How do we ACTUALLY solve the rift between dog people and non-dog people?

[Talkingtomyhouseplants]

Inspired by yet another dog thread where all the SAME arguments are trotted out again and again:

The Pro Dog People say:

• The dog is my family, you need to treat it like family
• Why would I get a dog just to leave it at home?
• It’s just a dog, it’s not bothering anyone
• My dog is less annoying than your child
• I love my dog more than I love people
• The dogs are ALLOWED to be there so it’s okay that I bring them places
• If my dog isn’t invited, I would probably choose to stay home as I prefer most dogs to people anyway
• My house is my dog’s home too, I won’t be shutting it away for anyone
• My dog isn’t dangerous - he’s a bit softy.

The Anti Dog People Say

• I’m allergic/scared/don’t like being around them - please keep them away from me
• It’s a pet, not your family
• A dog is not a child
• I won’t have dogs in my house
• Dogs are dirty and unhygienic - they shouldn’t be in shops or places where you eat
• I’m sick of dogs barking and jumping up at me in public and I keep stepping in dog poo
• There are too many places that either actively allow dogs, or more often don’t challenge people who bring them anyway so dogs eventually become allowed
• Dog owners are entitled and pushy and this is why they are now suddenly everywhere
• It’s dangerous to have dogs around children
• Dogs can bite/kill people
• There are too many untrained dogs who are treated like people

Same arguments on both sides, every time.

In my personal life I can think of at least two situations where these opposing views are creating real rifts in families because the dog person wants to bring a dog, and the non-dog person doesn’t want to be around said dog. I can feel it becoming more polarising in society generally, anti dog people are more vocal about being anti dog and pro dog people are more pushy about full inclusion of dogs in human spaces.

So what is the actual solution?

I am one of these people although we lost our dog at the end of March. We absolutely loved him but would not have dreamt of taking him to cafes, pubs etc. He was much better off comfortably at home

Support the switch to cats ❤️

Dog dander is no more prolific than dandruff. Lots of humans have that. And any faecal matter is on the floor, so unless that is where you are eating? You’re fine.
And if service staff don’t wash their hands when they’ve fussed a dog? I’d suggest they also don’t wash their hands when they’ve been to the toilet. That’s not a dog issue, it’s a training and hygiene issue.

Genuinely, where are you? I move a lot with work, I’ve lived in quite a lot of “tourist” towns, I live in one now. The split between dog friendly and not is about 60/40 in favour of not.

I feel like the issue is largely poor owners who have untrained dogs and/or entitled owners, sometimes their dogs are untrained too, though not always and they think their dog is everyone else's problem.

My son is scared of dogs thanks to an untrained one. I'm not anti dog, I just find my son to be more important than dogs so him feeling comfortable comes first. Dogs aren't welcome at my house and if a dog will be at an event, we simply don't go.

Going back to the original question of what is the solution. I think it’s respect.

If the host/house says no dog - then no dog.
anti dog people invited to an event with dogs need to accept that they cannot attend
dog owners need to train their dogs and keep on leads - not allow dogs to jump, and make sure they clean up their poo.
dog owners need to realise that not everyone loves their pet and sometimes the pet is not welcome.
the default is no dog. Dog owners should ask if the dog can come - they shouldn’t assume.
places need to have non-dog spaces to allow those who dislike them to have space and for those with allergies to know where they can safely go
some spaces need to have no dog zones - like areas of natural beauty and beaches.
shops should not allow dogs. Dogs do not need to go shopping. I don’t take my rabbit shopping.

For the Christmas example - if 1 or more people at uncomfortable with a dog, dog doesn’t attend.

For the Christmas example - if 1 or more people at uncomfortable with a dog, dog doesn’t attend.

That's fine, as long as no umbrage is taken when the dog's owner can't attend, or can only attend for a short time.

But do no you not think you are also being highly inflexible and not helping to make it work? This is like someone I know whose dog has to take medication at the same time every day (fair enough) but the time they have chosen is 9pm. This means they either “have” to bring the dog out for the evening or they need to leave by 8:30 which isn’t really an evening. They could very easily choose a different, less intrusive time and move it back by 10 minutes a day until they reach it but they won’t but they then complain they are “excluded” when people say the dog is not welcome. You could find dog care that you are comfortable with but you don’t so you can see why people might feel offended that they are being deprioritised next to a dog.

you misunderstand. It unkind to put a dog somewhere they will be unhappy. All dogs know is the now. They have no concept that they will only be unhappy for a day....they don't even understand what a day is. For all they know and understand the unhappiness will last forever.

You’ve just accused me of lying😆 In fact you think my entire post is made up of lies. I suppose some people get their kicks from lying to total strangers on the internet to gain … what exactly? All towns must be exactly the same as yours. Mine is more of an out of control village than a town. Bit like the dogs.

Boots AND Superdrug btw! I must check the policy in those shops because last weekend I saw a little handbag sized dog (in a rucksack carried on a man’s chest) and what looked like a spaniel/lab cross on the one day. Maybe everyone just rolls their eyes, same as me.

The complaining about exclusion is wrong. Adults make their life choices and then need to live with them.

I don’t like dogs. Or any animals. No solution.

Plenty of solutions! You wouldn’t come to my house, we’d meet elsewhere at a none dog friendly venue. No problem for me.

I like most dogs. I grew up with dogs in my house and love to meet friendly dogs.

I hate dog poo on the pavement/grass.
I hate that every lamppost and bench is smelly and looks sticky.
I hate that bloody retractable leads get tangled around me and dog owners look at me like it is my fault.
I hate the badly behaved dogs that launch themselves into my picnic or fish and chips.

Basically I like dogs that are owned by considerate owners who have trained their dogs to either stay at home or behave well in public. I really really don’t like dogs being in cafes/shops/parks/pavements when their owners just simper at the dog when it is fucking annoying to other people using the space.

Agree, that is ridiculous. A lot of mine are old and medicated, that schedule works around us. And honestly? You can move the majority of meds by an hour or two with no ill effects.

from your posts OP, I don't think you are destined to be the one to heal the rift.

No, no, no! Our dogs are not bored being out with us in dog friendly venues. Well behaved and trained dogs are happy to be out with their owners wherever we take them. I don’t get how a dog sitting at their owners feet under a table can be bored. Dogs spend a lot of time sitting quietly or sleeping. Dogs need socialising as much as humans do.

I take my dog on a short train ride to a very dog friendly food barn, we shop, we have lunch and get back on the train home. To him it’s adventure.

That is lovely 🙂
My mum brings her greyhound with her on her weekly visit to my house. We go to the local cafe, and her dog head straights there. One time, they were late opening and the shutter was down. He stood there pressing his head on it like he was willing it to open. He enjoys his dog ice cream, and then a lie down in typical greyhound fashion. He is happy to be with his people, wherever that may me.

The thing with staring is, it's either a provocation or invitation to the dog, depending on circumstances. It's basic dog behaviour. Not all dogs will act to people staring, but like an unexpected touch a dog can act instinctively. Mine are fine and luckily they are used to small children, however I don't want to put them into situations where they are free game to strangers.

There are people with dogs who realise that they are pets! I have one and do not take him everywhere including peoples houses! I am aware some people are allergic or don’t like dogs and that’s to be respected. Mine stays home while I pop to the shops or visit people, but I wouldn’t go on a long trip without him as he is very nervous in the kennels. So quite often if a family member/friend invites us and it’s a long drive, only one of us would go.

Each to their own, but this is the secret standing in plain site that non dog owners don’t experience. These funny, little creatures that do need caring for and give so much care back.

My dog is not treated like a human but whenever my DH gives me a hug or the family have a group hug he makes sure he is included.

There is a support dog (owned by one of the staff), at mums nursing home and he is a hit.

We are not all bad owners. A well trained, well behaved dog is such a delight. They are a commitment. They do take lots of care, attention and money. But they are worth it for us that do it well and are considerate.

@YeOldeGreyhound, my neighbour has the most beautiful greyhound. She is so slight and elegant. Stunning dog x

Nope, I'm not inflexible, not at all. I'm a responsible dog owner. I won't leave my dog for more than 3-4 hours and I won't kennel her, because both things would cause her immense distress.

If I can't take my dog where I'm going (which is absolutely fine and I respect that), then my time out of the house is limited to 3-4 hours. This means short local visits only if she can't come with me, and I will decline invitations which don't fit into that. I'll flexibly suggest alternative option, such as hosting at mine or meeting half way or meeting somewhere dog friendly. But I won't cause distress to my dog, so she won't be left for longer than 3-4 hours.

Why though? Why can’t your dog stay at home for a few hours?

Agreed and I would expect that would be respected in most families if the hosts etc have set that rule. I’m not anti dog as such. I like well behaved dogs. But I don’t want them in my home. So that means we meet family elsewhere or at theirs. Or they come to us for shorter periods