you don't say what your DS thinks of the idea of excluding him for this persistent breach of the rules. Does he want to be excluded, or does he think it's unreasonable for them to exclude him for persistently smoking?

With respect, maybe your DS needs to learn some perspective and keep away from the fags whilst he is on school premises. I woudl be backing the school on this one, personally - a united front has got to be better than the mixed messages he is currently getting from you.

They think they're immortal at that age, don't they.

Original poster
Sistah · 20/01/2011 19:55

@maryz at what point have I said it's okay for him to smoke? Read up and see the measures I've taken. No I am not a troll, I'm frustrated with what I percieve as a heavy handed threat from the school and sure, at the fact my son, after 18 months of support, refuses to give up smoking.

To be clear, I think there are better ways of dealing with a kid who is smoking than excluding him from education.

Thanks to the more thoughtful posters who saw a Mum in need of a talkdown and not a trollfest.

OP posts:
GwendolineMaryLacey · 20/01/2011 19:57

Haven't read the thread, can't be bothered. Just thought you might like a lesson on Nazis as you seem to be a bit confused about what the word means. Hmm

BustleInYourHedgerow · 20/01/2011 19:57

Speaking as someone who got suspended for smoking when I was 14, I don't think it is a very effective means of punishment. But the school need to be seen as taking smoking seriously, and this is what works for them. My parents didn't give me any pocket money after finding out but I still managed to get fags. I would borrow from a friend, go without lunch, I stole money from my parents more than once, so try not to leave any money lying around the house, because he is addicted, and it is a possibility that he'll steal. Because I didn't care. At 14 you think you are invincible. And I was addicted. And I thought I was cool. I still smoke btw. I've tried to give up, many times, it still hasn't happened. I think you need to come down really hard on him. No games console, internet access, limited access to mobile, maybe half an hour a night?, no going out with friends etc. He is not going to like you for it now, but hopefully he will in the future. And make him earn those back. 5 minutes extra with his phone if he doesn't come home stinking of smoke. Check when he comes in. Smell his clothes, his fingers. No amount of chewing gum and lynx will hide the smell from a non smoker. HTH.

NonnoMum · 20/01/2011 19:58

Just out of interest, Sistah do you or your DH smoke? Not that I'm judging you but just wondering if is something he sees as "adult" behaviour.

NonnoMum · 20/01/2011 19:59

btw, some schools have a policy on short term exclusion for being caught twice either smoking or

being with smokers.

So it's not an unusual or harsh policy.

BustleInYourHedgerow · 20/01/2011 20:00

Speaking as someone who got suspended for smoking when I was 14, I don't think it is a very effective means of punishment. But the school need to be seen as taking smoking seriously, and this is what works for them. My parents didn't give me any pocket money after finding out but I still managed to get fags. I would borrow from a friend, go without lunch, I stole money from my parents more than once, so try not to leave any money lying around the house, because he is addicted, and it is a possibility that he'll steal. Because I didn't care. At 14 you think you are invincible. And I was addicted. And I thought I was cool. I still smoke btw. I've tried to give up, many times, it still hasn't happened. I think you need to come down really hard on him. No games console, internet access, limited access to mobile, maybe half an hour a night?, no going out with friends etc. He is not going to like you for it now, but hopefully he will in the future. And make him earn those back. 5 minutes extra with his phone if he doesn't come home stinking of smoke. Check when he comes in. Smell his clothes, his fingers. No amount of chewing gum and lynx will hide the smell from a non smoker. HTH.

fluffles · 20/01/2011 20:01

to be honest i'm torn about this.

smoking is against school rules and schools need to enforce rules.

HOWEVER, few young people ever recover from permanent exclusion at age 14. If that's what we're talking about then how is the LEA proposing to educate him??

I have worked with excluded students and they are often very damaged by the experience, those i worked with were excluded for MUCH more serious issues and had very chaotic homelives including abuse, neglect, mental health issues, phobias etc.

I do not think that the LEA resources (tutors for example) for these children who cannot be in school should be spent on your son who frankly could.

peanutbutterkid · 20/01/2011 20:01

What would you like the school to do, instead?

What happens if he gets excluded, the LEA still has a legal obligation to educate him, right? So where would he go next? Does anyone know?

Sorry you've come in for such a pasting, OP, MN is a bit ... boiling over today. I'm not sure that getting expelled is a real punishment for most 14yos, though, depends what alternative is, really. Sit around at home reading comic books? Not sure how that's a disincentive...

BustleInYourHedgerow · 20/01/2011 20:02

Oops.

Original poster
Sistah · 20/01/2011 20:02

nodding at BustleInYourHedgerow That's where we've been for a while.

@NonnoMum Yes we used to, we gave up. I don't know if he sees it as afult, he wants to fit in, likes the sociability of the cool dudes at school. He has a learning disability to compound the issue, and friendships are hard for him.

OP posts:
Original poster
Sistah · 20/01/2011 20:05

@peanutbutterkid Thanks ... maybe because it's a full moon LOL? I'm all for punishment, just not exclusion. Litter-picking, detention, whatever. They aren't suggesting permanent, btw.

OP posts:
NonnoMum · 20/01/2011 20:05

I'm sure any exclusion would be temporary.

Yikes. School is a nightmare at the best of times. Poor boy. Poor you.

chimchar · 20/01/2011 20:06

the problem is that he is persistantly breaking a school rule...not once or twice, persistantly....

if you allow every pupil in school to persistantly break school rules, it will be a hellish place.

he is not conforming, and this is one way school can deal with it.

he needs to not smoke whilst in school. have his last fag before he walks in the gates at 8.30am, and not smoke until home time, 6 hours later.

c'est la vie!