Continuing support group for those affected by someone else's drinking

[pointythings]

Our current thread is nearly full, and it's too valuable to lose in the mists of time, so this is thread 2. Come here if you are struggling with a loved one's drinking - partner, parent, child, friend, there's support for you here no matter which person in your life is struggling with the drink and having an adverse impact on you. The women on here have all been there or are still going through it. We support and advise each other, we don't judge, we listen.

Original thread here to refer back to: https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/alcohol_support/4581221-support-group-for-those-affected-by-someone-elses-drinking

@Nogoodusername he’s on Acomprosat which is supposed to help with the cravings, and Disulfrum (aka Antabuse) which is supposed to make you violently ill if you come into contact with alcohol. Clearly doesn’t work for him.

How did he manage to sneak the vodka on the glass. I assume you have him the oj

stupid man that he couldn’t have waited an hour or two till he was alone

he’s still drinking and lying

dh got away with it sometimes with me as I think I was used to his slurred tones and his older kids would come w d say he’s been drinking and Id say no he hasn’t as I didn’t think he had

they must have thought I was stupid. Looking back I feel totally stupid that I didn’t see it under my nose sometimes

now I don’t live with him and he drinks it’s so bloody obvious.

how do they think we don’t know

@Thefellowship you say the levels are the same. As in he’s still drinking ?

to me that shows he isn’t serious or trying

only you can decide if he is pushing your boundaries and say enough

it took my years so don’t feel bad

@pointythings its the lies I won’t handle. I always said I would support if he was honest and when asked if drinking he would deny and even refuse breathayser but the total blankness and lying and deceit eventually I had enough

as @MamaBear81 says the lies are worse

the denial when obvious drinking by the sound smell and sight of him. Yet says no I havnt

do they really believe they havnt or why lie

dh was on acomprosat as well. To begin with 4yrs ago I think it did help the cravings but then he drank and lied about it

shame it can’t react badly with booze - tho does dh @MamaBear81 actually take the Antabuse of just collects the drugs from chemist and pretend to take like I found dh had Been doing as so many left over each month

@Penguinsandspaniels No I didn’t give him it, he went into the kitchen and made it himself. He was sober on arrival so I didn’t think he would then start drinking whilst with us. More fool me. But he’s ruined the opportunity of visiting DD at her home now. Back to public places only.
Yes he was taking the Antabuse. When he first got prescribed them, I had to sign a consent form to keep them with me and administer them to him daily. I would meet with him every morning, give it to him and make sure it was swallowed.
It took 10 days before he drank on them. After which I refused to be the person administering them anymore, as I know how dangerous it can be to drink on those and I didn’t want to feel responsible for him being ill. His mother took over with it, but he’s still been drinking regularly and excessively. They don’t seem to have any affect on him.
When I confronted him tonight, he tried tohas light me and make out like I’m the one with issues. Said I need to see a therapist, and tried to make me think I was imagining things. I literally drank a mouthful when he went to the toilet because had noticed the way his speech had changed. It’s all too familiar. And he still lied to my face. Before now, he’s agreed to do a breathalyser and failed it, and still denied drinking. He’s even told me he isn’t drinking while stood right in front of me with a can of super strength lager in his hand ffs.

He’s deluded

@MamaBear81 I’m also having a ‘more fool me’ moment this morning. After weeks of emails about how is going to all his appointments (local services) and doing therapy and taking his meds etc, and can I support him as a friend, I agreed to go to his appointment about a community detox with him as he needed someone there and his family member who will be his carer for the process not back from holiday. So I did. Again reeled back in thinking I should help because maybe this time he will get sober (3 stints in private rehab and 1 private detox in the past 1.5 years) and rebuild his life again: not with me, that ship has sailed, but for his kids and his family and his life (because being honest, I’m quite sure he’s getting to end stage alcoholism with the number of years his intake is 200+ units weekly).
This morning? I wake up to a weird rambling about bumping into a friend and not remembering his name, and multiple early hours deleted messages - which is code for, got smashed and sent multiple rants - could be attacking me for abandoning him, could be the self pity ohhh I have lost everything in my life because I struggle with my mental health and self medicate and no one wants to stick by poor me and no one wants to help me he (showing some rare restraint to delete them)
WTAF. Who gets smashed when they are supposedly so committed to recovery attempt number 1000 that you’ve just had an appointment to confirm the community detox starting date, how it works etc. Like seriously wtf

and also, seriously wtf is wrong with me? Why do I feel such a sense of responsibility for this man?? His kids are not my kids. We didn’t live together because his addiction became clear thankfully in time (Like the fool, I totally fell for the story that his ex wife was abusive and he really wasn’t an addict, irs a lie she made up to shame him bla bla). I am also not prepared to make my children live with a new partner (totally personal choice, I know some people achieve blending families successfully, but because of my professional background it’s a no for an unrelated man to share space with my teenage daughters etc). My kids are happy, stable and their father is an excellent Dad who always puts them first.
Why do I think I have a responsibility to save this man when it is SO easy for me to walk away compared to those of you who share children and property etc. so angry at myself today. For context - my Dad was also an alcoholic. My Mum never left him so he never lost everything and seemed to manage steady levels of alcohol misuse the vast majority of times (not always) as opposed to the car crash that my ex’s addiction has descended to . Is there something in that? I’ve also known ex all of my life. So while a new partner, is a very old family friend.

Sorry about all the typos! Angry and frustrated this morning and typing very fast

@Nogoodusername it’s infuriating isn’t it. I’m so frustrated with myself. Like you, our ship has sailed im terms of us ever being together. But I felt obliged to support him as the father of my child. I can’t support someone who isn’t even honest about his drinking though. Someone who will deny it to my face, while I am stood there with his glass full of vodka in my hand.
In all honesty, I don’t think ex DP really wants to change. I think going to his appointments, taking his meds etc is all to create the illusion to others that he wants to change, in the hope that if they see he is ‘trying’, they will stick around. But he is still drinking, lying, sneaking around just as much as he was before he started the journey with help. There has been no progress whatsoever.
He blames me for his continued drinking because he is having to live with his two friends who are also alcoholics.
Bulls**t - Every time I used to allow him to come back, the drinking would still continue regardless. He also had a room at his parents, but they also threw him out for getting drunk and causing chaos there.
He drinks regardless of where he is, or who he is with. But will always pass the blame and never take accountability.

This thread is amazing, I have just stumbled on it and read multiple pages. So sorry for what everyone is going through and has gone through. I identify so hard with almost every post. My ex-DH is an alcoholic and drug addict and father to my 2 DC. He’s just told me he has “severe liver disease and chronic cirrhosis “. After some googling I asked if he knew if liver was compensated or decompensated and he said decompensated. It’s a shock (but no surprise iyswim). Don’t know if/ how to tell the children - they haven’t seen him in nearly 18mths but talk to him on phone / FaceTime most weeks. Apparently he’s going to need a transplant.

He lies so bloody much I don’t even know what to believe.

Anyone been in a similar situation and got any advice?

Welcome to the group, @Addictforanex .

How old are the children? Are they aware that their father is an addict? The answers to those questions would determine my response and how it was to be phrased.

Aside from that, all I can recommend is that you put yourself, your children, your friends/family/entire life first, and him last in terms of the amount of emotional energy you expend. He has made his choices. You are not responsible for him in any way. Keep him out of your life as much as you can.

This is hard - my husband continued to occupy a great deal of my headspace after he was removed from the family home by the police. Even after he died, he was still there. And now I'm 7 years on and he still appears in my dreams quite regularly.

@Addictforanex , honestly? I wouldn’t do anything at all. He dug this hole, just thank God you and the children aren’t in it. He’s telling you for sympathy, but there is some peace in the discovery that you don’t have to participate in their drama. If he tells your children, then your job would be to keep them on an even keel, don’t let him force them into oh no my Dad Is seriously ill and we all now must dance to his . He may be, h may not be, no one can predict the course of it.
@Nogoodusername . The reason we fall for people who have behaviours we recognise from another relationship is that this time we hope to change the ending. But it doesn’t work. I got locked into the role of helper very early in life and I have bust a gut trying to get other people to see their destructive patterns of behaviour. But I only saw my compulsion to accept dysfunctional people into my life and try to fix them as a destructive pattern recently . Even with the strong boundaries you put in place to protect your children, you are still getting pulled in to his crap and it is affecting you.

It’s so hard isn’t it? Children are 12 and 14 and yes they do know he is an addict. They’ve known about 4 years, before that he would tell them all sorts of bullshit to explain/ excuse his appalling behaviour. I spent a decade trying to save him but threw him out when eldest was 6 and we divorced pretty quickly. He got a 6 figure settlement from me and spent it all on booze and coke whilst insisting til he was blue in the face he was sober.

My DC have lots of compassion for him (so much more than he deserves) and love him very much. Heart breaks for them. I am so angry with the man I actually think I hate him. So sad.

But yes I am so pleased we aren’t in the hole with him - great analogy. I will not get us sucked back into this mess but don’t know what I am really dealing with.

@Addictforanex I doubt very much he'll be given a transplant. My DH got the same diagnosis and carried on drinking -his attitude was he was dying anyway so might as well. If the children aren't seeing him I would keep it that way. The weight loss, ascites, jaundice and confusion are not one bit pleasant to see. I veered between fury, pity and guilt although have to admit my main emotion when he finally died was relief. But it was heartbreaking for our children.

@Addictforanexits hard for kids to not love their alcoholic parent and they can’t distract with love the way we can

he won’t get a liver Transplant tho he may need one

I wouldn’t tell your dc

Thank you so much for your thoughts. Agree I am not going to tell them anything at the moment. I spoke to ex-H this morning and he said they are trying different meds etc and transplant will be considered last resort and reassessed in a few months. Told me he is 23 months sober now but I know that’s not true, it’s 16 months absolute max. So that story could be because he’s been told he’s not eligible for a transplant.

Do you think he is 16mths sober ? As in not a single didn’t in that time ?

@Nogoodusername I totally hear you. Have you read “codependent no more?”. I recognized myself in a lot of the narrative in the book. Also had some CBT and linked childhood experiences with how I ended up in a people pleasing mode and actively put myself last. I would subconsciously almost seek out problems to solve and became a problem magnet. My ex-H was certainly one big problem, but one I could never (and did never) solve.

Honestly? No, but he’s spent half of that time in some sort of treatment centre.

Good he goes for treatment but obv don’t work

detox I don’t think works

Sounds similar - No centre for dh but he says he’s isn’t drinking. Yeah right. It’s obvious when he does

I read online that he’s has been sober for 18mths last year after we split - the most he was sober was 4w as was few months after I kicked him out

I did laugh when read it

they are so in denial

Gosh - this thread is full of stoic, resourceful, caring individuals. The selflessness and dedication to helping support others is incredible.

But I’ve read so many posts that are helping me really see how hopeless this might be for my friend if she doesn’t get her shit together.

I posted last on Thursday about my friend who was going into rehab. And how I could support her.

Sadly she’s decided to leave tomorrow. She could barely stand on Thursday, certainly didn’t know where she was, who was around her, and the rehab clinic wasn’t even sure they could take her - thinking hospital might be her only option - but now she’s apparently ‘fine’.

It’s frustrating. Her exH is being a rock, looking after her two teenagers, her partner is also standing by (for now), but who leaves rehab after only 4 days?! It’s hopeless isn’t it? She’s given herself no time. Yes she’s sobered up. But no time to really explore what is going on.

Are there any success stories out there?

I’m not feeling at all hopeful about her chances if she doesn’t prioritise her recovery. I suspect she’ll just drink again as soon as something goes wrong. 😔

@JanefromLondon sadly your friend's pattern of behaviour is pretty typical. The addiction is so strong that as soon as they are no longer drunk and the cravings (both physical and psychological) kick in, they cave and give up on getting sober. Yes, your friend will drink again and probably very soon. Her ex should probably be thinking seriously about being the resident parent on a permanent basis, because it is not good for children of any age to be living with a parent who is in active addiction.

Success does happen. My sister's partner is 15 years sober this year. He realised he stood to lose everything - her, his business, his home - and he pulled himself together and did the work. Including daily meetings, and it was hard, hard, hard. He tried to support my late husband, but it didn't help.

We also have a couple in the real life group I run where the husband is an alcoholic in recovery. His wife has an adult son from a previous relationship who is addicted to drugs and has serious mental health issues. He has stayed sober through it all.

But the things those two people have in common is that they wanted to stop. Your friend doesn't yet want to stop. I am so very sorry. Support her exH and the DC if the relationship between you allows that, and protect yourself.

Best thing if you want to help and are able to, is to be an emotional support to her children. They are the ones who will gain from it. Your friend will not. She has to help herself. She went into rehab when she was in no state to make the decision that this is what she needed to do so it was very unlikely to work. I know that sounds daft, because nobody goes into rehab unless they've got issues with drink or drugs but if they're not totally committed to being sober they won't last the first painful week.

@JanefromLondon i know plenty of success stories, but mostly from a controlled group - ie from people who went to rehab with my DH at the time and also the therapists and Family group leaders there almost always had personal experience with alcoholism and addiction and some where 20years+ sober.

It sounds to me as your friend is not ready. I’ve been there. I gave my DH ultimatums to go into treatment when I knew he needed it or I knew he was near the end of the road, or I thought he was about to lose everything, or frankly when I was at end of my rope. It’s so hard to hear but it won’t work on anyone else’s timetable but the person themselves. It’s so frustrating that we can see what they can’t.

Can I join please for some support?

My situation is complex - aren't they all involving alcoholics!

I ended my relationship in January for lots of reasons, his drinking, his behaviour over the last 3 years, his Dad died in July 23 unexpectedly, and then his business was liquidated Oct 23 - our house was security against the business loan and I own my half of the house outright. He didn't tell me until after the paperwork was signed. He used his inheritance to pay off the loan and various other substantial personal debts (that I wasn't aware of). I thought our relationship was slowly getting better then it wasn't. I was quietly getting my ducks in a row in the background. Then in January he told me that HMRC are pursuing him for £50k. He expected me to fix this by borrowing the money from my parents. This was the final straw. I ended things and we are in the process of selling the house. But we are both living in the house with my DC 17 and 15. I am living in the room that was for his DC.

He is drinking more than ever. He was meant to have a minor op under GA at Easter, that was cancelled because his full blood count was off kilter - his coagulation numbers were far too low, his lft was 277. He has since had an ultrasound and has gallbladder polyps, fatty liver/scarring and his spleen is enlarged. Yet he is still drinking.

He tries to start an argument at least once a week. I walk away, go to bed. He then sends me multiple messages and berates me for all my wrong doing in our 13 year relationship. I ignore.

Now to my biggest issue, last weekend and this weekend. He's been out all weekend and then has started an argument. I have walked away, but his volume and aggression is far worse. I have walked away both times but not quickly enough. Last weekend badly upset the DC. I'm getting concerned that his behaviour is escalating.

How do I navigate this without having to leave my home? He has refused to move out.

I expect the normal advice would be to tell him to pack his bags but he's unlikely to meekly agree. If he is violent or is scaring you and the children phone the police immediately. If they can't or won't remove him, you can't continue to live like this. It's not a a safe situation, and not fair on your kids. it might be best to leave temporarily. Can you go and stay with your parents?