Should we leave London after burnout, or stay for my husband's career?

[ChickenChitty]

Help me with my life dilemma.

DH and I have been together for 15 years, we are late 30s with 2 kids at primary school. I work in a stressful job in the City, requiring extremely long hours (60-70hr weeks, weekend work most weekends and most holidays too). DH is in a creative career - his passion. I earn c.6x what he does. He is self-employed so does more with the kids and more around the house (I’d say he does 60% of the childcare and maybe 70% of household tasks).

I nearly died earlier this year with a ruptured appendix that was missed and negligent medical care. It came off the back of a period of very intense work - about 9 months of hell. I’m mentally traumatised from that experience and burnt out generally, and the whole thing has made me reassess my life.

Ive suddenly got clarity that I don’t want to continue doing my job anymore and I don’t even know what I’m doing it for as London is so expensive our quality of life is not great. We have enough equity in our small London terraced house that we could move back to my home town (up north) and buy somewhere large and detached and lovely mortgage free, near much better schools for the kids and near my family. DH really doesn’t want to leave London as he loves it, and his work is here (his family is up north too but nowhere near mine). He would want to continue commuting to London if we moved, which would probably involve overnight stays and impact family life.

Im starting to feel a bit of resentment as I increasingly feel like I’m killing myself and sacrificing my quality of life so that DH can live his dreams. But I love him, am proud of what he does, and would feel awful to effectively force him to move (which we would need to do if I quit my job, as he could never pay the mortgage alone). I knew when we got married that this would be his career. I’ve thought of middle grounds like downsizing in London or moving to a commuter area if I took a pay cut, but that would feel like a much worse outcome for the kids, to leave everything they know for something materially worse, and/or both parents travelling more than we do now . I don’t know whether I’m being unfair in wanting to do this or not, or what the right balance is, so thoughts from other people would be welcome!

I did suggest Addiscombe
12 minutes train journey from London Bridge

One of the cheapest areas for housing in London. Up and coming area judging by the coffee shops and gym opening.

They do have the Victorian terraces around but mainly Edwardian -1930s houses. Ofsted Outstanding primary schools 2 Outstanding and a couple of Good rated secondaries (including the Brit school)

You aren’t going to the get the impressive semi in Guildford with huge gardens but with that it is £50k over budget and the commute costs would have to be factored in as a major expense

I think it is a reset you need.

if I am way off with my figures then either you are working for absolute peanuts or if you are earning more then you have a spending problem. I still don’t believe your dh only brings in £15k per year when he is working f/t hours

I don’t know Guildford catchments but I do know that house a pp suggested isn’t Guildford!

@FairKoala I can only assume you don’t really know much about London salaries and house prices if you think that I’d be working 70hour weeks in banking for £100k, or that I’d need to have a “spending problem” not to have more disposable income on a higher salary than this. I’ve never said anywhere that DH earns £15k - you seem to have reverse engineered that based on your (incorrect) assumptions about my salary.

I earn significantly in excess of £100k (multiples of that) but haven’t always done so - that was what I earned maybe 9 years ago and it’s gone up gradually since then - but we have a very big mortgage and for 5-6 years were paying about £35-40k pa (post tax) to our nanny, plus have had to do a lot of work on the house as I’ve already explained.

This is the address

Cobbett Hill Road Normandy Guildford, Surrey, GU3 2BZ

Where is it if Guildford isn’t the nearest main town

OK longer version - my children used to go to school in Ash, with children who lived in Normandy. Yes it is on the outskirts of Guildford, but it’s much nearer Ash/Tongham for school catchment. For shopping, entertainment, private schools, leisure etc everyone goes to Guildford. But when we’re talking catchments, different story. Still a great area but you may not benefit from Guildford schools.

Then you have a spending problem.

if you are earning several hundred thousand per year, you can drop dc off at school
be home in the evening for them, put them to bed and you are complaining that you are working 70 hour weeks and at weekends, your house is shit, your life is shit, the schools are shit and you cannot afford private then all I can say is something is going fundamentally very very wrong.

I think you need an accountant and life coach and a reality check

People manage on far less.

Why spend so much money on a shit house in a shit area where you know you aren’t going to stay because you know the secondary schools are not to your liking.

I went with the figures that you inferred you earned and did think that you might earn substantially more but dismissed that idea because I didnt think you would be so broke and complaining if you were earning £10/£15/ or 20,000 per month

You really have no concept of London house prices and mortgage costs. Lucky you!

We bought our house 10 years ago - a wreck which was all we could afford on my (much lower at the time) salary, with no parental help for deposits, before the kids were even born - so forgive me for not factoring in secondary schools but I’m hardly alone in that. We’ve had to spend a lot of money doing it up gradually and it’s now pretty much doubled in value but still needs work done (eg kitchen is awful).

To be clear, I’ve never said I’m broke - you’ve said you’ve read my posts so must have misunderstood. I have said I don’t spend lavishly or have a luxury lifestyle, because we save a lot, including into my (very good) pension. If we were to move for schools and I stayed in my job we would be looking at almost doubling the mortgage, which would be affordable on my current salary, but the point is that would lock me into my current job, which is part of what has prompted this realisation that yes, something is very fundamentally wrong with this way of life, for me.

I personally do get you OP - I know some high earners and it is a trap many have if there is only 1 high earner - not quite enough for private schools ‘and’ a fair old size mortgage and not enough to buy something with more space and better home wise if you want a better area for schools and not enough income if you want to cut back jobwise . It’s why a lot do move out unless they’ve had inheritance or have 2 high earners - it’s why I do think Surrey is a good option - would work well for your H but plenty of local work stuff for you to maybe consider too ( Woking, Guildford etc - still a fair amount of big head offices etc)!and it’s very easy if you get a hybrid job that allows you to cut back but easy into London when needed- not trying to dissuade you up north - just think it may be less complicated for family life and maybe an easier sell to your H

here’s another few that might fit - all 3 areas have a fair sprinkling of well rated state secondaries. They would need a mortgage but probably under £200k - you could buy mortgage free but they start getting a bit more average - and estates- but you might be ok with that too . So I’ve added one of those in too
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/88794096

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90841854

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/90616722
https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/167178095

https://www.rightmove.co.uk/properties/167333837

Redhill / Reigate could be worth considering too - very good train links to London from Redhill
council recently spent a lot of money on Redhill town centre
some people who work in city go to St Albans

yes, we lived in st Albans at one point ( actually twice at different times) - the only thing I would say is there isn’t a lot of local work, very much a commuter place or a good place if OP can get a hybrid job - and I personally think you get more for your money too in Surrey - stalbans is only 22 mins on train and hence tends to make it London money or not far off unless you have a small house - which is exactly what OP doesn’t want . If OP changes her mind about moving up north, my way of thinking would be to sort her job first and that may determine ‘where’ would work for her - clearly there are suitable places with good schools within budget but if OP can get a less stressful, less hours hybrid job - even if it was London 2 days a week - that then means it opens up certain areas within reason - if she can get a standard 9 to 5 in say Woking or Redhill or Guildford - then that would probablydetermine areas etc - the other thing is whilst selling house it’s also possible to do the reverse from living in London with a job in place -

Why are people suggesting commuting in from the Home Counties? @ChickenChittyhas been very clear she doesn’t want to do this.
Lots of people do and there are some good options available… but it’s not for her.

I know! Just read the OP's posts properly, FGS.

Because thus far, the conversation has broadly gone:

OP:
Option A - can't stay there any more, way too expensive
Option B - can't move there as too far away
Option C - not interested in commuterland

Everyone else:
Option C - why not, it's the only compromise that works

OP:
Option C - don't want to

Everyone else:

That’s not right. There are nuances that some posters are obviously missing.

I need and want to work locally to where we live. I dont want to live or work in London.

So we could literally move to ANY city in the U.K. provided DH could realistically get to London from there.

In other words - you’ve invented the option B in your post.

You have missed out the final option.

Option D - LTB

Because OP said that Guildford could work - but ideally if in Home Counties wants to be in an area where there ‘are’ lots of higher paying local jobs pertinent to what she does rather than commute into London- this is why I think Guildford//godalming/Woking area could work. And would work for her H too - I’m not saying she shouldn’t move up north but that ‘this’ is can option too - and still get a very good house and good schools

Are people taking this personally like they re bristling at OP rejecting their home counties commuterworld or something? Shes been really really clear.

Stay in London
Or (her preference) move to a northern city and work locally

I do have a good deal of knowledge about the London housing market.
As well as actually living in London and living within my means and not over extending my credit

Up to Covid I had a basic £3000 per month to live on.
This was to cover mortgage, and all bills, car insurance, car tax, petrol, tv licence, car repairs all shopping, clothing, 1 lot of private school fees, 1 lot of Interhigh fees, and after school activities
I also would pay for a holiday each year (although for a few years I have to thank the thief who stole my handbag for our holidays. He gave back unbeknownst to him much more than he stole)
I also did everything on my own as dh was away 3 weeks in every 4.

Dh did take over from me doing the family finances for around 2.5 years when DS was born
I had explained everything. Gave him my ledger and all the paperwork.
He hadn’t a clue how much things cost. Never shopped around and just paid what he was told to pay because banks/companies don’t make mistakes. It nearly bankrupted us.

He thought that he should have or be able to afford things because of his salary. It came as a shock when I said no.

We also have very very rich friends
I also have very very poor friends and see how much they juggle to pay everything.

So when people who earn hundreds of thousands and are moaning that everything is shit I think it is them that is the problem.

You want to live near to your place of work but you don’t want it to be London. But the jobs that pay the salary you want and need aren’t in other places other than London. Even if you stay in London close to your work then the schools aren’t going to be what you want. But you don’t want to move to where the schools are what you want because that would mean getting on a train for 10/15 minutes because you don’t want to commute.

I think that your dh is doing exactly the right thing and agreeing with you on everything and finding a way round the problem but I think he knows you aren’t ever going to be satisfied because what you want doesn’t exist

She doesn’t want to stay in London because of the schools not being good enough. Working locally in a northern town wouldn’t pay what she wants

She won’t even take the same paying job doing only 9-5 (if it exists) in London and move to where the schools tick the boxes because she doesn’t want to commute

It’s not directed at the people living in the Home Counties it’s directed at everyone.

You’re projecting massively as well as ignoring and misrepresenting what I’ve actually said.

If you had read my posts properly, you’ll see that I’ve said that the schools in London that id like to send my kids to are in expensive areas (ie I did NOT say no schools were good enough). I said that I would like to leave my job and work locally somewhere else, where I could afford no/a much smaller mortgage and therefore a lower paying, easier job (ie I did NOT say I needed a certain salary or even a high salary).

I don’t want to take a low paying job in London and then spend my additional leisure time and part of my (lower) salary commuting, not least because when DH is away travelling this would be difficult or impossible to manage, when my industry is pretty much 90% in office these days.

Yes I’ve earned a high salary up to now but it’s threatened my health and I have no quality of life, so what I want is to leave London, scale down my job and be a bit more present for my children. No idea why this has angered you so much.

@ChickenChitty I think you’re quite right to leave your ridiculously long hours and high pressured job, notwithstanding your brush with death. That sort of thing really makes you evaluate what is most important - if you haven’t got your health you don’t have much. Can’t understand all the posters who fail to see that there’s life, jobs, houses and good schools ‘up north’. In Cumbria, we have just bought a four bed house, study, office, games room, big garden and in good condition - for 475K. By contrast, my friend recently bought a three bed semi in Watford for the same price, no garage, nice area, an hour to get from her house to central London. Carlisle is about 3 hours from London in the train. House prices in Bath are much the same as many parts of London. And if you haven’t family and friends in the midlands/north it seems logical to be near them especially if house prices and jobs fit your criteria. Your dh must realise this, and do his best to accommodate.
Bottom line - your health comes first. Time to make that change!

I need and want to work locally to where we live. I dont want to live or work in London.

So we could literally move to ANY city in the U.K. provided DH could realistically get to London from there.

Well that's quite different to your original dilemma of London v The North and the consequential impact on your husband. If you can in fact move to any city within about an hour of London and find work for yourself there then you don't have a dilemma. Crack on and do it. My picks would be Winchester or Cambridge, because of the extremely high quality sixth forms there (Peter Symonds College and Hills Road).

Yes I would say all fine and dandy - except it doesn’t fit her Hs job at all and I suspect to get a nice enough house that oP is happy with in good school areas , she may well end up paying not far off Surrey money - plus- a load of commuting costs for her H , who isn’t just going to take any job locally -unless you’ve been I. A relationship with a guy who has a specific creative type job but isn’t a high earner it’s hard to explain - they don’t just think ‘oh well’ and get a job ataTesco warehouse,

I think you move North. I've linked to a couple of houses.

York is an expensive city for the North but you could still afford something like this. It is in catchment for Fulford School which one of the top schools in the country. Nothing to do to it. You could go out to one of the villages and probably get more for your money with land, but this seems a good house for someone moving from London. 2 hours to London and within walking distance of the station.
5 bedroom town house for sale in Marlborough Grove, York, YO10

Alternatively you could afford this in Sheffield.
5 bedroom detached house for sale in Kenbourne Road, Nether Edge Sheffield, S7
Great area with shops and cafes and about 15 minutes walk to the city centre. Train also 2 hours ish to London. High Storrs and Silverdale are again some of the top schools in the North, if not the country.

Who said anything about working at Tesco?
He simply swaps his prestigious poorly paid teaching job for another teaching job with less cachet but more hours.
Granted he wont be able to swan around Soho saying hes at cello/drama/fine art teacher at X, but on the plus side the OP wont have a heart attack.