In thinking that Wagner wasn't all wrong about Cheryl?

[cupcakesandbunting]

When he said she is a council estate girl who got lucky?

Nothing wrong with coming from a council estate, I lived on one myself for most of my childhood. But she didn't get where she is now on talent or charisma so old Vargener hit the nail on the head with that one, oy finks.

The only xfactor result that would make any sense is for Wagner to win it.

I am getting fed up with cowell and his acolytes manipulating everything and would rather it was more about talent.

The contestant song choices are overwhelmingly crap which is frustrating as a viewer.

I agree cheryl abused her position as a judge to have a go at poor wagner on live tv.

What exactly did she say?

lol can you imagine he gets a one million recording contract? I like his accent but boy that guy cannot sing at all.

I reeeeaaaalllly want to see Simon hand Wagner that record contract. Not because I adore Wagner, but because it would be brilliant to witness. Wagner is an arrogant, talentless old git but they have given him a hard time and Chavyl was out of order last night. No way would she have had the balls to talk to Simon's act like that. If one of the kids in the boyband had apparently said what Wagner allegdly did, she'd not have mentioned it.

Didn't see it either last night but found this on line:

"Judges Comments:

Dannii Minogue: I?m not going to talk about the singing on this one. I don?t know what else to say.

Cheryl Cole: I don?t normally have anything constructive to say to you Wagner but I believe you made some comments this week about me being from a council estate, yes I?m very proud of my roots and I?m very lucky but don?t focus on anybody else and how lucky I am, just think about how lucky you are to be on that stage tonight.

Wagner responded: Please don?t believe what the press say!

Simon Cowell I think I?ve got to try and judge this as if it was the first time I?d ever seen the show. In the real world, which I know this isn?t it was the worst version of a Beatle song I have ever heard in my life. Are you taking this seriously? Do you think you can win?

Wagner responded: I am! I never thought of winning, all I wanted was an opportunity in show business.

Louis Walsh: Everey week he comes out and he gives it his best. You have a big fanbase out there, you don?t give hom any credit at all girls. I hope people vote for you Wagner because if you end up in the bottom two, the three witches of Eastwick here will vote you off!

Wagner: I want to say something to Cheryl, I didn?t know the guy was journalist and when he asked me what I thought about Cheryl I said:

Cheryl is a role model for young people of this nation. I believe she lived in a council estate and so many people who live there don?t believe they can achieve a better standard of living but because you are incredibly talented, beautiful and have the manners of a Princess, you are now the most famous woman in the country."

Whether he said that or not, Chavyl was out of order. Actually they all were including Louis who is his mentor. He could have defended him, bet Danni or Simon would have defended one of their acts.

I don't believe Wagner said either quotes personally. He's arrogant but I don't think he'd suck up Chavyl or the others and I don't think he's dumb enough to slag off a judge.

she really does open her mouth and emit a stream of profound sounding nothingness, doesn;t she?

Did'nt see it last night so can only judge by what ZZZ said.

I feel sorry for Wagner because noone including his mentor takes him seriously, Louis kicked up a fuss when Simon would'nt call Storm by his name yet he and the others CONTINUALLY belittle him by pronouncing it wrong. That ould really piss me off :o

That said I don't think Wagner is a particularly good singer, although I do think he'd be a good singer in his native language IYKWIM. BUT he has the entertainment factor and I would'nt blame him for having a go with being boo'd every week! Saying that I don't believe he would have said that to a journo yes he does come across as arrogant but I reckon he's probably had to toughen up.

Agree with whoever it was that said funny how Cherly believes papers WRT Wagner yet it's all lies about Cher (don't get me started on her).

sadly I hink the programme is rapidly disappearing up its own arse with all the newspaper stories and 'fighting'

can't guarantee that was accurate. Can someone who saw it say if that's what you heard?

Cheryl was wrong to use the x factor as a platform to air a grudge. Very arrogant - she clearly belives that it's all about her.
Wagner was probably set up by Simon Cowell anyway.

thanks

Chezza obviously thought she was going to get the audience whooping and cheering in her favour when she tried to humiliate old Wagner, but she fell flat on her arse. If you're going to try and cut someone down in front of six million viewers then be pithy at least...

He described her perfectly not sure why she was offended

That's exactly what I thought, Noddy. She IS from a council estate and she did get lucky. Sorry but she did. There are thousands of girls up and down the country on council estates who can sing at least as well as her. She was just pretty before millions were spent on the dental veneers/extensions etc. It was just luck that Waterman picked her out.

Where is UnquietDad anyway? This thread ought to have lured him in by now, to defend his woman

Whatever anyone thinks of Wagner, he came out of this looking better than Cheryl. He spoke the truth- she did live on a council estate, she did get lucky... Theres certainly no great talent there, and quite a few unattractive personality traits. She manages (well, is TRAINED to manage by the people pulling her strings) to cope reasonably well on x factor most of the time, but this was a great example of her straying from her script, going off piste and getting it spectacularly wrong. She looked petty, insecure and quite frankly, threatened by the fact that another talentless person- Wagner- pointed out that, like him, she just got lucky

I think Cheryl's part was stage managed, just not sure how much Wagner knew about it. I'm just not sure whether or not it was designed to get Wagner more votes. There is no way that Cheryl would have said anything without Simon knowing first and he's usually pretty good where manipulating the audience is concerned.

It is luck. And looks. Without that beautiful face she'd still be on that council estate, bless her. I'd love to know what they were all playing at. It seems bit that out of all the bullshit printed in the papers about the whole farce of a show, they bring this non story up during judging.

I have never liked chezza and yesterday reinforced why. She abused her position and was downright petty. Well at least it gave me a reason to vote for Wagner

No I still don't agree that it's just down to luck. She had the shrewdness and taste to get her teeth, hair and make up done so that she looks absolutely stunning. That's a skill actually - good looking women like Jordan, Kerry Katona, that bint who was on Big Brother and was bullied, can't remember her name - all of them had the same raw material as Cheryl and didn't polish it up as skillfully [understatement].

And she made the right career moves - married an England player, went on the X Factor and has skillfully balanced a persona of "nice constructive sympathetic judge" with being just honest enough when she thinks she has the audience with her, to persuade those not resistent to be persuaded, that she has integrity.

I don't know how much of that persona is real and how much is professional persona. But you've got to hand it to her, she does it well.

Cheryl has a million stylists making her look that good. It's not her taste. It's the taste of a good Management team. The Cheryl we saw eight years ago with scraped back hair and crop tops was the real Cheryl.

She'll always be the nasty, racist who thumped a lavatory attendant to me.

Totally agree cupcakes - everything about her is stage managed. I don't see how being advised by stylists to get your teeth veneered, or to maintain a body weight which is probably clinically unhealthy, shows any skill whatsoever. She's an overpaid puppet. And actually, talking of 'luck', she doesn't seem to have found happiness or fulfilment through her 'career moves' of marrying an England footballer etc... tbh, she may well have been living a happier life if she's made her own way, and developed some skills of her own, rather than going for the 'celebrity based on no talent whatsoever' lifestyle.

I think it's the fact that she knew Wagner spoke the truth which hit a nerve... there are more similarities than them than she cares to admit... both come across as not particularly bright and not particularly talented

Oh yes nancy - and with a nasty temper on her too

Very well said, Violet.

She is melting under Dannii's sun now too. Dannii manages to look demure yet glamorous, she's nice to her acts and seems to radiate niceness. Cheryl seems bitter and spiteful. She has had a shit year though, to be fair to her.