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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

DSD abortion thread part II

946 replies

GivesHeadlessHorseman · 26/10/2010 21:05

carry on ladies....

OP posts:
Lougle · 27/10/2010 17:24

Tess, that is a bit later than you thought, isn't it? Sad Well, in one way, that takes half the problem away, because now you all agree that she won't be having an abortion, so you can focus on the practicalities of her being almost half-way through her pregnancy.

I agree you need to establish what the sonographer was doing. It wasn't a great idea for them to ask you to leave, to be honest, but what's done is done.

I hope you will get the support quickly, now you know she is almost 16 weeks.

Discowife · 27/10/2010 17:24

If mum and dad start taking over the pregnancy now where does it end?

She needs to be sat down and told to think of herself as a parent. Parents think about what tests they want, agonise and guilt them selves... She needs to do this.

Scaredandalone · 27/10/2010 17:24

Well I personally think there are more important battles like the father and childcare issues to sort out right now.

GiddyPickle · 27/10/2010 17:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

diddl · 27/10/2010 17:24

Yes, but we only have the word of a 14yr old desperately wanting to keep the baby of what was said.

If the girl asked directly, how much would she be told?

maryz · 27/10/2010 17:24

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Discowife · 27/10/2010 17:27

It still isn't likely though is it maryz? And how can they prepare for a downs child? Read a book? I haven't dealt with anyone with down so cna't say but I suspect like anythign in this world you don't know how to deal till you have to deal.

jonesy71 · 27/10/2010 17:28

I have mixed thoughts about this - she is a child and is undoubtedly scared, (even more after today) I i dare say has been scared to tell anyone for so long maybe even hoping it wasn't true or would just go away, and for that i feel very sorry for her,

but I would also be incredibly cross with her not only for allowing it to happen, but leaving it so late, and insisting on a future which will change everyones lives who didn't do anything to ask for this to happen.

Very very sorry for Tess Sad

Haliborange · 27/10/2010 17:28

Surely to consent to a surgical termination you wouldn't need to be told in such graphic details what would happen? A simple "they take the baby away" would suffice instead of the whole description of breaking up the foetus? For other operations you don't get the specifics, merely the overview and the risks - and they come from the doctor, not from the sonographer whose job is surely not to bully young girls. I've had my "cervix opened" for surgery and noone ever told me about the instruments used. Shame on that sonographer. The fact that DSD is freaking out about an amnio does make me suspect that her aversion to abortion may be partly because it is surgical and scary. I know I was terrified of that stuff at 14. I would complain to PALS, she is a vulnerable girl and that was an abuse of power.

Your DH needs to man up and he has to do it quickly. In the meantime thank goodness your DSD has you.

Re the amnio, I guess she needs to understand that part of being a parent is doing things that frighten you for the good of your child. She may as well start now.

You're doing great Tess. Hang in there.

FancyALittle · 27/10/2010 17:28

Quick question following on from someone else's suggestion about getting yourselves prepared to tell people...

Does the school she attends know yet? At the stage of pregnancy she is, they should probably be informed soon as they have a duty of care over her during the school day.

BarnacleBill · 27/10/2010 17:28

If the girl asked directly, how much would she be told?

By a Sonographer? Don't know - it's not their job. very, very weird, imo, that they talked in this way to her.

TessoftheDamned · 27/10/2010 17:30

The school does not know, as far as I'm aware. Can I ask - if she has an amnio would they only give results directly to her (and in fact for all her future pregnancy info, test, etc.) so she could keep the knowledge from us, in effect? Not saying she would but I want to know what we're dealing with.

HalfTermHero · 27/10/2010 17:30

Tess, first post on this thread for me. I am so sorry for you and dsd. She sounds like a scared little child. You are both having a nightmare right now. I agree that it is only worth having the amnio if dsd agrees she would abort if the results showed an abnormality. No point you all going through the stress, otherwise.

You are doing an amazing job and dsd is so very lucky to have you. I hope you realise this and feel proud of yourself!

I also agree that you need to get her to understand that she needs to meet your support halfway and give you the name of the father. Half the school will be aware who he is, it is only fair that you have that information too. She should respect that you need to know. Plus, if she is keeping the baby the boy ( hoping and praying it is a boy) willneed to know too. He has a lot of growing up to do I. The next 5 months.

Discowife · 27/10/2010 17:31

If she asked she has a right to know, all comes with being a grown up now. I do feel for them all

GiddyPickle · 27/10/2010 17:32

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

mathanxiety · 27/10/2010 17:32

My guess is she left it as long as she could to tell you, maybe out of denial, maybe out of fear of your reaction -- she will be showing soon and probably decided she would have to bite the bullet. She will also be feeling the baby move soon, if she hasn't already.

You don't have to have amnio. I had a sonogram, don't remember what they called it, third degree or some such term, to investigate the possibility of Down's for DC5 as I was 37 at the time. The result was accurate. Sonogram took ages and a specialist had to do it. OTOH, amnio isn't half what is going to happen when she gives birth.

WRT the sonographer, the DSD may have heard what she wanted to hear there. And if she heard it later, after the fact, and the mechanics had been sugar coated at the time, everyone would have to deal with that too. It's jarring to have your baby referred to as 'foetal matter' (during one mc my doctor called for the nurse to bring him a sterile container and label it 'products of conception', as I lay there passing large clots in his office) -- medical staff should be a bit more careful wth their terminology imo. But they have a different perspective from the layman perhaps.

I hope your DH will take responsibility to bring the DD to her next appointment. Glad you will be making him take care of the counselling arrangements. Please point out to him that 'not being ready' is the problem, not an excuse. Don't let him off the hook. And I agree, you have every right to expect the DSD to tell you and her father who the father of the baby is -- she owes it to both of you if you are being asked to help her. Give and take and mutual obligations run both ways.

I have an idea that young teenage girls sometimes have inadequate nutrition, try to burn the candle at both ends, and in other ways such as possibly drinking or smoking (not that this is happening here) are under more pressure physically while pregnant than older mothers are. Since a lot of teenage pregnancies are not carefully planned, there is no preparation of the body by taking extra folic acid, and sometimes no prenatal vitamins until late in the pregnancy if it takes a while to secure prenatal care, hence some problems with the babies.

Discowife · 27/10/2010 17:32

You'll find out who the dad is soon enough. Everyone will know somethign happened on the trip and soon your daughter will show. It'll get around

electra · 27/10/2010 17:34

I don't think it's helpful to keep talking about the child having a SN. Of course it's a risk - but the reality is that most children don't have SN, and I say that as the mother of a disabled child.

BitOfFunderthepatio · 27/10/2010 17:34

The sonographer should have referred her on to a doctor for a non-hysterical explanation, IMO, surely? They don't exactly sound impartial Angry

Tess, I'm so sorry you are being put through this.

Scaredandalone · 27/10/2010 17:34

Yes is she asks for the information to be kept from you it will, just like she can get contraceptive and you wont be informed.

expatinscotland · 27/10/2010 17:34

Sorry, but Tess, you need to see a counsellor yourself because the poster who said a pattern is already emerging - you sort everything out, your DH maintains his normal life - is right.

He's never going to be 'ready', and now he only had about 6 months to get 'ready'.

You also need to find someone to hack her accounts and find out who the dad is.

diabhal · 27/10/2010 17:36

I have been wondering throughout if the DSD has secretly been considering an abortion. Her reaction to the sonographer may indicate that this had been an option in her mind ? therefore she was shaken by what the procedure would involve. If she was 100% sure that she wanted to ?keep it?, as she has been saying, then why would she be disturbed by the details of a termination?

As some others have said, perhaps she really needs her parents to take charge here and lay out the implications. Not just about the night feeds and the tribulations of having a baby. But the impact on her whole future life, job prospects, love life etc. Plus the impact on her father, stepbrothers and Tess. Is all of this a price worth paying? Is a termination really worse than this?

I do think that Tess should state clearly to the both of them that her preferred option is termination. She should say that if DSD has the baby she will not provide any childcare during the week, and talk about mother and baby units, nannies etc. She should also say that if she is pushed into looking after the baby it may drive her to leave the family. I think it deeply unfair that Tess can only confess her true feelings on a messageboard and it?s about time her DH and DSD understand that a bomb that has been placed in the heart of their family. It?s truly harrowing reading this thread and Tess you have all my sympathy.

notsoacademicallytormented · 27/10/2010 17:36

Is it possible DSD has been googling herself and the sonographer wasn't as scary as she's making out? That she's using the scaremongering as a further 'excuse' for want of a better word to completely discount a termination?

electra · 27/10/2010 17:36

And of course, there are plenty of SN that cannot be picked up through anti-natal tests.

electra · 27/10/2010 17:37

I was told that if I had a termination at 16 weeks I would have to actually give birth.

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